BFA was a hot mess, a kerfuffle of massive proportions where Blizz had systems upon systems that they wrestled with all expansion to balance and in a lolworthy move gave up on that towards the end.
Whatevs, that’s fine since the last patch is supposed to be about lulzy shenanigans.
However, BFA shipped with one system, Azerite, and ended at 3 with the addition of corruptions and essences. And it was still such a dishevelled, drunken mess to balance at times.
SYSTEMLANDS is shipping with THREE systems that are arguably more intricate and active in their effects than Azerite - Covenant abilities + Conduits - given how these interact with class abilities and spec spells, and let’s not forget legendaries.
Frankly I am nervous AF given that bar to enter is at three. Blizzard struggled to balance one, they couldn’t balance three… and in Systemlands they are starting with three?!?
Lulwut.
Also how many systems will we end the expansion with? Any guesses?
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Whats to be nervous about? It will be trash for about a year till they fix the systems no matter what. I already know that so I have no reason to be nervous.
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What did you think of the systems when you tried them on beta?
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They have said their plans are to start with everything and improve on what’s there over time, not add like BFA.
This should work out better, I’d imagine, because instead of having to design new systems AND balance the previous one, they can just focus on what they have already developed.
Balance is something that gets talked about way too much though.
The game will never be perfectly balanced, and that very well may be their intention with these systems.
I believe they are trying to flood us with choices, so that no sim can ever be universally accurate.
Basically, the game can be designed where balance wont matter as much, as no one will know for sure that things aren’t balanced.
Anyway, in terms of concern, I have none.
Shadowlands beta has been amazingly fun, and I have already had more enjoyment out of it than BFA has offered me recently.
Which is really saying something honestly, as I really enjoyed season 4.
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What makes you think they will be able to “fix the systems”? As I showed you, they couldn’t really truly fix Azerite, just bandaged it up.
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Now that they are implementing the sockets, mementos and legendary weapons, I think that Shadowlands will be very exciting! I hope you find the new systems to be enjoyable.
The systems are only a problem when they’re not fun!
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Hated them. Azerite was a trashfire from the get-go, but I decided to wait-and-see and give them the benefit of the doubt. The gear has been an abject failure now that we have had 2 years of the experience.
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Sorry, I meant the Covenants and whatever else there will be. The Shadowlands stuff.
Azerite’s problem was it was incomplete from the start. Blizz admitted they didn’t put it in beta testing early enough. So for much of BfA they were trying to patch it together by adding more things to it and the Heart. And there was also the titanforging debate raging on too so they later tried corruption as an experiment on that front. Another layer.
The difference in Shadowlands is covenants are meant to be completed systems from the start. They may expand on it in the future, maybe more soulbinds or conduits, but they’re trying to avoid the need for entirely separate systems layered on top. Like what happened with essences.
Shadowlands is more, but it’s set to go right away. No major revamps needed! Nothing will ever be perfectly balanced, even among just the base classes it’s not possible. But that isn’t the goal here. They want there to be strengths and weaknesses for all the various choices. The balancing goal is just to lower the margin and try to prevent certain extremes from being wildly OP over the others.
There is the shadow of a good idea in there. Horrible execution and the only way to fix it is to fundamentally separate power from covenant choice.
The power difference on the beta between the “best and worst” is very massive right now on the beta. The issue is, this balance is very hard to get right, one knob turned is another knob turned the other way. We already have a power disparity between classes, which is fine, but if you also had a power disparity within that class, imbalance with rampant and very hard to fix. There will be some classes/conventnat combos doing 20-30% more damage, which at that point guilds may push you into playing those classes, or benching you cause you just happen to roll the wrong class/spec.
Blizzard have set themselves up to fail, and everyone can see it - expect them.
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I’ve been on beta for months and been enjoying it, so no, i’m not nervous.
Bingo. This guy gets it.
The starting point of Systemlands is in a nosedive. Not sure how we can go up from here or what Blizz’ vision was to start with not just one but three broken systems.
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you are already calling it systemlands right off the bat. it’s obvious where you stand.
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Laughable. They didn’t provide a DNA sequence worth of customizations. The added permutations will be easily handled by any good sim.
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Plans aren’t guaranteed to succeed. Besides, shouldn’t they, among other game companies, have learned from the, “fix it after launch” attitude by now?
no, i know it will be bad and will have tons of problems. So i’m ready
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No, I think everyone THINKS they see it because they aren’t looking at the whole picture.
There are far too many parts involved to know what the difference between the “best and the worst is.”
I don’t believe for a second its possible.
It would require a sim for every covenant ability, every minor ability, every talent and stat load out, every soul bind, and every conduit possibility in said soul bind.
I’m sure it CAN be mapped, but who would trust it given how many variables there are in combat anyway.
That’s what they are after, likely. And if they fail, they put in even more variables like you see in M+ where certain covenants provide buffs for the dungeon.
How do you sim the worth of that?
People will eventually have to admit that these systems are just far too complex for there to ever be one cookie cutter load out, provided Blizzard do an even remotely passable job.
Perhaps it backfires on them though, and they have made it so complicated even they cant get a handle on it?
That would be hilarious huh?
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There isn’t even a good sim for M+ in BFA, and things are at least twice as complicated in Shadowlands.
I don’t buy it for a second. People are going to convince themselves otherwise, but outside of pure single target stand still there is no way its going to happen.
There are just too many synergies with soulbinds and conduits, ESPECIALLY now that we know how ilvls of conduits are going to work.
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