She only succeeded in making him ‘toxic good’. It reminds me of an old Washington Post article I re-read recently about why Kung-Fu Panda was so popular in China, and let them wondering why they themselves had never made such a film. The last line in the article sums it up thus- “If you asked a Chinese to make this movie, the panda needs to be lovable but in a perfect sense,” said Sun Lijun, a professor of animation at the Beijing Movie Institute, in the July 10 issue of Oriental Outlook magazine. “In the end, he would be so perfect he would be unlovable.”
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I always wondered if someone genuinely enjoys a story or a game is actually looking for a “representation” character.
Like are people role playing as that character? Is it a self-insert? How would these people handle it when the character they identify with turns out not to be perfect or even a villain?
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So there are other characters. Flynn and Shaw are better because they both have more depth of character. And the one dungeon in which you accompany them both is a hell of laugh riot!
They actually DO act like a married couple.
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yeah, but they are throwaway characters. Anduin is a faction leader and one of the main characters of the franchise.
If you were white and male, you didn’t have to look, or ask, because you were represented by default. Representation was handed to you automatically. You had your John Wayne characters, your Horatio Hornblower, or even your James Dean and Frank Sinatra and Dracula characters, your Bad Boy Heroes.
It was so common that it was a natural expectation that you didn’t have to ask for or even be aware of.
However if you didn’t fit the norm of the white male, it becomes very obvious you aren’t the “Hero”. That’s why if you’re Black for instance, Uhura and especially Ben Sisko are that important.
It’s also however why you don’t see any Ben Sisko Trek movies because that character didn’t enjoy the same kind of popularity with white males as James Kirk or Jean-Luc Picard.
You probably won’t see movies with Kathryn Janeway or Michael Burnham for the same reasons.
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So what? Like his father, he too can be thrown away if the plot demands it.
And Shaw has been a mainstay character since day one of the MMORG, when Anduin was just a little boy who ran away when Onyxia showed up.
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I am not white.
My representation generally hovered over the offensive and the R word (the other one). I would argue that’s worse than no representation but this isn’t about that.
I asked if people who actually say they enjoy these sources of entertainment are actively seeking these representations and if they do what do they do with it? Self-inserts? Is the enjoyment derived from these representations or can the story and characters stand on their own.
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You answered your question in your question: they enjoy it.
Especially in an MMORPG or really any RPG. Having yourself be a part of the world might be easier if you see yourself as a part of the world.
I am sure there are various elements to it. Reducing it to a self insert seems a bit off the mark, when a major premise of an MMORPG is playing a role you enjoy seeing yourself in.
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I personally don’t care who he ends up with but I am certainly rooting for Wrathion and him if only because I do like their dynamic.
Gay guys and anyone in general can be corrupt! Or do we want to talk about how certain closet homosexuals would throw others under the bus for a taste of power? Also, in Anduin’s case he got corrupted by forces outside his control. If you want some gay allegory about that you can think Anduin ends up in some gay conversion camp with the Jailer pulling that little string.
Admittedly I would all be for a bi Anduin but at the same time that ship has probably sailed along time ago. We could always just have some of the newer leader end up gay due to the fact they don’t have the same lore baggage(Umbric for example or maybe Moira’s kid when he grows older, that could be an interesting storyline, How would Moira react to a child that didn’t fit her expections, would she react exactly like Magni or try something different?)
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Idk if they enjoy it but it is certainly very important to them… but to what capacity. Like is it like Baal who seems to assign the social gravity of these representations?
Pelagos can’t be the new arbiter. Thats transphobic!
Zandalar can’t get raided. That’s colonialist and racist!
and etc and etc.
Seems like depending on how these “representations” are viewed by the audience certain people would place them on a pedestal that road blocks them from any development.
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One example that comes to mind is Uhura. Many Black Women say Uhura made them feel like they could exist and belong in the sci fi / fantasy narratives like never before.
I am not a black woman. But I can believe it. Since Uhura, maybe Storm from X Men is the major one that comes to mind. Or Zula from Conan.
Nichelle Nichols and William Shatner kissing was controversial in some parts of the US, because it was interracial.
So, I can have a bit of understanding for the argument about representation.
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You will not see this, and that is probably for the best.
Speaking as a middle eastern woman, I do not lack for representation, only for meaningful ones. We have three whole tropes commonly used in western media for arabs; terrorist, imam, and wife of A or B. That’s pretty much it for the most part. I mean, there’s also tropes specific for specific forms of fiction; historical fiction will add in Arabian merchant, or “progressive” fiction will have “Arab in name only” characters who tell you they are Arab, but act just like everyone else (who is white).
So when I see that ever-so-rare middle eastern character presented not as a trope, but as a fully realized fictional character, it’s pretty nice.
I’d best describe it as finally feeling like you aren’t alone.
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I thought troll post day was Sunday?
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Yeah I am quite familiar with Uhara and the landmark achievements some of these actors exposed themselves to an R industry and a very critical audience at the time. They normalized a lot of things and my point isn’t that characters from different backgrounds don’t come on the screen. So my problem isn’t that they show up on the screen or take on a lead role but how some audience members seem to be incredibly protective of them.
Like what if Shandris comes out as trans in one patch and ends up getting killed by the big bad?
Some people would criticize blizzard of killing off their trans character and find a thousand one excuses of why this about something much more than just a character getting killed.
I would like to be in a world where a character like Shandris comes out as Trans without too much drama and a world where Blizzard is comfortable enough to kill off a character without being accused of something sinister.
Its why I don’t like characters becoming representatives because then they become untouchable and boring because we can’t do anything with them at the risk of evoking controversy.
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Having heroes that you can identify with has a positive effect on a person’s self-esteem. That’s a psychological fact. Does that mean I go hut down and search for characters that match my particular profile? Of course not… not any more than I would go hire someone to make rain for my fields.
That doesn’t mean that I don’t enjoy a good shower when it happens. Or that that shower isn’t important.
What I do with what I find is my personal affair and none of your buisness.
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The issues that you are missing are that 1) that would make all of TWO trans characters in the entirety of Warcraft, and 2) one is dead and the other… Did a something to make themselves the new Arbiter, effectively taking both out from the story in the same expansion both came out as trans in.
The reason people get defensive of these drops of water in a desert representations is because they are few. Having your only trans character also be the one who seemingly had the hardest time fitting in with their covenant (of the primary and secondary covenant characters at least) go on to sacrifice their individuality to merge with a 3d-printed robot shell is almost as bad a look as the direct implication that said trans character had all their transitioning issues solved by being dead.
The solution is actually very simple; have more representation. If you have 50 living gay male characters and one of them gets corrupted for the sake of the narrative, you’ll look a lot better than having two living gay male characters with minor importance in the narrative (one of them being brand new, and the other being of little note beyond some Vanilla- and Cata-era quests until Legion) and a third living male character whom a lot of people in the LGTBQ+ community latch on to as a surrogate, and you then take that surrogate and corrupt it.
Your representation-characters are only “untouchable” when losing a single one becomes a significant amount of the total number.
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I don’t really think there is a Character like me. I don’t seek one.
Muradin is the closest to it, as far as height and attitude. All round, Malfurion is the one I can identify with the most. Especially his “good brother” burden. I also have a brother who… gets into trouble that I often have to help him out of.
My brother has always liked Illidan, and I’ve liked Malfurion. And we get called “the twins” by folks, even though we are a couple years apart.
Muradin and Malfurion are among my favorite Characters, and I do see a lot of myself in them. They both have “brother issues” - maybe that’s it, now that I gave it some thought.
But I don’t look for Characters that represent me in a physical or religious or ethnic way, I guess. So much as thematically.
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In terms of personality, there are no characters that represent me, or that I identify with, in WoW. Ethnically, there are, but I lost most of my heritage anyway. Rant over.
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Idk how them stopping their unprofessional, illegal, business practices ties in with anduin being gay, and also idk how blizz can control whether it’s a popular idea or not?
Your post is like basically one giant ultimatum that doesn’t add up?
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Great bait lmao