Can we seriously talk about M+ rating? We need a change

The M+ rating system, Raider io addon, Ilvl, and all the above addons all fail at showing skill level. It is purely a generalized rating that says absolutely nothing about an individual player other than completion.

There is absolutely no risk in this rating system, you never lose rating, only gain rating. If there was a risk that your rating would drop, there would be much less people leaving, because leaving at 5 minutes after a wipe is MUCH more detrimental to your rating, then completing an untimed key.

I highly suggest a loss of rating with different losses based on -3 timer, -2 timer, -1 timer, and a gain for +++3 timer, ++2 timer, ++1 timer, and a more severe loss of rating for leaving. If there is a leaver for Any reason at all, the 4 others in the group should not receive a penalty in rating at all.

That would be sufficient in the short term, But in the long term Rating should expand on MUCH more than completion, Things like DPS, HPS, Damage taken as dps, Damage prevented as tank, Interrupts, and a combination of all elements that make a great player.

Just one Example : A HIGHLY rated DPS, should be able to maintain high dps, with low damage taken, and with a large amount of interrupts.

TLDR;
My take away, There is not a single game out there without risk to rating in terms of competitive gameplay. People Doing high keys have zero risk to their rating, people who leave have no penalty, people who don’t do well, or even try have zero risk to their rating. A system that incorporates Loss, makes the environment surrounding mid to high keys a much better experience because it will prevent leavers, it will keep rated players in their respective rated tier and that alone will prevent toxicity. People who want to climb out of sub 1000 rated mythic rating will either be stuck there (casual gamers) or move higher into more competitive gameplay.

There would also be no one pugging. Your suggestions are down right terrible. We don’t need a MMR system, this isn’t PvP.

Your entire system promotes stagnation and people running keys below their skill level just to boost their “score” with timed runs. It wouldn’t show skill at all. All it would show is who could boost their score the most by spamming +2 keys. People who are pushing high keys would be penalized in return.

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true in the same sense that a hammer fails at cleaning dirty dishes

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Raiderio isnt perfect but its pretty good, and tbh toxicity isn’t really common in high keys, the bar keeps rising to what a high key is but its basically because everyones competent, and mistakes that are made are usually mistakes that anyone could make.

In my opinion the real toxicity (in mid keys especially) is when something goes wrong and no one knows exactly what the problem is so they scapegoat it, this doesnt happen in high keys because everyone knows exactly what is going on.

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I don’t agree with your suggestion at all, though I understand where you’re coming from.

Why I don’t agree is because it’s on the key holder to do their due diligence to check a player’s capability. There are a lot of tools and metrics for players nowadays, sure, and most are very lazy and only look at the info presented in the RIO addon. However, you still have massive amounts of information on them with their RIO page, and their logs. Using both of those you can completely extrapolate and refine the gauge on them.

If you choose not to do that it’s on you.

we need a WLogs score. that’s what we need.

THAT will show skill.

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For M+ it won’t. Numbers will vary wildly from Affixes, group composition, pull sizes, routes, group errors, ect. There’s too many variables in M+ compared to static raids.

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So you make a level 10 and hide your achievements to suggest a radical change to content that most of the game enjoys—because it’s not competitive enough for you? I have a sneaking suspicion that you aren’t playing at the top of the brackets due to your desire to be hidden–so maybe start with becoming the best player in the world if you want harder content, and stop trying to reinvent the wheel.

The entire reason I farm KSM every season is because unlike rated arena, I don’t have to stress about anything. You form, you play, and if the key RIPs–who cares? Go next. If I stand to lose days/weeks of progress because some PUG can’t be bothered to move to the left or right, I’m going to make the social contract light up like the 4th of July, as opposed to being a very pleasant, understanding person to group with like I am now in PVE content.

In theory that is nice, but there is another outcome that you failed mention. This will discourage groups from pushing keys as one person will have to take the loss in points if key can’t be completed. Also it will discourage high rating players help people in low keys as you will be held hostage if key runs don’t go well.

yeah i don’t think the people who want this are thinking it all the way through. in their mind it’s “i want better players to be grouped with me and threatened with punishment for not wanting to finish the run so i can get the loot i deserve”. they’re not considering that there’s no incentive at all for those players to use the system in the first place.

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Yep and it will cause people to be more selective when inviting people to groups. Then the same people who cried about leavers will come here crying that they never get invited to groups

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Congratulations, you would kill pugging with this.

No, you can’t hold people hostage. If you don’t want PUGs leaving then either vet PUGs more throughly or just do keys with friends.

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If you post something like this - you need to do it on your main so people can see your IO score.

I don’t think it’s there to show skill level, it’s there to show your score based on keys you’ve completed.

There are an infinite amount of things that can happen in a key, and measuring a players ‘skill’ in all areas is literally impossible. What can be measured, is what level keys they’ve completed/completed on time.

Would you agree that in general a player with a 3k M+ score would likely better then a player with a 2k IO score? If so, then your point is moot. If not, then you’ve obviously not participated in content that challenging.