Bfa survival is awful

Classes Hunter
85

Survival compared to arms, flat out arms wins hands down every time and there’s no way around it.

Outlaw’s main problem in pvp is the fact that your Dispatch and sinister strike’s(main damage) hit like wet noodles even with the stacked azerite trait and your big damage burst actually comes from the in between the eyes into proc pistol shot set up into a killing spree. Im guessing the mitigation comes from pvp and armor where to fix that would be giving outlaw something to increase damage like the debuff ghost strike and make it baseline. In pve their top tier.

Survival’s problems are deeper than just making something baseline and lacks what it needs to survive in melee range against other melee in order to do its damage. its funny how they bring back the serpent sting explosive shot play but in the form of grenades just for it to be where it is now there’s no need for this spec to be melee.

1 Like
86

I said that it’s a mash of Outlaw and BM is because both Outlaw and SV have a number of ranged mechanics despite being melee. Sin’s got some utility through poisons, but Outlaw is a better analog mechanically. SV is actually more BM than BM thematically. That said, neither are correct, nor is comparing it to Sin, though I don’t have enough time on UH (the other Melee Pet Spec) to say anything about it. Honestly DK’s kinda bore me at the moment.

SV is meant to bounce in and out of melee range, not just stay in. It’s more akin to jousting in Vanilla. Outlaw doesn’t quite have the style of play, but it’s fairly comparable mechanically with the right talent. It’s funny how they completely ignored the feedback in Legion and gave us some tools to place in an unusual style of play. How many melee Specs have the ability to pop out to range to deal with mechanics or kite melee with effective damage. I am not just talking about an expanded range on melee abilities, I’m talking about using a gimmick mechanic that lets makes the main melee ability into a ranged one making for an options others do not have.

3 Likes
87

You just described like 95% of the PVE hunters in WOW: if you were playing a hunter before WOD, there was a very good chance you were a SV hunter.

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88

i completely understand the play style of melee survival and compared to the range survival, the melee is completely clunky. It’s a mess.

Survival in vanilla was never about melee, and playing from since then i never understood where this concept of a melee hunter came from other than rexxar, and he’s a beast master hunter.

we have to be honest the ranged damage isn’t effective as it should be and the aspect of the eagle is weak for a 1.5 minute cool down. It should be 1 minute.

again aspect of the eagle is weak. Overall playing survival hunter feels as if you’re playing a ranged classed that’s forced to be melee for the sake of it.
the difference between survival and other melee specs is that the other melee specs have what it takes to come out on top within melee range or even ranged all the hunter specs need some help in the kiting department.

1 Like
90

Not when you’ve been rooted or have someone on the run in pvp. My caster/ranged buddies hate dueling me on my SV Hunter because I can maintain pressure in melee and range. I’m not sure why people discount the flexibility of being able to deal substantial damage at both melee and range, but it can be very advantageous. Especially considering the fact that an SV Hunter’s single target melee damage is usually more substantial than most other melee classes.

3 Likes
91

Ranged survival was the least played hunter spec of the 3, it only saw majority play in a few patches when it’s damage was completely broken.

It’s “core” audience was you and 4 other smucks that herpaderp about the forums whining about the 2 patches in 15 years where it saw play.

3 Likes
92

Want to know why people are not really going to believe you?

Where did I say that it was?

Fantasy Rangers outside the game like Strider and Drizzit. I could go on, but you should get an idea off of those two.

So is Huntsman Blake and he specializes in traps. It’s just a title at this point.

You have to be honest, it’s still a tool to add pressure or just flat out work around a few mechanics. Sure it could use a buff, but it’s also a useful gimmick that adds another tool that SV is unique in having.

You really don’t understand SV though. It does not feel that way. It feels like a Melee Spec that has an extreme amount of mobility. It’s pretty fluid and flexible in it’s complexity. If you want Clunky, look at MM.

Again, you are proving that you have no clue what you are talking about. Do you think that you are the only one here who plays other melee classes?

93

The difference is now when it’s damage is broken, there’s still nobody playing it.

melee is a mistake

6 Likes
94

Fresh off the press… Killer hit piece discredited by an embarrassing spelling error. Awe there are even cocky quotations. How humiliating.

95

So it was broken for lichking heroic progression. All of cata(bwd, firelands, dragonsoul,etc) pandaria, tot, all the way up through SoO? So half the.life of the game it’s been broken and now melee is some magic cure for this? Lol ok.

The broken things for hunters through the years have always been our development. Our pet pathing. Marksmen since lichking has needed work(even when it pulls decent pve numbers it is clunky) and beast master’s identity.

I can vouch for this because I’ve played hunters since bc.

Ranged survival has been the smoothest and most unique spec hunters had. Physical dmg with elemental dots for cleave and sustained. Advanced traps and extra crit chance from traps(with glyphs). Kiting within frost trap with cleave to handle countless adds. Increased movement speed across frost traps animation. It was a good spec. Always solid and people always returned to it because the others were so broken. The only thing it truly"lacked" was PvP burst and dmg in arenas. Tuning before it was made melee. The Nerf to serpent stings dmg hurt. And no haste scaling to dots.

And it was the highest represented hunter spec for all those xpacs. I played through them and even logged some pretty good numbers at one point.

Marksmen had a few patches where it’s dmg outran survival and so did beast mastery. But they didn’t even run smoothly.

Beast mastery more with pathing and sharing shots with survival and marks. Never having it’s own true click. Well except that rexxar was a BM hunter and melee, which is what we should have now.(yes my opinion but since you are fighting next to your pet and using your pet more in survival than beast mastery…well it’s a decent opinion since beast masters…the whole idea was a kinship and fighting with your pet). In PvP it has excelled somewhat at times do to broken stampede, lynx rush. Oh and you don’t need line of sight to do your dmg. Over 50 percent of your dmg comes from your pet. Which also cripples you in PvP when people kill the pet. Has some burst with BW but the loss of rapid fire as a dps/haste increase hurt all three specs.

Marks with failure of sustained dmg and cleave. Blizzard never figured out a good way to build into aimed shot for a smooth single target rotation or cleave. It’s bursty but after that burst it falls of hard. And since there are (7) high ranked hunters in PvP arenas ATM…it’s not a good spec for that either clearly.

With all that said, and a bit of rambling I apologize for, all hunter specs have had issues. Ranged survival was a solid pve spec that lacked small things. We(as the o.g. hunter community) do miss it and would like to see it’s return. Hell it’s why I started a hunter so many years ago in lichking.

So tear this post apart, by all means. And attack anyone who hates the new survival and doesn’t enjoy what has happened to hunters. But know the facts. Hunters are in a horrible place, playstyle wise. We do decent dmg and suck all at the same time. Back to my protadin, mage, lock, and monk

4 Likes
96

I have a feeling that Survival is going to remain Melee and there’s nothing anyone can do about it. Once Blizzard embarks on a design direction there is seemingly no amount of community outcry that can change the trajectory. Outlaw Rogue is a perfect example of changes that nobody wanted (Roll the Bones) sticking regardless of reception. Numerous former Combat Rogues abandoned the spec because they couldn’t stand what it had become. The forums were littered with posts about awful RNG and how energy regeneration was broken. There were people on the Rogue forum that complained about the changes with such frequency and gusto that it made Bepples look like an amature. The core class design has remained unchanged.

Arguing about class development is a fruitless venture and I highly doubt that the class design team is combing the forums looking for input. Maybe we should just agree to disagree and stop arguing with eachother.

1 Like
97

No i just think you’re not understanding what i’m saying.

No and i never implied that because my topic was based around survival being weak in both categories where it fails against other melee classes due to not having other melee mechanics (like parry, or counter strike to root them besides harpoon) and lacks kiting abilities (steel trap which should be base line and unbreakable to damage with a lower immobilized de-buff) to help it at ranged where it should be excelling against other melee.

Honestly i would say that Aspect of the eagle was meant to be a complete 50/50. To be able to add pressure or kite, but with the way other classes are right now, the lack of in fighting abilities for survival, and the weak ranged damage survival has makes it more of a 80/20. Where 80% of the time you’re using it to kite against all other melee specs after you root them with the harpoon into Aspect of the cheetah, and 20% of it being used for pressure when you’re out ranged by caster’s.

Bringing it back to the main point (the difference between survival and other melee specs is that the other melee specs have what it takes to come out on top within melee range or even ranged where all the hunter specs need some help in the kiting department) along with aspect of the eagle and why it’s weak and buffing it to the point where you’re basically going to be using it more so than needed (Kiting).
Makes it feel like a ranged spec that’s forced to be melee and shouldn’t be.
So don’t say i have no clue what i’m talking about when i do.
Where as i like bepples for proving his points and sticking it out instead of simply bashing him and not proving anything.

1 Like
98

probably not. i only use this char for mount runs since legion.

i will still laugh at anyone who plays this meme spec.

2 Likes
99

Why? It’s a powerful spec.

2 Likes
100

melee ruined the class and is a waste of space. it should be scrapped next xpac for good.

6 Likes
101

If that is the case, why come to the forum then?

102

While possible, I doubt it. The problem is that your posts have a lot of words used, but you say just as much as you did when you made two sentences per post.

Look, I’m on my phone so I’ll be brief. Do you know how to Kite as SV? Everything I just quoted here says that you don’t, and that you don’t want us to notice.

103

I really love survival. I can act ranged when I’m questing without as boring a rotation as MM or BM. I get to use traps and crossbows and bombs! I maybe liked Legion better, actually, but I’m not complaining in BfA.

2 Likes
104

must be all the time i invested in my char or something. the forum’s more fun than the game atm.

1 Like
105

Just want to make everyone else to be miserable, or am I missing something?