Here’s to hoping they remove their ability to report because they report people for having a different opinion.
Not that you think it’s me, but I don’t report people, no matter how much I don’t like them.
Just clearing my name.
I find it funny that he thinks they are false reports…
when you do nothing but shout the same false statements over and over and refuse to change positions when evidence has shown you to be wrong multiple times and you still keep talking you are trolling.
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You mean besides the posts being cleared after mod review and unhidden?
Which is a description that fits you to a T. You need to look in a mirror, friend. This is not your personal echo chamber.
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I wasn’t shown to be wrong though.
My view is the map is not the major cause of alliance 99% loss rate in AV.
Your view is the map is the only cause of that 99% loss rate in AV and everything wrong with Alliance AV is because of the map.
We have different views and yours is focusing on a tree in the forest while I’m looking at the entire forest.
You are so tunnel visioned on blaming the map you ignore and dismiss all other factors. And you think I’m the troll… You are what’s wrong with society today, you have to find anything else to blame to try and remove any fault of your own as to why you failed at something.
Failed your math test? It had nothing to do with the fact you didn’t study for crap, the teacher just hates you!
Lost at AV? It has nothing to do with the fact you had 5+ teammates that had 0 HK, very minimal damage/healing done, exc. It’s clearly the maps fault you lost a 35vs40!
…
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You seem to want to pretend that most of the alliance aren’t discouraged at this point as a result of the unbalanced map. If you lost every single AV you have tried for the past months(as a result of obvious map imbalances) but you still need exalted to get an item you want are you going to que up all excited to try hard?
The fact is alliance are queing up knowing that even if you rush south quickly the horde are in position to block you at SF. Which is supposed to be a “neutral” GY, this is of course never the case since the horde spawn 1/4th of the way up the map and can easily cut alliance off on their to SF making it essentially a horde grave yard.
If SF isn’t the plan its go IBGY. The win condition for either side is typically capturing SH for the horde or IBGY for the alliance. The difference is if the horde take SH they have a tiny bottleneck to completely block alliance at while they are respawning at the complete north end of the map at their graveyard. This completely traps the alliance and they have no prayer of making it through.
Now compare to the situation of doing this to the horde. Alliance needs to overcome a positional advantage the horde have from the start thanks to their cave being 1/4th of the way up the map which allows the horde to block you no matter where you go since the factions do not meet in the middle of the lake like they should and instead meet at SH bunker or SF grave yard. Assuming you get past the horde and make it to IBGY you aren’t greeted with a tiny bottle neck to police horde at. You are greeted with a much wider open area and to top it all off when you kill the horde they aren’t ressing 15 at a time at the bottom of the map. They are ressing at the cave 30 at a time much closer to IBGY than stonehearth gy is to stormpike gy.
To top all of this off, not only does this head start/increased ressing numbers give the horde an advantage for gaining ground on the alliance, it also makes it near impossible to spawn ivus while the horde always have a free ride to have their shamans run up the map and spawn Lok’holar.
Ultimately thanks to the imbalances on the map the horde taking SH is basically a guaranteed win(easily can block the 15 alliance res waves that spawn far away). The alliance taking IBGY means trying to endure 30 horde ressing from the cave right beside you continuously slamming into your defenses while every alliance death is forced to run halfway across the map.
Can you honestly blame alliance for not wanting to try with these ridiculous imbalances?
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The original discouragement was caused by a heavy bot/afk leech infestation for alliance pug AV.
If I remember correctly I saw some games where I spotted more than half the alliance team either botting or afk leeching at the back of a battle. I play hunter and scout around with eagle eye and tracking so it’s not to hard to find the leeches. And I’ve used invisibility potions specifically to get past fights and kill the leechers.
A bot program I commonly saw for AV was a program that would do 2 things.
- Run to X location in field of strife
- Attack anything that attacked the “player” until it or the “player” died.
I used my pet to make them get stuck on pathing and after I despawned the pet they would try to run back to spot X.
Before they broke the /follow feature in AV I caught a multi box leechers of 5 warriors. Used invisibility potion to get past the fight and killed the following accounts then the main one. He only reacted after I started hitting the main account so I killed the 4 follows before he finally reacted. Even just considering that one multi boxer that was leeching he alone turned the game into a 35vs40 for alliance.
The initial defeatist mentality was not caused by the map, it was the bot/leech infestation that was fixed by blizzard after a few months. After the damage was already done. Please stop trying to rewrite history to fit your narrative.
Also the reason alliance have such a hard time winning now that the bots are fixed is the dead weight on their team turning the matches to 35vs40 at best. Next AV your in look at the average levels of each team, and at the end look for those who got less than 5 HK and see just how many of the alliance are either under leveded or just plane not participating at all.
So your evidence that the map imbalances aren’t a thing is you saw bots, followed them and messed with them with a pet…
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Horde spawn 1/4th of the way up the map which allows them to blockade SF(supposedly neutral GY) and to be in position to block alliance anywhere they go.
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Horde respawn 30 at a time 1/8th of the map away to reinforce IBGY with a much wider area to cover. Alliance spawn 1/4th of the map away 15 at a time and have to go through a much smaller bottle neck.
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Horde spawning this much further north forces the battle to take place in a position where horde are free to spawn shamans and Lokholar with no trouble at all.
Sorry but you seeing bots does not change any of these facts. If you had any common sense at all you would realize people bot this crap because its an imbalanced mess that isn’t worth doing. If alliance actually viewed this as anything other than a lost cause mess that is served up to the horde on a silver platter they might actually care enough to try. They know its going to be a loss thanks to the map imbalances and try to salvage whatever rep they can each game so they can eventually quit doing this joke of a bg.
If any of you defending this nonsense had a clue you would be campaigning to get it fixed so your ques wouldn’t be 2 hours. I guess being handed guaranteed wins is more important to you guys though.
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- Alliance had a higher win % than horde in vanilla with this very same map.
Didn’t realize this was vanilla, almost like 15 years of information changed the way people play this game. Last time i checked alliance also won again early classic. Not because the map is balanced but because as always a bunch of people gravitated to horde for the rigged racials and screwed themselves with ques to the point of not being able to premade like alliance could. Blizzard of course ruined that for the alliance and is now allowing horde to win 99% of the time.
All of this aside doesn’t change any of the things i mentioned above. Horde start 1/4th of the map closer to the middle than alliance do. Horde can easily defend their importaly GY(IB) with a cave twice as close as our respawn point is defending SH as well as res in double the numbers.
You can post whatever nonsense you want of alliance winning 15 years ago and blah blah won with premades blah blah. None of this changes the very obvious advantages horde have.
Here is a paste of the information that actually matters. Your nonsense of wahhh i want free wins since alliance won 15 years ago doesn’t mean squat.
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Horde spawn 1/4th of the way up the map which allows them to blockade SF(supposedly neutral GY) and to be in position to block alliance anywhere they go.
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Horde respawn 30 at a time 1/8th of the map away to reinforce IBGY with a much wider area to cover. Alliance spawn 1/4th of the map away 15 at a time and have to go through a much smaller bottle neck.
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Horde spawning this much further north forces the battle to take place in a position where horde are free to spawn shamans and Lokholar with no trouble at all.
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Horde are simply playing the bg as it was designed to be played. Perhaps alliance should do the same rather than blaming their loss rate on things that did not change.
Across all realm types, which make up the queue pools, there is no extreme lopsidedness that you claim. Alliance players simply tend to not want to pvp, and when in a BG with even numbers on each side, it is glaringly obvious that unless it is a pve race, they want no part of it (in general, there are indeed many alliance who DO want to be there)
Oh no, blizzard “ruined” your exploitative behaviour. 
I want a fun competitive game. Sorry that horde gets in the way of your desire for a pve race. 
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Yes because horde weren’t playing scorched earth and shockingly horde also had a shorter queue time and still very decent win rates.
I think half the posts in this thread is just 1 hordie too scared to give up their 99% winrate.
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3 horde but yes basically.
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And yet even private servers who used the exact 1.12 map (without the backdoors to base being fixed, which is a much bigger buff for alliance base than it is for horde) had alliance winning more than horde.
Hmm…
I’m not against the GY Rez selection getting reviewed and fixed. But the map is not the major cause of that loss rate.
I would even take flipping the map (horde start north) on a radomized chance for which team starts where, to prove it isn’t the map.
But even back when alliance did try in pug vs pug AV, it wasn’t the map holding them back. It was their infestation problem.
So it’s not the map but it actually is the map.
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Your trying to blame the 99/1 on the map, when the map right now (because of scuffed GY selection) is a 45/55 at most. That other 44 going to losses is from a player problem.
Evidence of this is when AV weekend comes around alliance winrate has jumped up to around 40% with the dead weight players still being there. It’s just the alliance actually get a better percentage of players trying to win vs the defeatists.
If this was the case no AVs would be going off at all and WSB/AB would be nothing but premades fighting premades.
Sorry Ziruys, although I agree with many of the things you say you keep engaging with people who say the same thing over and over again and you do the same back. You often troll the trolls and that makes you also a troll.
I welcome people discussing ideas to fix the situation but this back-and-forth of blame and recrimination does nothing to move things forward. We should instead try to identify possible causes for the problems and bring all of them to Blizzard’s attention. That way, should they choose to do something, they have feedback to work from.