Blizzard, Please consider some Holy Pally Changes

Classes Paladin
1

Holy does not work with the whole “Generator/Spender” thing, it really clashes with being a healer. The first time they tried to do this, it didn’t work then, and it sure as hell doesn’t work now, especially without ANY quality of life changes to actually GENERATING said Holy Power.

It is extremely mana taxing to generate Holy Power, and our spenders are quite underwhelming, which, granted, will change with virtual steroids we will get in Shadow Lands, but the issue here is not the numbers, it’s the design/feel.

Healing is situational, and Holy is already bad at “Situational”. We are great in stacking fights, we are awful in spreading fights, thanks to our proximity mastery, and weird “melee healer damage reducer” theme. And we can NOT always have a stack of Holy Power just ready and waiting for massive Damage waves, we have 0 reliable AoE at this point. Holy Prism is mediocre, and Light of Dawn is gated behind 3 Holy Power. It’s unreliable, and it’s clunky.

There are a few easy quick fixes which are kind of a band aid to this piss poor design, which i know blizzard LOVES, but ultimately I’de like to see some class redesign.

Fix 1, Judgement needs to generate a Holy Power For HOLY. It’s done it for ret for ever, and it needs to do it for Holy. Simple as that. Why do we have the SAME EXACT SYSTEM, but LESS WAYS TO GENERATE EFFICIENTLY>!>!?!?!

I can’t just spam heal my beacon target, it takes too much time, and too much mana. And i can’t always be in melee range, PLUS AGAIN, spamming crusader strike, is very mana consuming for HOLY. So, I feel Judgement, REALLY needs to generate Holy Power, just like it does FOR RET.

You could give this same treatment to lets say, maybe even Holy Prism.

Or other option is make Light of Dawn a GENERATOR and not a spender, and leave everything else be. We wouldn’t need more ways to generate if this wasn’t a spender. I’de be A OK with only have Word of Glory as a spender, and everything else as a generator.

Ultimately, i really don’t think this even works for Holy as is, but, if it’s going to be forced upon us, Please for the love of the spec, give us some quality of life changes to reduce the unreliability and clunkiness we face now.

We CANNOT keep relying on virtual steroids to make up for class design blizzard… The covenant and legos, or whatever else you bring in WILL NEVER make up for clunkiness and situational unreliability. You can’t just keep beefing numbers to make up for that… So i’de really like to see a change instead of a number buff.

8 Likes
2

I’m against judgment generating Holy Power, with it, it pushes holy back into being a range healer & there are plenty of options for that out there; every other healer class.

What blizz need to are extremely simple

make Consecration generate 1 Holy Power & Heal allies inside it, and if they move out of it they receive a HoT for the reminding duration of Consecration. And all heals done to some1 within consecration generates 1 Holy Power or an additional Holy power.

Make Judgement give Holy Pally a buff that similar to Zeal as a baseline for Holy, Judgement increases next 5 auto attack by 30% and the next 5 auto attack or Crusader Strike heals 75% of the party for 200% of the potential damage done. This way it would be 3 ppl in 5 man grp, while around 15 ppl in 20min grp; and since its potential damage, it doesn’t leach so shields & immunity doesn’t stop it from healing.

3

its not always feasible to be in melee generating holy power especially when youre avoiding mechanics. judgment would benefit from generating holy power when avoiding mechanics or any time you need to be away from the target

4 Likes
4

I’ve said it before that holy power attached to the holy spec is basically a slap on feature that doesn’t add any depth to the playstyle just hampers it, of course that being said I do like the idea of holy power, holy just needs to be rebuilt from the ground up to make it work. For example our spenders both cost three HP why can’t we have a one to three aspect to them, or atleast another spender like eternal flame.

7 Likes
5

I would love for Eternal Flame to return.

6

Yeah I guess sense undead was higher on the pally fantasy then a beneficial heal.

1 Like
7

Sense Undead is clearly going to be the new meta in M+.

1 Like
8

Well this didn’t age well

1 Like
9

Why exactly?

10

Because now that alot of players have adjusted to the changes they are preforming far better then initially anticipated.

11

I have not adjusted to the changes. I miss ranged holy… I feel like they stole a whole spec from me… If they were going to change holy this much they should have added a 4th spec.

2 Likes
12

Performance and fun are two different things. The complaint threads ive seen around here usually complain about how they dont enjoy it well and that judgement needs to build holy power thats a pretty big one too.

13

I happen to really like how Holy plays. Melee healer is a niche that I think Blizzard should continue to embrace. I think its a challenge though because there needs to be a strong incentive to stay in melee, right now its damage and HP generation. If either get nerfed Holy will be a dead spec.

As it stands I can time the same key as a healer with about equal gear on my paladin or my shaman, but my paladin does more than twice as much damage, which is appropriate because my pallys HPS is lower than my resto shaman.

I think Paladin’s troubles are mostly in raid environments. I HATE raid-healing as Holy. Mythic+ is great though.

14

My point still stands, people where completely hounding on hpally’s performance as well. This is a necro’d thread after all.

15

Honestly I’m gonna through this out here : Mana being a thing outside of PvP is some counter-intuitive designing that they’ve kept over the years.

Only spells that actually generate a cost, outside of Arcane mages because thats half their mechanics, is Healing spells.
It makes sense that Druids, Shamans, Paladins, Monks and Priests, to have a limited healing supply outside of their Healing specs, as you are no longer focused on it.
It makes sense that your damaging abilities as a DPS don’t actually use mana as you’ve specialized into using them efficiently, so why gate PvE content with a timer (however long it takes the healers to oom) instead of based on skill and spec/gear like DPS and Tanks.

Or if they want to keep mana as a time gate, remove offensive spells from using mana, to bring parity between specs of a class; we’ve seen this happen with them re-adding Consecration to Ret paladins after removing it in WoD iirc.

16

I actually like the holy power changes.

I find hpal one of the most mama efficient healers, if CSing off cool down and limiting flashes and maximising glimmer and only using divine toll on big aoe damage.

Also with the amount of dps that you can do I think hpal has a perfect niche, and completely unique to every other healer.

2 Likes
17

I have said it over and over and over again…

  • bring back Holy Radiance from Cataclysm. It would fix our healing in a big way. Basically a paladin’s Prayer of Healing that generates holy power. So for aoe you spammed it and spended with Light of Dawn

  • Bring back the Daybreak passive: holy light and flash of light have a 20% chance to make your next holy shock not trigger a cooldown.

  • Bring back the cast reduction effect to Infusion of Light.

I think these 3 aditions would improve our aoe healing and not make us forced to be in melee range.

2 Likes
18

problem i have with holy is that it doesnt heal enough in 5 man where just you and the tank gets light of dawn and the other hunters dont get any healing.

i say let spend holy power healing spells at 1, 2 or 3 healing power. so we can do a quick holy shock and a heal and a crusader and a heal.

right now if the entire group is taking heavy dmg i cantt save them. what do i do exactly? holy shock for 10% of their hp which doesnt make a difference, then stop healing and do crusader strike for 2 gcd while 1 guy already dies then cast a word of glory at guy number 3 while guy number 4 still hasnt gotten any heal lmao!

19

I’m going to assume that the scenario is “Massive Pull Gone Wrong”

  1. Wings + Divine Toll
  2. Devotion Aura Mastery
  3. Sac + Bubble
  4. Light of the Martyr
  5. Lay on Hands
  6. Blessing of Protection

You can bubble + Sac tank + LoH one member + BoP another, LOTM spam until HS/Divine Toll or something comes up. If you’re running Shock Barrier you should be using it on CD to build HP so you start pulls with 5 HP (Mana is no issue)

With beacon you can more or less ignore healing the tank (if they’re rollin’ CD’s) and focus on members and beacon healing will keep the tank healthy alone.

20

i dont know, i mained holy back in legion and it was so much better with just direct high healing instead of having to faff around with the melee gimmick to farm holy power. the cd you mentioned are mostly 2+ minutes. back in legion all you do is put up beacon of virtue and do holy shock and holy light since infusion of light makes your holy light really fast. didn’t have to use any cd for sustain high party aoe healing.

I just don’t see how the current pally is better at healing comparing to legion one.

currently it takes longer to get heals out, and the heals dont heal enough.