But to do that, someone had to do the go go go go in order to get the key to a higher lvl… Then be willing to let their key get downgraded after doing all the work to build it up.
That is because you are a man of culture, my friend. I, too, miss Magister’s Terrace.
I feel as though they’ve really abandoned 5-Mans this time around. Not just by making any form of non-mythic dungeon irrelevant, but also by having released two raids and a mini raid without a single additional 5-Man being added. 
I agree, it totally breaks the general fantasy dungeon immersion just speeding through on a timer. I’m sure they could cater to people who like both while keeping the rewards somewhat balanced. For example maybe timed m+ could just have a greater chance at loot upgrading? Failing a keystone and dropping loot amount is too punishing and the timer has made friends who used to love doing dungeons completely avoid them.
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My “prob” is that I don’t enjoy timers and miss the old way of doing 5 mans. I’m not sure how your solution fixes that.
M+ ain’t going anywhere. People are now convinced that this AARPG system was like the best thing ever added to the game.
If you want a real MMO Classic is coming, just wait for that.
WoW is basically an amalgamation of Diablo systems and remnants of a MMO.
They love this design because people just run the same content over and over for an entire expansion.
I see this coming for raids too.
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I already played classic, raided since then. I want new content, dungeons and experiences.
5 mans are more relevant now than they have EVER been in the history of this game. If you look back to other expansions 5 mans became irrelevant as soon as you outgeared them… They had to put tokens or some other garbage in them for higher level gear just to get people to run the things. I don’t want to go back to that model. It sucked.
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I definitely hate the timed nature of m+ however i cant really think of a way for it to have the same increasing difficulty and replayability without the timer.
However the esport mentality in an mmorpg in general is bad for the game imo
Yeah, there is an audience for Mythic, but it’s not for me. I want my Normal and Heroic dungeons back, and I want the loot to be relevant. Timers and countdowns for a casino chest have no place in this game, in my opinion.
Mythic0 is what heroic dungeons used to be, and their loot is as relevant as it always were, pre-raid loot.
Mythic0- 370
Normal raid- 385
Wotlk heroic- 200
Naxxramas- 213
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There is a massive 5 man, as close to the vanilla style 5 man, coming in the next patch.
Legion amd BfA are the only 2 expacs to make longer, vanilla like dungeons.
TBC only released 1 extra dungeon and it was with the last tier.
At this point in Wrath we would be in Ulduar, no extra dungeom yet.
Cata we would have had 2 revamped troll dungeons.
MoP and WoD nothing.
Legion had return to Kara, so a similar style mega dungeom released a bit earlier.
Isn’t there another 5 man dungeon coming 8.2 that is supposed to be mythic only and similar in size to revamped Kara?
Something I am not a fan of being Mythic only. Not sure why they gotta have all of these MYthic only dungeons didn’t the backlash from Legion tell them anything when they released mythic only Kara and those Nightbourne Dungeons?
For raids, only the boss fight is considered the encounter. Those definitely have a timer.
For m+, the entire dungeon is considered the encounter. So having a timer is the same thing.
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I really like M+ and rushing the timers through affixes and scaling difficulty. I really love tackling difficult content. And the M+ set up scratches that itch for me the same way that mythic raiding does.
But I hear what you are saying. I would love for there to also be other kinds of hard level 5 man dungeon content that wasn’t necessarily rushing a timer.
I used to really enjoy the long challenging dungeon runs back in classic and BC way back in the day.
I liked when you actually had to use better strategy for pulling. You get some of that in M+ for sure when you are at a level where it’s actually hard for your team. But it’s not quite the same as some of the earlier set ups because it’s also been made to do against a timer.
I’d love for them to make hard content that wasn’t made for M+ that allowed you to tackle it with a team at your own pace, but that really did test your limits, and have it be available in addition to M+.
Not every challenge has to be against a timer.
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4 expansions have had 5 man content with timers and 4 have not. I doubt M+ is going anywhere so by next expansion we’ll have more expansions with timed 5 man dungeons than not.
So are you sure you want to go there to try to shift the goalpost of the following claim?
You decided to post 5 days after the last comment only to make a point that’s entirely fallacious. /slowclap
Side note, challenge mode content was cosmetic. We were talking about progression paths. Which means your claim is wrong too.
Absolutely agree with OP. If I try to use CC or do anything other than pull everything in visual range as fast as possible, I get all-caps screaming. I miss when you had to take your time, use a strategy, pool crowd control, focus fire. You know, work together, rather than just supply a target cluster for everyone to DPS race on.
I can’t wait for the chill pace of Classic. I am not a modern WOW hater, I’ve enjoyed BFA. But I am so hype for the slower, methodical nature of the Vanilla experience.
Post does not disappoint.
+1, deserves more.
I don’t play D3 for a reason.
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Try telling that to the people I’d bring along for a chance at the raven lord mount during BC. So many deaths.
Sorry, I recall a lot of wipes in heroic dungeons during BC, Wotlk, and Cata (pre-cata dungeon nerf) when those were current content. Entire groups used to bail in heroic deadmines before the first boss lol
Instead of Mythic, why didn’t Blizz just keep Challenge Mode Dungeons? Mythics are the same thing with a different name and more generic rewards.