Geez, look at all those nodes and all that fun. Meanwhile we’re an afterthought.
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How is this constructive again?
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Do devs not receive feedback from forums via moderators and community managers?
You havent provided feedback. Do you really think forum managers consider whining like this as feedback?
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Here’s feedback for you: they have alot more 1-talent point nodes that unlock powerful abilities. It’s self-evident, just looking at it…it’s not trivial dude.
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The resto tree is a big grid where every node is linked to every adjacent ones.
Meanwhile we have big branches that retrains our choice quite a bit more.
I haven’t taken a look on how I would build a rsham yet but it does look like they have a lot more options on the first look.
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I find it interesting that it seems a new trend is being broken each time they release a new tree.
- Rogue
- Multiple options to pick 1st talent point in Subtlety & Outlaw
- Top section has 3 rows with middle now having 4 rows, rest are 4 rows for top and 3 rows for middle
- Shaman
- 9 columns of nodes, rest are 7
Not sure if this is a good thing or a bad thing as far as a prelude to what others trees are going to look like compared to the for lack of a better word “stiffness” that the Priests trees seem to be.
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I for one think it’s a good thing to allow trees to flow like this. I love it. I actually feel excited as I go through the invoker and shaman trees because of it. There are so many viable options to take as I move about the tree itself, while still making me choose carefully.
The flows of the new trees allow me to adjust as needed while still pressuring me on what choices I should make.
What better way to pressure end users than two give two GOOD choices between nodes/spells than just one obvious good path and one obvious bad path.
I also find it ironic that the shaman trees are similarly designed like the envoker trees. Very free flowing with tons of great choices that empower the class and bridge all three specs very well to the shamanism theme.
They are doing this while pushing users to use more totems and elementals in their gameplay. It’s insanely well done in comparison to PRIEST trees.
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While I do think they should add as much flexibility shaman has to all the trees, if you’ve been watching alpha, Shadow priest are sitting very pretty.
Def not a afterthought lol
Thank you, people are speaking up! Yes Get mad and speak up. The priest must be heard!
Just make sure to be respectful to new devs when you get emotional with the upcoming new specs ;p. IM trying to hold back too haha!
Honestly as someone who’s played a decent chunk of Shaman over the years, I don’t think the resto tree is great. The base class tree is interesting - but you ARE still mostly collecting things you already had up till you’re near tier 3 in that tree. And the tree is so spread that it’s hard to make super meaningful choices on which tier 3s you want to grab because making your way over to it is expensive. Still there’s some opportunity for interesting meme speccing in it.
The resto tree though there’s pretty much nothing new or interesting in it. It seems like you literally take the same things you already have and your choice mostly comes down to which current legendary do you want. There’s a couple new passives in it, but they’re passives that reward you for the exact same gameplay you’re already doing (Acid Rain, Ancestral awakening). Perhaps Blizz doesn’t feel resto needs anything playstyle-wise and thinks it’s nailed currently.
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I haven’t had a chance to see much Alpha content, are you able to expand upon this? Sitting petty in what sense? I’d love to pick up my Shadow Priest again come Dragonflight.
They are very strong currently damage-wise. Even though their tree is wonky, it’s very powerful, and turns out in practice, that seems to be correct, and Spriest is doing a lot of damage right now.
It’s all subject to change though. Quite possible it gets hit with nerfs or the shadow tree has a whole layout change, etc. Just don’t know yet.
Ah I see. But gameplay loop wise, which is my main concern and the only angle that I come from personally, if it plays the same, then I’ll reserve my judgements and rein in my expectations.
Historically Shadow as a spec has started strong numbers wise, and than been gutted, time after time. And it will happen again. Because Blizzard do not learn from past mistakes.
(At least it’s not Demonology, which both has no damage, and plays like a dumpster fire).
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I’m just using your post to clarify because I’m pretty sure you already know this, but for others looking at this thread and thinking “wow shadow is really doing that much damage”…numbers mean next to nothing at this point. There hasn’t and won’t be a numbers tuning pass until we are much closer to launch.
What’s important right now is the general gameplay of the spec. Things like how our tree is really disappointing in a class sense, it’s not very usable for our spec and has a very obvious path we basically must take. Our spec tree is bloated and filled with obnoxious talents like sanguine teaching or the fact you could just build a spec with no insanity spender. Surrender to madness still exists for some god forsaken reason.
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Shadow tree is a straight up disaster. It would be an utter failure on the part of the devs if it went live without significant restructuring. And yeah damage is not relevant at this point.
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Gamplay loop isn’t changing too much. The only big difference right now is the single target spec falls back way more on mind flay (and vampiric insight for MB). They also get Mind Blast shield (something previously only Disc had) and Shadow constantly resets mind blast with vamp insight/eruption. This is actually quite a bit of absorb healing in PvP and in PvE might actually make them OK for dampening group damage, oddly enough.
But yeah totally subject to change.
It’s why I had the second paragraph 
Nothing is guaranteed in alpha. Especially pre-raid testing. Once raid testing starts we’re gonna see a TON of balancing on almost every spec if previous raid tests are anything to go by.
As mentioned, they are in a very nice place damage wise but I wasn’t only talking bout their damage lol.
You’re able to opt for a lot of fun and useful options as well as powerful combos. So the utility is definitely there as well.
The more “choices” / routes we can take ( as resto ) seems interesting but iunno yet. Dont entirely understand any of that pseudo sham fistweaving/melee stuff on the right when things synergize better with the ele dmg abilities for resto…but cool.
I imagine itll be hell for blizz to even balance all of this though…so I imagine there will be clear winners and underperformers, eventually those underperformers will be buffed or tier sets/etc made around making them viable.
Usually goes this way when they expand talent trees too largely but I am still excited and it beats the same system we’ve had since forever and breaks up that stale feeling.
Cant complain too much though, the holy tree seems extremely limited in the end. Something in between the priest and shaman tree for complexity would have been nice I think.
ALSO WHERE IS MY SECOND RIPTIDE CHARGE FROM ECHOES! RAGE! 
The Shaman tree is the definition of overbloated. It makes me cringe at what the Paladin one is going to be like.
The Priest tree just needs to be trimmed down with filler stuff removed. It’s mainly in the middle and bottom rows.