Look, skipping consumables to “save gold” is a shortsighted strategy—especially when
Those consumables aren’t just flashy extras; they’re critical for maximizing your DPS and minimizing the risk of costly wipes. Every incremental DPS boost matters, and when you opt out of using them, you’re not only lowering your own performance but also dragging down the entire raid.
Think about it: if the rest of your guild is fully investing in these consumables and you’re not, you’re effectively disrespecting their efforts. Their gold and time are being wasted because your lack of boosts increases wipe likelihood, which in turn forces the team to spend more resources and time recovering. Instead of “saving” gold, you’re actually burning it by prolonging encounters and contributing to avoidable deaths.
In high-stakes raiding, every fraction of damage counts. Not using consumables not only undermines your own potential but also compromises the entire raid’s progress. So, if you’re determined to skip these buffs to save a few coins, know that you’re also undercutting your team’s overall success.
Games are for fun. If a game is making you feel the way you are right now, then you are playing it for all the wrong reasons. If playing with your friends isn’t enough, the you should indeed step away. I play classic anniversary because its fun to muck around and play with new players , teach people stuff, have absolutely catastrophic events happen in raids or dungeons and have the whole discord screamin for their lives. Its literally a riot. If it feels like a chore, don’t do it.
As much as enhmypants just uses chatgpt to respond in opposition to everyone. You claimed you’re better because of your parses but don’t show them. You even claim ur a top player with top logs but haven’t posted on ur sod character yet to back up these claims. So in the end you’re both stinky and wrong in this silly epeen contest.
This isn’t true. they aren’t critical. They don’t minimize the risk of costly wipes. doing the mechanics does. these items don’t significantly increase dps. i do leaderboard level dps on wow logs without them.
gold and time was being wasted by using them in the first place if we wipe. There’s maybe only 0.01% of times where using every expire on death consume will make a difference and even then you could’ve beaten the boss without them. I refuse to use expire on death consumes during every prog pull because it’s a low-value move. I only use them if it makes sense as in we got the boss down low enough last pull or if we have consistently one shot a boss.
If you use expire on death consumes (besides protection pots and lip type things) for every pull of progression in classic wow, you better have the worlds best gold farm. you’re burning gold.
use a flask, get appropriate protection pots, be enchanted and get a weapon thing. maybe carry around some of the elixirs for pulls where boss is guaranteed to go down. Carry the rest of the items only if you have a boss on farm for the 0.01 chance your parses go up.
Your argument oversimplifies raid progression mechanics and completely disregards the cumulative impact of consumables on efficiency and success.
Consumables do minimize wipes – You claim “doing mechanics does”, but tight enrage timers, DPS checks, and sustain-based fights require every bit of optimization available. Consumables give incremental boosts that prevent bosses from dragging on longer than necessary, reducing overall risk. Saying they don’t make a difference ignores the way extra damage shortens fights, reduces mistakes, and keeps the group in control.
Your gold logic is flawed – You say using consumables is “wasting gold” if you wipe, but you’re more likely to wipe if you don’t use them. If the entire raid adopts your mindset and skips DPS boosts, fights are longer, riskier, and more taxing, leading to more wipes, lost resources, and wasted time. In the long run, not consuming is actually what burns gold, not the reverse.
You’re disrespecting your raid team – If your guildmates are using consumables to maximize efficiency and you refuse to do the same, you’re undermining their investment and wasting their gold and time. You aren’t pulling your weight, and you’re essentially expecting others to carry your lack of optimization.
Your “top parses” claim means nothing if you’re avoiding transparency – If you really outperform everyone without consumables, then let’s see those logs. Posting from a level 60 Human Paladin alt with no raid transparency while making broad claims holds no weight. If you’re confident in your stance, back it up with actual data.
Consumables are a key part of progression, skipping them is selfish and inefficient, and refusing to fully optimize actively hurts your team’s chances at success.
If consumables are truly useless, then post actual raid data proving that skipping them doesn’t impact overall success. Otherwise, you’re just making excuses to cut corners while letting your guildmates carry the burden.
the enrage timer longer. you don’t need insignificant boosts to your dps to make it. you ned th right gear, rotation and execution. The consumes that expire on death are insignificant. they are within the margin of error for wow sims dps.
youre not more likely to wipe if you don’t use expire on death consumes. The dps boost is insignificant
youre disrespecting your raid team by consistently burning through gold on pulls
its not a broad claim. you can simulate the loss of a raid item like dragon breath chili on any character versus not having it. its within the margin of error.
only certain consumables are part of progression. skipping the frivolous ones like dragon breath chili & the badlands ones is smart way to preserve gold without damaging your dps in a significant way.
Your argument dismisses the tangible benefits of consumables while failing to acknowledge the larger impact they have on raid efficiency and overall success.
Enrage timers don’t change the fundamental value of consumables – You claim they are insignificant, but even minor DPS boosts add up over time, especially when fights are closer than expected. If consumables truly made no difference, why do top-tier guilds and progression groups universally use them? Are they all wasting resources, or do you believe there’s a reason high-end players prioritize maximum optimization?
Skipping consumables activelywastes gold more than using them – If wiping is costly, then dragging out encounters unnecessarily is equally wasteful. How is saving gold by skipping key DPS boosters smart when it directly increases raid duration, risks additional wipes, and costs more gold in repairs and lost attempts?
What’s the actual net gold loss from prolonged fights compared to running optimized pulls?
Claiming parses don’t require logs is convenient – You say your performance is “leaderboard level” without consumables, yet refuse to provide logs.
Why not prove it?
If your argument hinges on actual in-game performance, why would posting logs to support your claims not be the simplest way to solidify your stance?
Do you think your personal credibility outweighs the need for proof?
Calling consumables frivolous ignores their collective impact – You singled out Dragonbreath Chili as an example, but that doesn’t represent the full range of buffs available.
Why focus on one consumable while ignoring the stacked benefits of multiple DPS boosters?
How do you justify dismissing a combined optimization strategy that progression groups universally follow?
Avoiding consumables isn’t about being smart with gold—it’s about taking shortcuts at the expense of your team.
If skipping buffs is truly the best strategy, then why do top raiders consistently consume during progression?
If consumables are insignificant, then why won’t you post logs proving they have no impact?
At the end of the day, your argument rests on the assumption that optimization doesn’t matter, while ignoring the actual consequences of prolonged fights, increased wipe risks, and team investment. Until you can provide proof that skipping consumables doesn’t drag down raid performance, this is nothing more than a convenient excuse to avoid fully committing to progression. So, are we backing this up with data, or just doubling down on empty claims?
what tangible benefits are there for the expire on death consumes?
the sims show they barely add any dps as they are within th margin of error and on wow logs they wouldn’t make the difference on 99% of kills.
top tier guilds and progression groups use them because they consistently buy gold or have an excess of gold by clearing content first and having access to recipes and knowledge others don’t. This is not the majority of the player base. they also execute mechanics better and wipe less than the average guild/player.
its also a farce that all top players are using them. Many top tier players don’t use them though during progression. one of the top players of your class shaman and wowhead sod shaman class writer, Lucenia, argues against them during prog.
your dps change from using consumes does not prolong fights meaningfully… you take 99.9% of the top parse and the boss was going to die without expire on death consume.
you might be stuck in a justification of effort because these consumes have ridiculous prices compared to the benefit they provide.
if youre not consistently clearing a boss, don’t use these consumes. they should only be used when 95% of the mechanics are being executed properly.
you should use a flask, enchants and certain weap enhancements that don’t expire on death as well as protection pots/lips so you don’t die. The other stuff is for bosses you one shot
Your argument overlooks the collective impact of consumables while making broad assumptions about their necessity in progression raiding.
Consumables provide tangible benefits beyond raw DPS – It’s not just about squeezing extra numbers; they reduce fight duration, which lowers the chance of errors, minimizes mechanical fatigue, and ensures higher success rates. If these effects were truly insignificant, why do top guilds universally optimize every possible aspect of their output?
Your reasoning on top-tier guilds ignores strategy – You claim high-end players only use consumables because they buy gold or have excess wealth, which misrepresents why serious raiders commit to full optimization. Being first to clear content isn’t just about resources—it’s about execution, preparation, and optimization. If consumables had zero value, why would high-end players keep using them competitively?
Cherry-picking one player’s stance doesn’t disprove the standard – Pointing out one player’s opinion (Lucenia) doesn’t prove that consumables are worthless overall. Many top raiders still use them because they recognize their efficiency. If skipping consumables was truly the superior approach, we’d see broad adoption at the highest levels—but we don’t.
Your parsing argument lacks transparency – If using DPS consumables is meaningless, then show logs proving that skipping them results in no measurable difference in success rate. Without that data, you’re relying on unsupported claims rather than real evidence.
Consumables are part of progression, not a luxury – Saying “don’t use these consumes unless mechanics are fully executed” ignores the reality that mechanics are easier to execute when fights are faster and smoother. Consumables help push a raid past the threshold where execution becomes consistent, rather than dragging it out.
If consumables are truly unnecessary, then where’s the proof? If skipping them doesn’t impact fight outcomes, then show logs comparing full-consume pulls versus consume-free progression. Otherwise, dismissing them as frivolous ignores how every top-end group optimizes their toolkit for maximum success.
At the end of the day, cutting corners doesn’t make you efficient—it just makes you a liability. Are we backing this up with real data, or just continuing to speculate?
take 99% of logged kills and dragon breath chili was not making the difference
95% of the player base can do more dps than they would by using expire on death consumes by executing rotation, optimizing gear and practicing mechanics.
A single consumable isn’t the deciding factor—but collective optimization absolutely influences fight outcomes. Until you provide real data proving that skipping buffs never impacts raid success, this argument remains just speculation.
So, are we going to see actual logs backing up this claim, or just another dismissal with no supporting evidence?
You continue to dodge the actual discussion by shifting focus away from consumables’ impact on progression and refusing to engage with real data.
Consumables provide tangible benefits beyond raw DPS – It’s not just about squeezing extra numbers; they reduce fight duration, which lowers the chance of errors, minimizes mechanical fatigue, and ensures higher success rates. If these effects were truly insignificant, why do top guilds universally optimize every possible aspect of their output?
Avoiding transparency weakens your claims – You’re arguing from a level 60 character with no visible SoD raid logs while making claims about progression that you refuse to back up with proof. If consumables are truly useless, then where are the logs showing that skipping them doesn’t impact kill success rates? Why argue against optimization while actively avoiding transparency about your own raid history?
Skipping consumables actively wastes guild resources – If your guildmates are investing in consumables while you refuse, you’re disrespecting their effort and putting extra strain on the team. Every fight is a group effort, and refusing to fully optimize forces others to compensate for your lack of buffs.
Your gold-saving argument is flawed – You claim using consumables is wasting gold if you die, but if you lack buffs and contribute to wipes, you’re actually wasting even more gold and time overall. Wipes cost raids exponentially more than consumables ever would.
Cherry-picking individual opinions doesn’t disprove the standard – Pointing out one player’s stance doesn’t prove consumables are unnecessary overall. The vast majority of progression raiders still use them because they recognize their value in efficiency. If skipping consumables was truly the best approach, we’d see broad adoption at the highest levels—but we don’t.
Your argument continues to cherry-pick one specific consumable while ignoring the broader impact of multiple buffs used together in raid progression.
A single consumable isn’t the deciding factor—but collective optimization is – No one is arguing that Dragonbreath Chili alone is the difference between a kill and a wipe. The point is that stacking multiple buffs together enhances raid efficiency, leading to shorter, cleaner fights with fewer risks. Why focus solely on one item instead of acknowledging the cumulative effect of optimized consumables?
Dodging the need for actual proof – You claim “take any top log” but then say your own log doesn’t matter, which is just another way of avoiding transparency. If consumables truly make no impact, then why won’t you post your own Season of Discovery raid logs proving it? Without real data, your argument remains nothing more than unsupported speculation.
Still refusing to engage with SoD progression directly – You continue making claims about raid difficulty without providing any SoD raid logs, which raises the question: why avoid posting actual proof from your own experience? If consumables were truly pointless, shouldn’t you have clear raid logs showing kills achieved without them?
1 stacking buffs is fine. but there are certain buffs that cost gold that don’t matter for kills bc they are low value
2. any raid log from season of discovery works, n=1
3. use every raid log. my point stands
Until you back up your claims with verifiable raid logs, this argument remains nothing more than speculation with no supporting evidence. If skipping consumables is truly the best approach, then show real data proving it—otherwise, this is just another excuse for cutting corners.
Are we actually providing proof this time, or continuing to dodge the question?