Armstrongs

Classes Warrior
1

Hey guys i started to play arms recently, i used to play warrior but not that serious, mostly easy farming content around legion/bfa, then played shadow priest and warlock, those i was deep diving more into heroic raid, a bit mythic raid, and mostly mythic plus.
Now i returned feeling more experienced to try some more end content with a melee, and ive been enjoying the season overall, but there ate some points i would like to throw in the winds and see what you guys think. I always have a sensation that tuning is directed only to raid performance, and well, personally i spent much more time doing mythic plus.

  • Playing arms i felt like colossus is better at the dungeon enviroment, having the knock up on shockwave bring much more control, but damage wise, now that i approach endgame gear, feels hard at times. There is always a difference between meta classes, i understand that some will be stronger because they damage more or bring more utility. What i felt playing colossus is like area damage is good, i usually can keep up with the meta classes, sometimes a bit over, sometimes a bit bellow, sometimes punished for not waiting a warbreaker that was about to reset before delivering the demolish, but thats my fault at mechanics.

  • When i reach bosses tough, single target plummets my overall damage at crazy levels, i just cant keep up with other classes at all, simulations do not account for movement, mechanics and all the things we need to do to stay alive. Simulations overestimate the power of the execute, and to me personally, having tried many different approachs to improve my single, i feel like there is no good tradeoff i can do to do good single damage, the nodes that improve that aspect are all the right side execute ones, but i cant take them all or i lose way too much area damage, and if simulations tell me that having 1-2 execute nodes (massacre/execultioner’s precision) would bring me a more balanced area/single profile that rarely translate into truth during a dungeon, the whole full execute nodes combined, the other ones beside the two i’ve mentioned are a great single power, in a raid where 35% hp boss, means you will have plenty of time to perform. But in dungeons man, the fact that those two are usally what i can get without sacrificing too much area damage, they do not account for the 80-75% boss i was not in execute mode, i feel like when i finally reach the spot i will be able to contribute, other specs are ramming the boss at 1.1-1.2 mil dps from the start, and they keep going making your window of opportunity damage shorter and shorter, to the point that the boss dies, and you ate left with your 700-900k dps depending on how much time you had. Like we are running after what we couldnt do, running against time, swim swim to die at the shore.

  • it’s like i am doing great, being able to keep up good damage pack after pack, then every boss encounter in the dungeon plummets your overall harder and harder, until you are left with much less overall contribution, and longer bosses fights, that feel dangerous.

  • I dont know how you guys been feeling about arms, i know youre not many, but i know you are there, i always have to finish a key that was a success apologizing for low damage contribution, just because of this single target dillema. Maybe something else besides execute nodes for single target dungeon, even tough the nodes already are a focus on “use your execute do deliver atomic mortal strikes”, the nature of execute limits our capacity to be really useful in dungeon bosses. Or maybe increase area damage, and accept that during bosses we wont be able to do that great work. Right know i feel i can keep up only, barely with the meta classes in area damage, but they are blasting single start to finish, so where is our balance? I sure know there are things to improve in gameplay, that there are some godlike arms roaming the lands, but i feel arms is kinda forgoten here, if the plan was to slayer single, colossus area, how much below should we sit?

  • Really feel like time to shine mentality kills certain specs, but i’m stubborn, and i enjoy the arms thematics.

What you guys think?

2

Pending the timing you’re much better off just sending them on CD and not waiting for the other as you’ll likely lose casts over the course of a dungeon, unless this is of course for a vuln phase which you should’ve prepped for beforehand.

hard to give advice since 1. you haven’t posted on your warrior, provided any logs to look through or even which build you’re playing. The wowhead build is slightly trolling from looking at what they’ve got up atm. While better than previously they’re still missing key talent choices.

I would recommend starting with the following if you are not already.

https://www.wowhead.com/talent-calc/warrior/arms/colossus/DAOBUVFBFQhUVKSUUBAOVVEFURVVQkVQFQCEFEFVVUBB

In terms of overall dungeon performance you’re going to for lack of better wording demolish almost everyone in providing consistently high pack to pack AoE damage. For ST you may be slightly lower pending MS resets but this isn’t anything to concern yourself with. You can also time one of your last ravagers to be within the final 20% to have a solid burst window with 2x execute, 1x op buffing each unhinged MS from ravager. You can also find moments to abuse Colateral Damage to do large cleave hits during a boss fight or prep one from the previous pack.

Colossus Warriors save the group a lot more time on trash packs than what would be saved from having a little more ST.

I’ve never had issues with my overall damage, it’s always been higher or equal to post the mid season tuning. Without logs it’s also hard to pinpoint exactly what you’re potentially doing wrong.

3

Ty for response and advice i usually upload the logs, name character is Moushin - Stormrage, but i dont go trough it too much, maybe i should.

But good to know you don’t feel single is a trouble.

Was wondering what others were perceiving.
To me, grab a enhancement, a mage, a balance, a retri and the feeling is we all bomb aoe really hard, and the bosses, well i def cant keep up, they doing above 1 mil, i struggle to keep 800-900k, the gap is wide, in the end most of the runs, even when i get a 1.5-1.6 m overall they are way above, and it shows, the more i try to push, the less i get invited, why grab arms when you could fit a retri, or enh doing 500k more overall, and having bosses go down faster.
The attack power buff is not enough to justify.

Talents i usually only swap 1-3 points between bloodborne, massacre executioner’s precision and critical thinking, for me battle lord feels good so i try to take it always and exhilarating blows feels odd, i usually do not use it.

4

Exhilarating Blows will feel fine once you get used to it after a few keys. It’s integral for Colossus AoE, while also provides a ST boost via Resetting MS as well and it also feeds into Cleave buffing itself with Colateral Damage with Fervor of battle talented.

Going through a couple of your key logs I can see your problem clearly, and it’s the fundamentals of the spec.

You buff MS way too much in AoE instead of buffing cleave in AoE situations this is causing a solid loss in overall damage.
You have Spell Reflect Macro’d into defensive stance (stop this immediately), you also do not go back into Battle Stance for long periods of time in some of these keys (10s+). I would suggest getting a Dstance/Bstance macro that changes to the stance you’re not in. You should only ever be hopping to DStance as a defensive and only ever really for a couple of seconds max.
Your damage profile isn’t how it is meant to be, mortal strike should not be your top damage for any key.
Your damage profile should look something like the Following.

  1. Cleave
  2. MS or Demolish
  3. Whatever wasn’t in 2.

You also have large gaps where you don’t really hit anything and are missing 1-2 GCDs during your cooldowns.
You need to hit overpower a lot more over things like Thunderclap which you hit too much especially in moments where you would already have 2x charges of overpower sitting there and are wasting GCDs that you could be amping up Collateral Damage while SS is active.
You could work on fixing up your prep for Collateral damage buffed cleaves, you’re not getting the max hits with these that you should be getting.

TLDR: Get the correct mandatory talents to do the role the spec does best, focus on the fundamentals and you’ll be doing a lot more damage.

5

Thanks you for the feedback!

Yeah will try some of those later, the defensive stance with the spell reflect to me is a never a loss, if i need to be on defensive stance for a damage, might as well be receiving less magic damage, and it never felt a hassle to reflect things, few seconds and i get out, or i stay in it for a few more when danger is lurking be it a constant damage from boss or a dangerous big pull and im getting many target warnings, but that my own thing.
And if have to just reflect while hitting demolish, that button wont change the stance and will reflect.

With all due respect tough, talks of “integral”/“necessary” key talents or aspects are kinda bs hearing from here, i’ve looked into some arms logs from high keys to check what talents they are using, and they are always changing specially those points, nah EB wont “magically fix”, and is hella awkward to use, i have used many times in keys, the thing is, that wont “sustain” single target damage, its a much bigger win in aoe damage than single, and even so, not a crazy big area damage boost, i felt that are many configurations of talents that feel more powerful that anything with EB in it, mortal strike ends up being top damage in keys with less aoe or when i single too much, and with the use os executioners precision + massacre, again, trying to improve single, if you make it so you are sending mortal strikes at <35% HP with 2 stacks of precision + 2 overpower + 2 tier stacks yeah it will blast, but still hard to compensate for the 65% hp you didnt have access to that ms.

The only talent that feels bad to remove is battlelord, but ive done some without it and it can be done, just feels bad without the ms resets and rage gen.

But yeah thanks many things you mentioned are true, i hit thunderclap too much, i suspect that happens when i try to bleed more than 5 targets, but i probably do it too much in less target counts too, i do not track at all or try to maximize the collateral damage will try to do that but that wont do no single, aoe feels great already nice to know it can be better, but i suspect that wont increase bonkers area damage: the ultra build up for 1 big damage? I mean lets say i gather 6 stacks, and you get 12 stacks, it is then spent in one blow of cleave that in the great scheme of things is dissolved into the thousands of cleaves you hit, i cant see this making me hit 500k more, maybe 10-20k? Wich i agree a gain is a gain, i have down times specially being away from the target or a bit far, and i never use rend at all, in my head the damage difference of the spell to thunderclap is so minimal, that i cant see the direct damage of rend being anything of significance when i use it on single, the majority comes from the bleed, so i thunderclap to keep the bleed up in st or area.

And again “correct mandatory” sounds like fake news, fundamentals, true gotta improve.

Remember
“Only a sith deals in absolutes”
-Obi Wan Kenobi

6

I’m just a simple brute. I was crit so hard by the walls of text. I’m sure it’s all well thought out and amazing and all, but……

Anybody got a summary?

1 Like
7

Haha love it.
I think from my point of view:

  • Help us a bit in single target in dungeons.
    Or
  • Give us more smash, we smash for you.
1 Like
8

Gotcha, full support.