even played by some of the best BrM, it is highly healer reliant especially in m+. it can survive but your healer needs to be very good. since they’re handling you, as well as everyone else also getting pounded really hard by constant AoE damage this season. The others don’t need as much babysitting
Thanks for showing that a shieldblock-like mechanic added to stagger can be balanced, since you’ve just explained that a shieldblock-like mechanic is already in the game and apparently is balanced, at least based on the devs not removing the mechanic.
And since they’ve already done it once, how hard can it be to do it again?
You’re really good at disproving your own arguments!
Change stagger to ignore pain it fits the class fantasy of feeling less pain while being drunk. Obviously there would need to be other reworks but stagger always has issues with balance.
Change the stat priority around so that haste is the best stat.
Give monks a haste buff for the group or raid called mystic touch.
Change ring of peace back to the old version.
Make the group movement speed buff baseline.
Make clash baseline.
Your argument was for it to stop a fixed amount of damage which block hasn’t don’t since cata. It was changed from a fixed block amount to a % reduction precisely for the reason I stated stagger wouldn’t be balanceable if it were changed to that. As it is now, it functions similarly to block except there is no stagger chance and the damage is delayed instead of mitigated entirely. So I don’t see how they would add a shield-block like mechanic to stagger when stagger already functions like shield block.
2 Likes
Just make it like shield block 
Interesting idea. During raids, the big hits come relatively spaced out to the point where you can easily purify any large hit quickly after taking it. In M+, trash mobs can stack up so much stagger that purifies can simply be an issue to maintain.
What if they did something like “if you have been in heavy stager for more than X seconds, your damage taken is reduced by X % until you drop to medium stagger”
Basically this would rarely be active on bosses, and it could be set to only be beneficial during the times where you simply cannot drop stagger fast enough.
I had no idea about any of this. I don’t really pay attention to how many black out kicks I’m doing. That’s kind of crazy if that’s the expectation of playstyle they want with brew. If black out kick is supposed to be the bread and butter of brewmaster they are doing a really poor job of showing people
I really hate the talents that make you want to stay in higher stagger for the increased stat gain. They just promote intentionally holding purifying brew. It’s always felt wrong to me, like holding shield block.
I think this is primarily because of blackout combo, which those looking for an easier play style probably forgo.
I mean, stagger in m+ is that you can’t purify it fast enough and eventually you either die or get a ToD off.
Would like to see mastery increase the % of stagger removed by Purifying Brew and give you an absorb based on stagger removed. In raids it doesn’t matter, but it would help with self sustain a lot in m+
Would you trade Crit or Vers for Mastery in that situation?
Stagger doesn’t really need a rework and suggesting a complete overhaul of the mechanic or it’s outright removal kind of misses the core of the problems imo
Brewmaster’s largest problem is that we have few universally applicable CDs to cycle through pack-to-pack in dungeons and the ones we do have are either weak (CB) or relatively long cooldowns (DH/FB), so we run out of CDs then run out of purifies then just fall over. We have 0 AoE scaling compared to other tanks where in the past CDR that scaled with target count or other forms of AoE scaling existed. Adding those to the tree in easily attainable places along with something like Generous Pour to augment CB for M+ would go a significant distance in buffing us in AoE without having any noteworthy effect on our perceived status as a good raid tank, without requiring a massive rework to a system or removal of the spec’s most defining feature. Buffing Niuzao into a respectable defensive and/or re-adding Fundamental Observation (preferably the legion version, with ZM becoming baseline) would also help.
I like Riyyah’s idea of an absorb based on stagger removed but that’s also kind of just Elixir of Determination, which should see a buff considering it’s the weakest pseudo-cheat available to tanks. Doesn’t need to be its initial 100% value, but it needs to be significantly more than what it currently is. Honestly should be at least 50% recently purified/~12% max health minimum, though I feel it could go higher without being entirely busted. Or make it stronger, move it to where Ox Stance is, get rid of the crappy sub-capstones for Ox Stance and move OS up to where EoD is. Doesn’t change much for most builds but honestly initial 100% EoD felt more capstone worthy than Ox Stance.
idk how you want blizzard to “show” people about their rotation, people think spirit bomb isnt good for vdh and blizzard doesnt “show” how good it is. its just good in large pulls cause its not target capped by soulcleave. theres alot of guides that shows your rotation, i suggest reading those instead of blaming blizzard 
i do agree its a excessive amount of kicks tho
Yea I’d almost think they should lower the amount of kicks cuz 17 per minute with everything else is crazy
not the expectation, like is said earlier in the thread it isn’t possible to do max cpm in a key environment due to the responsibility of other buttons being required at certain times as well as things like grouping packs etc youll never see max cpm on logs even from a near perfect performance.
realistically in a key you’ll aim for 14.5-15 cpm, 14-14.5 is a lot easier to replicate per key than 15 and still nets you exceedingly high damage
are we talking about ptr or live? cause in ptr with the tier set you could do 17. unsure if thats realistic. probably not and the limit will be 14-15