Calia Derangement Syndrome

Lore Story Forum
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Seriously ya’ll are just being weirdos. I’m the guy who has an unhealthy attachment to the undead freak parade faction to the point of having actual opinions on which races taste better, and I’m calling you weird, and I’m right!

That Forsaken quest was absolutely crackerjack. I’ve seen no substantive complaints. The main one is Blizzard’s devil may care, completely scattershot approach to their magic schools have remained as such. And that Calia is there.

Calia was fine in that story. She knew her place as an outsider and quite literally asked the Forsaken if it was cool if she hung out in Lordaeron. Nobody trusts her, not even Voss, and her only impact on the story was selflessly helping the Forsaken. What a villain.

Theres some talk of a letter to Genn. But if you actually played the storyline you’d know there is no way in Hell Belmont is taking marching orders from Calia. So either that letter was a political lie told by Calia to Genn to purchase goodwill while sacrificing absolutely nothing. Or it was just another example of Blizz having different people write different stories in different rooms on different stages of development.

I’d bet it’s probably option B. But Blizz should just pretend it’s A because that makes Calia more interesting.

And Calia desperately needs to be more interesting. None of the gripes I’ve had for the character, or more aptly the lack thereof, have gone anywhere. This storyline didn’t make me suddenly like her. But they used her about as well as they could.

Personally at time of writing if there’s no plan to goth up the gal I say just have her on hand to be an ambassador to Alliance toons.

The Forsaken have had a lack of spotlight because they’re fairly niche. Those that love the Forsaken understand they’re a nice crossroads between the strangely dark wholesomeness of the Addam’s Family and the slapstick by way of gore vibes of Sam Rami. It’s just not for everyone.

Those who don’t think they’re grim, groaning edgelords and thusly naturally assume the presence of Calia inherently ruins everything.

When the presence of a straight man would actually be pretty good for their shtick. Both internally as we can at least have Faranel shoot a knowing look to camera when she’s freaked out by whatever crime against humanity he’s sewing together at 11am on a Wednesday.

And good externally because I’ve had to read entire essays about how the Hillsbrad questline personally ruined the lives of the innocent MHP mains that played it. So fine, here’s some sparkly Edward Cullen chick who’s smooth, unblemished and glowing from within with an arresting light to hand you a quest so you don’t get PTSD from something straining the PG13 rating.

Now don’t get me wrong here it could be disastrous if they make Calia the only Forsaken character anyone ever interacts with.

But having a token girl scout to go smile and wave at the humans who have the audacity to breathe in Lordaeron is actually a good idea. And that’s what the questline seems to suggest will be her purpose moving forward.

Anything to the contrary is hypothetical doomsaying.

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Voss is one million percent in Calia’s corner. She has been since Calia’s return. She has been hinting at Calia’s leadership since her return. She makes certain the other members of the Council listen to Calia. In her opinion, they have no right to disregard or ignore her voice.

And Calia’s first move on the council?
To give Genn Greymane an attack position to wipe out the Forsaken from.
Brilliant.

I get the feeling you tell yourself this a lot.

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Please point to where I’ve been wrong before.

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tbh fam i don’t pay a whole lot of attention to everything you say.
you make funny jokes and i like the funny jokes.
thanks for funny jokes.

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I’ll happily eat my words if I’m wrong down the line but I said for years Calia wasn’t an existential threat to the Forsaken. Seemed like a weird character left over from some (mercifully) bygone plot who we were going to be saddled with.

Which we were. But rather than being an annoying embarrassment they had her do some badass ish like tell Alliance players to their face that Lordaeron belongs to the Forsaken.

This questline made Forsaken haters rage quit. And people who can only hate the setting at this point similarly seethe as you’ve to invent hypothetical situations to get mad about.

I’ve never once been stingy with my scorn when Blizz poops the bed. But they didn’t here. They did a good job. And I’m just seeing the terminally aggrieved grasp at straws.

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Seriously I feel like I’m taking crazy pills here.

I cannot stress enough that this Forsaken quest ruled so ruthlessly that their biggest haters rage quit. That on it’s own should tell you how ridiculous the complaints are. Idk who wrote this but they should engrave every bereaved MHP comment and point to it when people question their direction for the Forsaken.

Blizz did nothing substantially wrong.

Was the bit with Sindal kinda weird? I guess. Was it weirder or dumber than literally anything else in Shadowlands? Absolutely not.

We just had to stop Goth Mr.Clean from rebooting reality and ya’ll are complaining about a sentence confirming Calia is indeed undead. Get a job at a sideshow because you’re a clown if that’s what bothers you about this storyline.

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This thread seems like a reaction to something… but I am not sure what. Most of the Calia derangement was prior to Tuesday. Now, things are less hypothetical, and more set in stone. I dont see alot of complaints. It may be one of the better received story bits in a while.

I mean, if that really bugs people, there is a good chance that she was being a bit egotistical and full of bluster by saying “no one knows more about necromancy or undeath than me.” By even saying that, it could be a hint that she may be overconfident in her level of knowledge. She may not be as well informed as she thinks.

I see wiggle room.

Sure. Why not? I always preferred The Addams Family, but The Munsters had Marilyn, so there is precedent in monster comedy for such a role.

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Read the “Calia as Sylvanas 2.0” thread if you’re really curious.

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I’ve actually seen this elsewhere like in some fantasy groups I orbit who also like WoW.

And I really didn’t picture myself passionately defending Blizz, much less Calia, but they genuinely did everything right this time.

I have mentioned time and again how my only emotion in anticipation for this quest was apprehension. My most liked topics are all the ones where I completely savaged Blizz’s handling of the Forsaken or formerly Forsaken characters.

And I really have nothing but thumbs up here. I cannot get over how unapologetically in favor of the Forsaken this was. We’ve two outright villainous characters on the council who stay in character the whole time. Calia does nothing else but prove how she’ll be useful for the Forsaken and be quiet and let the proper deaders lead. And they made Lodebros dress up as the undead and help the Forsaken take back Lordaeron while the only standing Menethil tells them they will never have this.

I’ve never been coy about my vitriol Blizz, especially when they mishandle my beloved Forsaken, so I’m not going to be stingy with praise either.

This was completely solid.

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The thread where most folks express general satisfaction with the quest line while pointing out a handful of red flags?

Because that doesn’t seem to warrant the level of vitriol on display here.

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There are two threads like that, but the one Zuleika linked leans more on the perceived red flags.

But as I said over on that thread. If those red flags are real, they are also a bit exciting.

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Idk fam. I’d be down if a member of the Forsaken wasn’t selling the Forsaken out.
Again.

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Give it time. It has a lot going for it. Not many people care enough at this point to make a stink about how it seemed to just. Give the Forsaken Lordaeron back with no conflict from the Alliance that still has living Lordaeronians in it, and are occupying lands in Lordaeron and rebuilding them, like Southshore. It let Forsaken do things beyond what was possible in their lore, so it is naturally gonna appeal to the people who just want them to get wins. It also had no spoilers, and some people just want to believe that blizz is better now. And of course to top it all off, Horde is the vast majority of the remaining community, and this caters almost exclusively to them. But given enough time for some of the initial excitement to die down, people may become more critical. Or move on and not care.

Personally, I still don’t think Calia was a great choice. But I can just understand why that’s overshadowed by getting Lordaeron back and having so many ‘fist in the air’ moments in this questline. (hoping one day blizz lives up to years of promises to give that to other races in the lore, but they’re alliance so we will see lmao…)

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Apologies if I’m a bit heated. This is oversharing but I’ve had some 14 carat runs of bad luck with my loved ones. Of the chemotherapy variety and both are under 30.

Really shouldn’t be this venomous toward other people. But I suppose I’m a little defensive about one of the few things that’s actually put a smile on my face this year.

And I’m really not seeing much heat from Forsaken fans. I’m kinda tired of seeing;

“Alright well this was bad, actually, and if I let my imagination run wild I’ll explain how hypothetically hope crushing this might be”

I guess I’m confused. This is allegedly our world of pretend. Tolkien likened the fantasy genre to a prisoner of war trying to escape. This actively expanded on the Forsaken’s story. It’s a step in the right direction and as it seems they might actually be reading through this stygian pit I do want to make a note of it when they actually do something well.

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There’s a huge difference between two individuals that are currently on a probationary period than actual members of the Forsaken. I mean, the real movers and shakers within the Forsaken Council aren’t even interested in doing what either of those two say, and Calia and Derek’s biggest, and possibly only cheerleader, is a spy and assassin that specializes in getting close to people like Calia in order to take them down if need be.

And before anyone else says anything. I’m not talking about the quality or intent of the writers. I’m talking about the potential of such a storyline in the right hands.

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Oh no, I’m so sorry. I hope your luck turns around soon.

I had tons of reservations about Calia, both about her relationship with the Forsaken and as a character in general, but this questline did a lot to relieve them. I liked seeing her express her self-doubt and insecurities about whether she could ever belong in Forsaken society. I liked how she didn’t fault the Forsaken for their mistrust or uncertainty about her, and how she expressed that she was determined to try to help as long as she was allowed to, even if she never personally gained their trust or acceptance. I liked that her feelings about her family are complex and that we addressed them a bit. I really liked that she didn’t separate the Menethil legacy from Arthas’ deeds, and that she’s the heir to that history as well, not just the good parts that people remember about Terenas. In fact, I could see that leading to a good character motivation for her deeds going forward. Maybe she abandons the Menethil name because of the bloodshed associated with it, or maybe she keeps it and decides to build a new legacy for herself by devoting herself to helping the people her brother so viciously slaughtered and subjugated

I also really liked that at the end, Lilian seemed to have more of an interest in Calia just as a person rather than because of her name or royal status. Consistent with her recent character arc of wanting to help other Forsaken deal with their trauma, Lilian checks in on Calia in the throne room just to make sure that she’s doing okay, knowing that she hasn’t been there since her father’s murder. It felt like Lilian’s support of her isn’t just about politics or royalty, but rather that Lilian also feels sympathy for her pain and wants to show her compassion, just as she has been trying to do with other undead recently.

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I’m sorry homie. I lost my mom to cancer when I was a kid. It’s beyond rough. I hope that your family’s cancer falls into remission if not wholly, utterly surgically removed.

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I think it honestly comes down to interpretation of the story on an individual basis. Some folks saw ‘The Pallid Lady’ and seeing that as a parallel to Sylvanas’ moniker was enough to justify the way they saw Calia’s characterization.

Some saw more by reading between the lines, or just in general picking up things they didn’t quite like. Calia has gotten heat for a long time prior to this, so for some fans (particularly Sylvanas fans) it feels like a weak replacement of their once beloved character and I’m sure they’re looking for reasons to push their disappointment of Sylvanas’ fate on this new ‘replacement’. Even after the BtS novel, the gripe of ‘Lightforged Undead’ was something people raged about but it was never actually a thing. (at least, yet.)

Even just Calia’s presence puts a shoe in the door for Blizzard to slowly put her at the front of the Forsaken to some people, so I don’t think that opinion will rest unless they get rid of her completely which likely won’t happen for the foreseeable future.

FWIW, I personally quite liked the questline, I did it on both my Alliance and Horde mains and liked the nuances between the two. There’s definitely room for improvement in certain aspects but it’s a generally positive opinion overall from what I’ve read in other spaces. They MAY build up Calia in the future, but it was vague enough that it could go either way. I’m taking it as a win for now, and will cross the ‘Calia bridge’ if it ever comes.

I’m really sorry to hear that, that must be insanely stressful. I know the forum can get a bit vitriolic at times to add to those outside stressors, but it’s definitely worth shining light on the fact that all of us are just nerds yelling about a video game, and in the end they are just opinions. Stick to your guns, and if all else fails, it’s always something you can log out of and take a mental break from for the sake of your mental health if it feels overwhelming.

I do really hope things improve though, that’s never something anyone should have to go through.

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I think it’s a reaction to us.

We are the wierdos.

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I feel the same way. I try to post about things I enjoy, because I know I post about things I dislike. Praising and defending something you like is understandable. The tone of the OP caught me a bit off guard, because it seemed a bit heavy handed.

I do see some negative reactions, but I think they are coming from corners that likely never had the best interest of the Forsaken as a priority - basically the few complaints I see are self serving interests, and they pale in comparison to the praise.

Yeah, I guess it is easier for me to understand that sort of vitriol in the midst of a debate, midthread. But as its own thread, I was curious what set it off.

As you say - no substantive complaints.

This is a minor quibble at best. I understand why it would be discussed by the fans. It was a curious moment. It leaves questions because it tries too hard to shut down debate :

Margrave Lady : “I know more than everyone and the differences are only in your mind.”

That isn’t a satisfactory answer for many. I can understand why people looked at it side ways. It is a minor quibble, worthy of discussion -but not a stain on the quality of the questline.

She is divisive. Alot of Alliance fans hate her because she was the hope of Alliance claiming Lordaeron as she sat in the background - her work towards securing Lordaeron for the Forsaken might feel like a slap in the face. But again, those types of fans hardly had the interests of the Forsaken at heart.

Others hate her because she comes bearing the stink of Alliance and Anduin. That is understandable and it will be hard to overlook. Only time and more story/events can smooth that over. I think Blizz did a good start.

Again, that seems to be mostly coming from Alliance Players who are angry that they might be getting Gilneas back peacefully, instead of chasing the Forsaken out in a humiliating route.

Just on the surface, that sounds petty enough to disregard. Almost as if they are not concerned with Gilneas at all. And more concerned with pay back.

There are some Horde fans who say : “who is she to promise Gilneas to the Alliance, or dictate military operations?” That has some merit as a question… but it isnt a bad idea if the Forsaken want peace, and to be left alone.

I see these complaints and understand where they come from, but they seem like minor quibbles at best. At worst, they are examples of outright biased antipathy towards the Forsaken for getting anything positive - and that can be disregarded or laughed at.

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