“Trust me! My post history shows it! Your post history? LOL naw… not looking there…”
Doubling down on the problem I first highlighted is QUITE the bold strategy.
And there has been a mountain of evidence, including maps and videos, to point out the imbalance. Just because you, and a few others, choose to ignore the cause and focus on symptoms doesn’t change the fact that this map is a garbage version of AV.
Sure we do. AV was one of the most memorable parts of vanilla. What we got in classic was a massive disappointment.
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Sorry you need to learn math before you can have a discussion here.
If you skip past IBGY you have no way to rez, which means a small group of horde can whittle you down over the 5 mins it would take to hard cap a GY and allow you to actually push. Something you would know if you actually read the thread.
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He literally doesn’t understand 20 is a bigger number than 10, we’re down the most basic things he needs to learn…
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Ive asked you twice to no avail and actually contributed something in the process. Youre taking shots at me when youre not talking about the contributions you already made and dont feel like you need to make again while chastising someone for not making any points as hes making them.
I pointed to my post history because i got like 30 posts in this thread alone (among others) that date back to late july.
You said I didnt make or didnt have any. My only recourse is to point to them because theyre there and you missed them. Youve debated with others and not with me so I dont feel like looking up your old posts and working off those. Sorry? Youre here now and still posting for what reason I dont know.
There isnt much more I can do if you wont answer my question and even less of a reason for you to respond if you dont.
Maybe and this is a strange concept, you shouldnt come into a discussion at the end and then demand people to recount the discussion for you when it is in writing above your posts…
You on the other hand have done nothing but show a complete lack of understanding of the AV map and its mechanics. OH and lie about how alliance win AV when they did not.
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Then your participation makes no sense because if its done why are you still posting?
Saying you had the discussion is now the discussion at hand? Huh? Say your goodbyes and move on then, sheesh.
You know its funny, recently on Blizz’s latest nochanges-was-never-really-a-thing list of later changes they just did a whole bunch of patchwork on the map.
One would think, that if the map imbalances being touted here were actually, really, undeniably impacting games in the way these players have said then something would have been done. At the very least, it should have been addressed via blue post…but…nothing.
Combined with my own anectdotal experiences and general understanding overall of how stuff works that pretty much tells me that the alliance players are simply wrong about the map thing. Or theyre blowing it way out of proportion and other reasons exist. Im not taking their word for it because I have no reason or cause too.
Even so, Im no threat to the religion so relax. Im on your side really.
Once again though, for the record, I am 100% fine and on board with a horde cave push back to where it is in retail. Not because I think it will do anything or I think the alliance deserve it or I think its a problem but because its already more retail AV anyway so who cares about one more minor swap. Not me. Classic is aight but it aint 'nilla. Nothing to lose cuz theres nothing to save. Put the cave in outland, idc.
What are you talking about? Horde calls out hot spots literally any game they apply. If Alliance are sitting at SHGY getting farmed, of course there were no call outs. Last AV weekend, I played 3 games. 2 of them IBGY got soft capped. There were call outs galore those games.
.
And just having people call out strats isn’t evidence the faction is trying. It is evidence that some people playing in those games are trying. It is why I enjoy AV weekend. Because unlike normal weeks, Alliance actually is trying. Games are so much more enjoyable.
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Again… Viratrix summarizes exactly what is happening.
Arriving late to the party, claiming that no real arguments or evidence have been presented, being summarily dismissive of everything as substandard, and then repeating either already debunked talking points or irrelevant apathetic garbage… NOT A GOOD LOOK
Seriously Corpse, onus is entirely on you at this point.
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Except the apathy is real. It isn’t the only reason Alliance lose. Just like the map isn’t the only reason Alliance lose. It is multiple things. It has always been multiple factors. Anyone who says otherwise is full of it.
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Blizzard made changes to classic AV that no retail map, or any other version of AV, has seen to date. The backdoors to DB - still there in retail. Wall next to IWB - never existed in retail. Honorless debuff in the cave - again, does not exist in retail.
I do believe the changes Blizzard made were in good faith, but they ignored the many, many threads with map drawings and videos of the biggest imbalances and the obvious respawn issues.
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Sure but the map is something objective that can easily be fixed. How much that would impact alliance attitude? Who knows but it is something that can be done entirely on blizzard’s side.
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Agree. I wish they would just make the freaking changes.
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Me, I play both factions – on different servers. That way I can do all the zones and stories.
That’s not the apathy I’m talking about. Corpse directly advised boycott entirely or reroll Horde rather than discuss anything regarding the map.
Sure, but some factors drive others. A map imbalance would not go unnoticed, if only subconsciously, and tilt for or against a side.
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Well he has finally admitted there are other factors causing the 99% loss rate other than the map, so that’s a start in getting him to realize the map is not the major contributor to the loss rate.
Ive already summed up my entire position into one neat question and posed it directly to you twice and you still wanna talk about the onus being on me while the subject of me is 100 percent off topic.
I made my refutation, you choose to keep ignoring it while asking me to make it. Or do whatever you mean by onus. There’s nothing more for me to do or say to you unless you want to actually discuss something rather than talk about the discussion you already had because thats somehow more important now. If its over, theres no need for you to be here.
I also have posts in this thread that are a month old - talk about late to the party. I even told you where to find them. Either you didnt even read the damn thing or you missed them in the thousands of posts. So youre entire criticism of me is wrong but considering the source I cant summon the strength to care.
Theyre not looking at it through the same lense as alliance players are and thank god for that. Of course, in player logic, that must mean the horde are benefitting somehow or its purposefully slanted towards the horde as a result.
Maybe Blizz looked at it and found any any further changes here would just imbalance the map more in the either direction, who knows?
What we do know is that the alliance position is supposed to be undeniably irrefutable no contest not up for debate slam dunk and it seems the most important entity in that decision making process does not agree and perhaps they may correct with that assessment.
I feel safe in assuming that given all the things theyve done and patched in recent months. There was some obviously broken and exploitable crap that needed addressing and somehow AV managed to slip by with only a couple of minor tweaks despite the “undeniable” being right there.
I take that to mean its not the holy writ gospel some are making it out to be and there is plenty of cause to take a deeper look.
This is your “contribution”, a useless opinion that you think is bolstered by your dismissal of everything that disputes that the map explains the majority of the problem.
This “contribution” has been dissected, repeatedly, by multiple posters, discussing multiple issues, all of which aren’t just opinions but facts about the map itself. Further, these map issues aren’t minor quibbles that only the rare single Alliance trips up on, but rather very dramatic counters to both PuG and organized play. This discussion has been done, to death, and simply put, you’re wrong.
There is nothing further to do with you if you insist on acting like the previous 1,800 posts just didn’t happen. Seriously… you’re only trolling this thread at this point. That your entire position can be boiled down to “nu uh I don’t believe you” then we’re done. That’s juvenile and sophist nonsense.
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