Can we stop with the whinning and nerfs to X/Y classes?

Like legit please stop asking for nerfs when you don’t know what to do or how to counter X class. You’re just making people spend hours for their characters for nothing and I’m going to quote someone that explained it here way better than I could.

"Hunter main here, I think a lot of people misunderstand Hunter and overly exaggerate their overall power-level. The Hunter class suffers from being really OP on paper (sims) but is mechanically hard to execute in practice.

You will see sims in the Hunter discord showing 4k single-target with P4 BiS and perfect standstill rotation. Your average Hunter isn’t going to hit every trap on a raid boss (esp Rag) and your average raid encounter will rarely allow you to stand still.

A lot of the calls for class changes come from the vocal minority of PvPers on this forum, let’s be honest, most complaints about SoD here are PvP-related even though PvP in SoD has always been an unbalanced niche with a minority of players.

These PvPers come to the forums after getting killed by a Hunter and exclaim how broken they are, how they’re impossible to play against. In reality, you just got hit by a lucky Crit from range while you allowed the Hunter to stand still and build up Crit stacks.

They are immobile glass-turrets with no mitigation, no recovery and CC that has since been greatly nerfed. Now you want to take the one thing away that makes us viable? You guys want Hunter to be cut down to the point where nobody plays them so you don’t have to get good and learn how easy they are to counter. They have more weaknesses than any other class in the game.

You want to be playing WoTLK Rogues, Shaman and Shadow Priests while Hunter is playing vanilla auto-shoot + pet attack and channeling Volley. That’s not even remotely fair. Hunters do one thing good and that’s being an immobile turret that can pump strong damage on AoE and ST under perfect circumstances. The moment bosses start moving out of range, in our dead zone or we can’t land our traps due to the way hit-boxes on large scale mobs work, we lose nearly all of the synergy that makes our powerful.

Meanwhile, no other DPS class has to rely on these specific variable to execute their rotation and utilize their runes. All while having the flexibility in roles and some form of cooldown to protect themselves from death.

The developers aren’t incompetent like people seem to think. The whole idea of Season of Discovery makes for an impossible task of balancing and the Classic team up until now have never had to worry about balance - they were in charge of managing versions of the game that were already developed and had numerous balance patches.

I’ve said this from the beginning, balancing PvP in SoD will always be a nightmare and that’s okay. This is a learning experience for the community and developers. SoD is nothing more than a playground PTR for V+ and the sooner people realize that, maybe they will learn that the game will never be perfect and please everyone.

What do you think happens when you start nerfing classes that really don’t need it? People quit playing them. Hunter mains get upset and quit the game, now you are left with a class imbalance. You will then come to the forums and complain about the next class/spec you perceive as imbalanced and protest for their dismantling.

All of this just to appease a small subset of PvPers that will never be happy no matter what changes occur. When you start nerfing the wrong things, all you do is hurt the experience of the majority that have invested hundreds of hours just to enjoy PvE content.

People seem to forget that balancing around PvP (minority) will always negatively affect the PvE players who’ve invested hundreds of hours into their character because they enjoyed the way it played mechanically.

When they took Frost Trap off the Launcher, I’m not going to lie, I considered quitting. Feeling useful in a dungeon and being able to assist the tank with keeping their trash pack locked in place was a lot of fun. Tanks LOVED bringing a Hunter, especially ones that struggle with AoE threat.

Was it a little OP for Vanilla dungeons? Uhm, yeah? Welcome to Season of Discovery where Warriors can press a button a give the entire party a world buff.

I don’t know why they couldn’t have just put the DR on Entrapment and disabled Launcher rune within BGs. Would’ve made both parties happier."

Link to the original post is here: Very Easy to Fix Hunter - #18 by Jandren-stormscale

Like at this point I’m just going to raid log or stop playing if this keeps going, it’s really upsetting how most people, not everyone but most, are obsessed with hunters and pretty much EVERY CLASS IS BROKEN RN.

Thank you and have a wonderful day/night!

4 Likes

in a hunter’s eyes, he is never overpowered, just that the players he is facing just don’t know how to counter him, it was the same when hunter pets were literally soloing people (the p1 wind serpents), just cc the pet dude wym you deserve to get 3 shot if you don’t

its always this “we will never be viable again” cryfest before the next patch where they are miraculously top dps again despite the hunter experts on the forum telling us its impossible and aggrend hates them

8 Likes

how about no

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If your understanding of what has made hunters outsized in every phase to the point of needing multiple downward adjustments is limited to “a little OP for vanilla dungeons” then you are going to be continually disappointed.

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I think the greater problem is that SoD is very “flavor of the month”

They nerf and buff runes, people just immediately swap to them. Then someone dies to it in PVP and can easily swap to the same rune.

It’s a problem of constant balance changes and the ease at which people can change their character. Every game that does these two things will have large waves of people hopping on trendy characters (even if 10 years later it turns out not actually to be the best for that meta). And a large amount of players will get annoyed and quit because they keep dying to the same thing over and over again. Calls for blood (nerfs) increase in the forums, and the cycle repeats.

  1. How about stop whinning about whinning?

  2. Post on your hunter, coward

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“its always this “we will never be viable again” cryfest before the next patch where they are miraculously top dps again despite the hunter experts on the forum telling us its impossible and aggrend hates them” OHHH so you are saying they get to enjoy 1 week of raiding every phase before they get nerfed back to trash? Yeah, that really makes hunter so great. Wow, you are a genius. “miraculously top dps again” what for 1 week every phase? Then they get nerfed? Wow, that’s so enjoyable. It’s not even on purpose either, it’s just they simply dont know how to balance hunter. People feel like warrior and rogue should be the only top dps classes when hunter is the only pure dps class. Make it make sense what you are saying…

Then how about blizzard get their stuff together and do some got damn testing. Imagine if your class got nerfed 2 weeks into every phase after you got your prebis and just entered raid for 1 week. I’m sure you would feel discouraged too.

They did do testing…:rofl:

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At least the OP used paragraphs ….

Still couldn’t keep my attention to read it all.

Melee hunter and ranged hunter are #1 and #2 on dps this past week.

Almost like they are the only pure dps class in the game, weird how that works.^^^^

Thats not melee hunter. Look much further down on the list, and also look at Beast Mastery.

We’re not looking at sims we’re looking at 95 Percentile. Which is the Standard for checking people who are competent in their classes. After nerfs Hunters hold the number #2 and #3 spot.

Your high if you thinking hunter traps weren’t broken. “let me cast an aoe trap that goes off instant and hits clothies for half their health.”
Zzzzz

I think you don’t know how to play hunter if you think they are immobile lol. Hunter also has high BASE mitigation then every other caster outside of warlock TANK.

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I main enhancement specialization shaman.

We were bad to begin with in Phase 1, then we were made good in Phase 2 with the Alpha rune update half way through the phase, and then Phase 3 saw our survivability and raid tank spec removed by nerfs, and Phase 4 has nerfed enhance and elemental further.

Hunters have been in the top three DPS spots for Damage to bosses for all 4 phases, including after the nerfs. You will find no sympathy here.

The problem isn’t that Hunter’s weren’t too strong, it’s that every other class is just as OP in some unique way.

The other issue that PvP players fail to understand is that they are a nichè minority in SoD. SoD and its community is heavily PvE-focused. The devs have to be careful and keep PvE the priority and focus, you can’t screw over the many to appease the few.

The fact is, Hunter logs on WCL are misleading. WCL for some reason allows Molten Core parses to include trash-padding to the point where we have guilds stacking adds on-top of the boss so that their Hunters, Druids and Warlocks can cheese the logs.

If you actually know how to look at logs, you will see that Assas Rogues are doing the same ST damage as a Hunter’s AoE, if not more. This is a problem. People don’t understand that Hunter’s aren’t OP, the logs are pure padding damage that does not help the raid kill the bosses and in fact makes tanking FAR more stressful.

See my comment above ^

Hunters in P4 have not been anywhere near other specs like Assa Rougue on single-target. Hunter is just really good at padding on adds due to their uncapped AoE.

Many of you just look at graphs without the full context. WCL has never been an accurate source for determining performance and balance.

source: 6/8 T1 Surv / Mm Hunter with Rhock bow + staff.

All classes benefit from the padding even enh(ele runes)

Hunters are also #2-5 on pure single target fights that you cant pad.

2-5 is not imbalanced to the point where you need dozens of forum posts and emergency hotfixes. Keep in mind, these are VERY geared Hunters who got funneled to parse early.

The 99% of Hunters are not over-the-top right now. Most of us hover around 1.5k on ST which is pretty average. Our entire damage profile relies on traps connecting and standing completely still, which isn’t realistic.

Hunter is the biggest sim cheese class in SoD.

Unlike Rogue which is actually mechanically broken and doesn’t rely on janky mechanics to work.

if rogues were doing more st damage than the hunters aoe then the hunters wouldn’t be rank 1, rogues would be, the aoe fights is where the hunters dominate, garr, luci sulf and domo are hunter territory