A couple propositions to alleviate the state of world PvP from a stability and incentive structure standpoint


You heard it here, folks. Don’t go to Menethil Harbor.


I think Blizzard is actually looking into it. They are releasing Battlegrounds early just for this reason and I imagine will gauge what is going on. They clearly stated they were actually watching the amount of PvP taking place and have made rule changes like “Sitting on enemy faction FPs”.

At this point I really think either a layer concept will comeback as thats already been a change that happened, or an introduction of faction queues. Want lower queues, swap factions, with free faction transfers. This makes the most sense to me as right now no matter what everyone has to wait. Who is waiting doesn’t matter at all, thus if anyone is waiting make it a wait that encourages faction balance.


Oh that’s interesting, I hadn’t heard/considered that before. I agree they are taking active steps and that’s why I suggest reviewing the post-BG landscape before acting.

(Saángreal) #24

Wandering bands of civilian NPCs for DKs at every flight path…and go!


Your problem is that in your opinion it should be up to the players whether the game works or if it is totally broken.

Given that different players have different, conflicting goals in playing the game, it simply becomes the tyranny of the majority if the overwhelming number of players on the majority faction decide they want to roleplay serial murderers until they have driven every last member of the minority faction from the game.

It’s up to blizzard to design a stable game that can remain playable. It is their responsibility. They failed by providing players with a structure that could be essentially exploited to destroy the short term playability of the game for the opposing faction and the long-term playability for their own.

They incentivized unproductive behavior. They need to find a way to disincentivize it or the lifespan of classic will be short.

Subscribers you chose to drive away to satisfy your short-term greed will likely never come back.

What will you do when there are only 10 alliance who log in on your server, and so few who log in and queue overall that your bg queues never pop?


Or STV, or Feralas due to DM, etc. Use your common sense…



Glad you understand my perspective, was starting to seem like the only one…

Gods no, wouldn’t this be horrid if your server was even 40/60? Well, most alliance logged on. But there’s still not enough, so no more horde are allowed to log on.

It’s not broken, and they’re working on some QoL changes right now.

This is fine, I agree with you. The problem is, allot of these goals would have been more suited on a PvE server if PvP bothers you personally. I fully understand some people don’t like getting randomly ganked. I don’t mind personally, it’s a part of it. But that’s why they gave server options…

This is the playerbase… Not Blizzard. It’s always been like this, hell… It’s like this on PvP servers. Someone doesn’t like you? Follows you around and ganks you for an hour straight until you log off, or for all he knows or cares, you quit completely. They don’t know that.

They’ve done that… Swap Servers, PvP servers aren’t for everyone. Please stop trying to ruin PvP servers in general by adding new rules just because trolls exist…
Roadhouse is a guild on my server on alliance, they camp lowbies constantly. I won’t name specific names out of there, but there’s a mage and rogue that do it on the daily. It happens…

I understand what you’re saying, however I don’t think you’re going about it right. You want Blizzard to fix player behavior, but they’re working on what they’re working on, and nothing we can say or do is going to change what’s already in motion. Gotta hope for the best, and hope it’s not messed up. Because random changes to how PvP servers have worked for 15 years is not the route I’d like to go.


Not sure why players think that just because you balance servers, that all these problems would go away. What logic dictates this?
That if the horde saw 20 more alliance trying to get into BRD that they would stop ganking?
That there will be alliance 60’s at every flight point to protect Alliance turf?
This is a behavioral issue, not a balance issue.


Your summary here may be better than my post.



If you think a pvp server with no members of the opposing faction on it is ideal, then your own behavior is making that happen. It is not the fault of other players who did not know then what you did not know then either, things that really no one knew.

Enjoy your never ending queue times. The players you chose to drive away from the game for your own short-term advantage will not be back.

It is the responsibility of game designers to incentivize productive player behaviors and disincentivize unproductive ones. Blizzard has failed miserably at this.


Did you read my OP? It covers how incentives might be useful for encouraging certain user behavior and discouraging other behavior.


You’re assuming. Mine is a fairly balanced server, where both horde and alliance camp eachother, preventing certain zones from being ideal for certain things.
Me personally? I don’t camp, so try not to assume I do. The only way I camp is if you’re to attempt to gank me for no reason, and then taunt or keep trying. Then I’ll sit on your corpse for three kills before going on about my day. But I feel as though these players earn it if they keep bothering me. I could just camp like others do for no reason all day long. My actions are honorable for a PvP server, though I don’t have to be. That’s a choice. For you to claim I’m driving off players without even knowing my playstyle’s ridiculous. If you weren’t into PvP, then you should have rolled PvE.

I don’t see any good ideas for everyone at hand besides releasing battlegrounds. Which they are. The only thing I agree with is free transfers to minority servers, which they actually do. But they can’t force the playerbase to use them.

Suggesting locking servers from paid transfers. Well, takes away player choice.
Suggesting we do faction server lockouts, well… That adds pointless wait times…


All of these suggestions are incredibly dull and stupid for lack of a better word. Literally all they would have to do is create world pvp zones and objectives that actually gave you more honor than you would get farming FPs. In the last (or maybe the first TBC patch) They made the unused towers in EPL give you honor for capturing them and then gave a faction buff for that zone.

Now if you say HKs when fighting for a wpvp objective is worth 20% more then you effectively move players to these zones to pvp there instead of sitting on fps.

Theyd only have to effectively add it to two or 3 zones to solve the problem. EPL already had one. Add one to winterspring (theres no dungeons and no raids there) and maybe add one to the gurubashi arena so it actually has some kind of purpose other than that garbage trinket you get


Their incentive to playing is to grieve alliance. They dont care about your game play issues.
Allow me to save you the trouble of thinking that you can alter the game play of people whose sole purpose is to slaughter the other faction and see your ideas as a retail incursion into their version of WoW.

the WoW game manual. Page 134 describes “dishonorable kills”:
Dishonor Points
Even among enemies as bitter as the Horde and the Alliance, there is honor. If you flaunt this honor and engage in objectionable PvP play, such as killing new players vastly inferior to you in level, or killing essential non-combat NPCs such as flight masters or quest givers, you will earn dishonor. If you accumulate enough dishonor through your criminal actions, you will be branded an outlaw. As a consequence, you’ll suffer experience penalties, lose access to your own faction cities, and become so hated even by your own kind that every faction NPC will attack you on sight.

Blizz had already implemented a remedy for what is going on and they removed it in essence they have answered posts like yours that have been popping up since P2 started.


And vice versa, bud…

Funny enough, I kind of like Vodnik’s idea for an actual WPvP that’d probably last well into BG’s.


The ratio of Alliance to horde Wpvp issue posts are about 1000 to 1.


Lol this is the sort of crap Blizzard will make a badge of honor and make an achievement out of it


This. OP is literally psychoanalyzing PvP. 2/10


This game is not faction neutral. There are objectively provable biases that actually do exist in Vanilla.


Finally…it’s out there. Cheers.


Did you even read the post you responded to