I am thinking about starting a Priest exclusively for Blitz and random battlegrounds. Do you guys think that holy is in a bad spot? Looking at Drustvar distributions, they are one of the lowest represented healers.
Is it because they are bad, or just because disc is better?
What tools does holy offer to help in blitz?
Holy priest main here. Itâs a combination of both. But mostly that Holy priest is terrible. Disc is really really good in arena but not the best spec for bgb.
Right now the only thing a Holy priest offers over a disc priest is a 3 second stun.
Disc has better hps, cooldowns, offensive pressure, mana.
And itâs not just that Disc is better, every other spec in the game is better that Holy. All that being said you can still play holy and win games and have fun, youâre just going to have struggles that other healer specs just do not have to deal with. Youâll have to hard casts more, youâll have to reset to drink more, youâll have to really think about your positioning in pvp more because you are a much more viable kill target for getting kidnapped by a dk, you wonât be a good fc, youâll struggle spinning, youâll have to really pump to keep your teammates alive in mid fights, youâll oom super quickly in big fights.
I havenât done many randoms this season, and only played disc in battlegrounds, but is seems good to me. I can stay alive much longer than in recent expansions.
This is a remix toon and havenât bothered with sims or correct talents yet, since i was only leveling. Just barely dinged 80, so will read up on talents more now.
Holy Summary
Stronger and more instant-cast heals than Disc
Stronger passive healing than Disc
Stronger casted healing than Disc
10 second God-Mode
Stun (Chastise)
Main issue: kicked in Holy school - ensure you have precog and juke cast whenever you feel youâre about to be interrupted, or alternatively cast Mind Control to throw away on Shadow
Instant-casts
Each of the 4 Premonitions + Heal
Clairvoyance + Heal
2x Holy Word: Serenity
Passives
Prayer of Mending - heals of up to and over 1 mill per proc. It often ends up being one of Holyâs top healing spells.
Echo of Light - with enough Mastery, it becomes a very strong passive heal (which also applies from every PoM heal).
Casted Heals
The argument that Holy casts more isnât true. Disc priests cast a lot for Atonement healing, yet the healing from that is considerably weaker.
Holy School Locked
Apply Shadow Word: Pain on players to make use of Cauterizing Shadows Talent
God-Mode
One big pro that Holy has over every other Healer is Spirit of Redemption
While in Spirit form, use Oracleâs Premonition of Piety or Clairvoyance, and then cast Divine Hymn. Youâre now pumping over 20+ million in healing to every player within 60 yards that is completely 100% unstoppable.
Check out my vid on it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUhvHbEuUOw
Holy is just bad in pvp and m+. Super super squishy. They loose the ability to not die, to heal while dead it seems.
Tldr disc has pain suppression, holy just dies.
Squishy? I dive into an army of alliance and they just walk away. I am the hunter in WM. Canât speak for any rated PvP tho
Holy is fine in mythic +s what are you even talking about? You rage bait every post it seems.
Define fine .archon. gg/wow/tier-list/healer-rankings/mythic-plus/10/all-dungeons/this-week
I find it a bit ironic youâve been singing Shadowâs praises and saying theyâre S tier in another thread, when the data on this site puts their max key at the same level as Holyâs with significantly more attempts at those keys.
Not that I think Holy is fantastic in dungeons - itâs just viable - but come on. This link doesnât say anything.
And then you step into arena and are slapped with an instant 10% healing nerf that progresses up to 60% and that is in addition to Mortal Strike and healing absorption effects many classes have.
Holys highest completed is a 12. Both healing specs arenât viabl, just disc in m+. And sorry you canât make shadow work, cuz itâs slapping on m+
Theyâre both at highest +13 according to the site you just posted.
Worth noting this site is also just incorrect, because the actual highest key completed by a Holy priest is a +14 Necrotic Wake. The highest for Spriest is a +14 Arakara.
Disc priest is quite literally doing the highest keys in the game alongside Resto Shaman.
FWIW, Holy Pallyâs highest timed is a 14 Necrotic Wake. Mistweaver is also a +14 - hardest of which is probably Siege. Resto Druidâs highest is a +14.
Quite literally Disc and Resto Sham are far and away doing higher keys right now, so claiming Holyâs terrible non-viable means everything BUT Disc and Resto are as well. (And itâs worth noting thereâs only 1 disc and 2 rshams that are doing 16s).
But regardless of that, Shadow isnât completing any higher either - so itâs hard to label them âS Tierâ when youâre calling every healer spec trash that is competing at the same exact key level.
The point was to not immediately trust aggregate sites unless you can parse out their data.
Heâs ignorant or a troll. Quite literally the cliche 1500 player saying things he knows nothing about.
For anyone interested, a result of a 2k mmr Blitz where my Holy topped heals with zero deaths.
https://i.imgur.com/nr2dSdo.jpeg
Same, I want to play Holy Priest for Blitz, and Holy specifically because I like the theme. But Iâm afraid Iâll just be a thrower.
That isnât really how ranked mode works. Over time, you will get matched to people of a similar rank to you, so that you by yourself wonât be able to throw games. I main a holy priest and Iâm fine not being optimal because I like the class, and because ranked mode allows me to play with others who arenât playing optimally too.
So I have a question and Iâm really not trying to be like a jerk about it. Like I totally get your statement here. Like any game with competitive/ranked modes once you actually play enough that youâre being matched with people of similar skill the game is pretty fun to play. Also there are TONS of people that play this game and other games who have the illusion that they are much better at the game than they are. The thing thatâs really holding them back is their class/spec, which we all know isnât true in these cases.
I play fighting games, mostly SF6. Iâve mained Marisa since the launch and even though sheâs considered one of the bottom tier characters the game is pretty balanced and I still managed to grind my way to Master rank.
The problem is, sheâs still really low tier. She lacks the tools needed to actually compete at the very highest levels of competition. Holy Priest is basically in the same position. Sure you can grind your way to a pretty good MMR and do pretty well, but youâre still playing a class that lacks the tools needed to really compete. If you were putting the same time/effort into a top tier spec, you would most likely be reaching a higher rank.
So my question is why should it be ok that a class or spec is not optimal for certain content?
Yeah itâs fine for us casuals that we can just play a bad spec, get to a point weâre playing against our peers and just having fun, but for some players who really pour their heart and soul into competing why is it ok for them to have a spec that lacks the tools to really be competitive?
Blizzard class/spec balance has never been good but their are some major outliers early in this expansion and so far they are doing an awful job at bringing things in line with both PvP and PvE.
There will also be complainers, and players with egos that far eclipse their skill, but that doesnât mean Blizzard shouldnât be busting their butt to try to bring representation of classes and spec closer than it is. Itâll never be perfect but it can be a lot better than it is.
The answer is really a few things, here.
But first and foremost - Blizzard has a very bad track record when adding/pruning things of very much nearly reworking the class theyâre touching to a point that it does not feel anything like its previous iterations.
If you need proof of that, ask Shadow priests, or Holy Paladins, or Demo locks, or Combat Rogues, or Disc priests, etc, etc. Thereâs even a contingent of Holy Priest Chakra lovers that show up in these forums.
Theyâll all tell you about a version of the class they loved that does not exist anymore, and youâll see several of them talking about totally different versions from one another. Theyâll also be happy to tell you that they quit their priest years ago or just hate playing it now.
If, in your SF6 example, Marisaâs tools got updated, but they remove all her armor, and make her play like a fundamentally different character. Would you still want those tools? Especially when Marisa could be good with the same moveset - youâve seen it before she got all her nerfs! But you know that serious changes would fundamentally change parts of her you would like to keep. Would you take that?
Now imagine itâs an MMO, and itâs a character youâve been attached to for many years - youâve played through multiple expansions with them. Theyâre not just a newcomer to the roster, but one youâve been with for 10+ years. Would you take it then?
I fundamentally disagree with a lot of what gets posted here on a âwe NEED all this stuff!!!â basis. Because the truth is we really donât need drastic changes. Holy priest has a great gameplay flow that needs some tuning, and it would be great to get a better laid out talent tree and some more choices in it that arenât just gated by 2 pointers that barely make up 1% of your healing. But no, the spec isnât like as fundamentally flawed as people keep trying to say it is.
And Blizzardâs balance has always been slow, it always takes months, and they tend to be myopic to changing things that they very recently introduced in upcoming patches. They also laid off a ridiculous number of staff and itâs been obvious since the TWW beta that theyâre understaffed on the class design side. Realistically, priest is going to see bigger changes in 11.1 at the earliest, or even 11.2.
And, you know, if youâre struggling in low key on holy, itâs probably not Holyâs fault as much as people want to pretend it is. Holyâs faults are barely even noticeable till youâre pushing into the 7/8 tyrranical range, and they arenât actually going to significantly impact you till youâre pushing your first 10s and dealing with that difficulty spike.
Like I have always played Shaman either as a main or alt - theyâre very strong right now, but reality is, the parts of their toolkit that shines in high key isnât even all that needed or useful in a low key. You can basically free cast chain lightning half the time down there. The vast majority of Shamans I see on my tank barely do any damage, donât interrupt, I can count the number of cap totems Iâve even seen on one hand and many of them have to stop and drink constantly. Theyâre succeeding because totemic is absurdly easy and has a ton of passive healing for nearly 0 work, and that frees up a ton of time for them to just mash surge inefficiently and oom themselves into near-full health bars. In fact, the second you have to think beyond âplace healing rain and my healing stream totemâ a lot of these shaman players are actually struggling. I honestly donât think sources of passive healing as strong as those are healthy for the game at all.
And you know what? Iâm not having much fun on my Shaman anymore. Iâm having more fun on my priest (both disc and holy). Iâd rather not see Oracle turn into Holy/Discâs version of Totemic, or something of the like. Really all I want is a better movement ability and at least one better M+ utility (interrupt?), and I think itâs mostly set. New talents would be a cherry on top of that if they maintained the moment to moment playstyle.
The answer is that itâs not okay. Holy priest should be more viable than just in raids, which are the least played content in the game. Iâm just stubborn, because Holy Priests are literally the only Light-based caster spec in the game. Literally the only one. Paladins are not casters, and the other two Priest specs require you to focus all or most of your attention on Shadow-based spells.
M+ Holy is in a weak side. Viable and can do high content, but will struggle way more than other healers because of the lack of utlity, aoe healing and defensives â Thatâs why it needs buffs (rework/updates tbh)
PvP holy feels awful⌠Flash heal is too weak, PoM heals a lot but you donât save anyone with it. Holy word serenity has never been this weak in many years which makes Apotheosis weaker. Thereâs times I pop spirit of reedemer + Apoth and just spam heals and I canât bring someone to 100% spamming heals like crazy burning my mana off⌠Itâs nuts, and this is in 2v2.
Raid Holy is ok, doing good. Nothing crazy, but is a solid pick.
Holy is rather good in pvp to be honest. At least if you build right. So many people are taking Oracle over Archon and I think that is half the problem. Halo can destroy stealth when an arena match stars and the Archon talent that extends Apotheosis is so clutch. You find yourself as a shining golden angel for a very long time. Also Archon allows you to extend Spirit of the redeemer making the pvp replation of spirit of redemption so much better.