I've seen some posts discussing how to judge a person's character rather than simply something like their IO score in order to see how reliable that person can be.
Why not consider having Blizzard (not an addon) add something like a merit based system to the game that allows you to commend players you group with who perform admirably?
People who are patient and kind (even if pretending for the sake of getting those sweet commendations at the end of the run) is better than this cold and quiet pace we have now as a community.
We have examples of this already in FFXIV where you can offer up a free commendation to your fellow players if you enjoyed your time with them already, and they can offer it to you in turn. You just can't give commendations to players you grouped up with outside of their version of the instance finder.
The biggest issue I can see with this is the fact that Mythic + runs require grouping outside the dungeon, so it would be difficult to track if you know the person or not. That's why I feel this should be something done by Blizzard rather than an Addon since I feel Blizzard would have the data required with their bnet integration to know who's been a recent friend of yours and not. (You can also put in a weekly CD on individuals so you can only commend the same person once a week).
Not only would a high commendation level be beneficial in helping tell the player base you're good at the game or at the very least a good person, but there could be a vendor in place that allows you to buy exclusive mounts and toys and transmogs once you reach certain thresholds (not exactly like a currency, but not exactly like a tiered achievement reward either to allow players the option to choose and aim for what they want).
What would you guys think of a system like this?
10/29/2018 01:44 AMPosted by
Mairil There’s a system like that in overwatch. And it’s the reason I don’t play overwatch anymore. It’s like the game is calling me a toxic player because I don’t have any point in their ‘niceness’ metric.
Sorry, I forgot to include that you wouldn't be able to see what others vote for at the end of the run, or if they even voted at all. That's the issue with the Overwatch version, I believe. Everyone witnesses the voting and makes those feel who got nothing a bit less than enthusiastic.
And that system wouldn't be exploited at all.
There’s a system like that in overwatch. And it’s the reason I don’t play overwatch anymore. It’s like the game is calling me a toxic player because I don’t have any point in their ‘niceness’ metric.
And that system wouldn't be exploited at all.
Well, that's why I said you can only commend a person you don't know once a week. The rewards can be expensive enough that you'd have no feasible way to farm for them in the immediate future.
10/29/2018 01:44 AMPosted by
Mairil There’s a system like that in overwatch. And it’s the reason I don’t play overwatch anymore. It’s like the game is calling me a toxic player because I don’t have any point in their ‘niceness’ metric.
Sorry, I forgot to include that you wouldn't be able to see what others vote for at the end of the run, or if they even voted at all. That's the issue with the Overwatch version, I believe. Everyone witnesses the voting and makes those feel who got nothing a bit less than enthusiastic.
Edit: I'm actually adding that to my OP because it's important that this feels like a positive thing when you get a little private notification in chat at the end of the run that you got a +1.
The most people in wow are natural trolls, they'll do the opposite just to spite you. That's why I think it would never work in a game like this. If we went back to mmos back in say late 90's then yeah, sure it would probably have worked.
FF14 has a merit system at the end of its dungeons. 9 tines out of 10 the tank or healer gets it, even if they did nothing noteworthy. I dunno, maybe people do that to encourage more people to go tank or healer? Get some more queues going?
The most people in wow are natural trolls, they'll do the opposite just to spite you. That's why I think it would never work in a game like this. If we went back to mmos back in say late 90's then yeah, sure it would probably have worked.
I'd like to be more hopeful about the community than that. I think there's redemption in there, even if you need to give them incentive for it.
FF14 has a merit system at the end of its dungeons. 9 tines out of 10 the tank or healer gets it, even if they did nothing noteworthy. I dunno, maybe people do that to encourage more people to go tank or healer? Get some more queues going?
Yes! This is actually my experience as well. While it's sad, the majority of commendations go towards tanks and heals, but as a dps in that game I got them regularly enough.
But anything that encourages people to play more tanks and heals can't be a bad thing, and those tanks and heals would have comms to give to dps who play nice as well.
10/29/2018 01:36 AMPosted by
Arisran
Why not consider having Blizzard (not an addon) add something like a merit based system to the game that allows you to commend players you group with who perform admirably?
Because I'm new to FF14, have no idea what is going on really with my 54 level Dragoon, but constantly get commendations. Then I noticed in the weekly "challenge log", which rewards you for stuff, that one of them is giving 5 players commendations when you do dungeons with them.
I mean, I basically try but I'm by no means a great (good even?) player. When I do dungeons, though, I'll OFTEN get a commendation from someone in that game. "Dragoon" is a DPS, by the way.
So it is pretty meaningless, kind of like having "like" here without "dislike."
The problem with commendations I expierenced in FF14 when I played was by default, most gave theirs to the heals or tank. Rarely did a dps get one, but I did manage to get a few for standing out as a dragoon.
The thing is though, players had to give one and there was no abstaining. Don't get me wrong, it was a nice system, but would need some refinement if the intent is to get players to behave better.
The problem with commendations I expierenced in FF14 when I played was by default, most gave theirs to the heals or tank. Rarely did a dps get one, but I did manage to get a few for standing out as a dragoon.
The thing is though, players had to give one and there was no abstaining. Don't get me wrong, it was a nice system, but would need some refinement if the intent is to get players to behave better.
You absolutely can abstain, just literally don't pick an option when it pops up. It times out and nobody gets a commendation.
Sadly, the commendation system would be a failure unless you can develop something brand new. There are 2 types of commendations currently:
1) DOTA 2: (Unlimited Commends) People on your team or the opposing team who get multiple kills will demand that you commend them, thus turning you off and making you do the opposite. The ones who get commended are usually the ones who are kind, generous and suck at their Hero. Occasionally, you get a skilled player who is also nice. He/She is rare. We don't want a commendation system that rewards poor skill.
2) FFXIV: (Limited Commends) Healers and Tanks get an overwhelming majority of commends because you can SEE their contribution or lack thereof and you only get 1 commend to give out per run. DPS is a more subtle contribution. Do you reward high DPS over high utility DPS/dies less often DPS? We don't want a commendation system that is heavily skewed towards certain roles.
But any ideas towards improving the WoW social experience are a step in the right direction! I hope the devs see this thread.
Just like with SWTOR's pvp system the MVP votes, only the healers and tanks would get them as they should.
If you want to improve your IO score do more mythic+ simple as that.
For people talking about commendation skewing towards roles, who really cares? The more tanks/healers in queue means dps queue gets lower. As for toxicity, I think people only base that on personal experience or 2nd-hand experiences. From my experience in FFXIV for about 3-4 years on and off, if you offer advice to someone new, you usually get 1 commendation. Anything that can help motivate good behavior, even a little, should always be welcomed.
And that system wouldn't be exploited at all.
I think the positives outweigh the negatives.
You could only upvote people not downvote them. Most people would not be incentivized to upvote bad players.
Yelp for wow.
Joined party everything was amazing and friendly, but tanks tmog was not on point. Would not group with again.
1 Star
2) FFXIV: (Limited Commends) Healers and Tanks get an overwhelming majority of commends because you can SEE their contribution or lack thereof and you only get 1 commend to give out per run. DPS is a more subtle contribution. Do you reward high DPS over high utility DPS/dies less often DPS? We don't want a commendation system that is heavily skewed towards certain roles.
One idea would be to give everyone the choice to commend by role. In dungeons tank and healer commendations would have to be rolled together else both would automatically be commended, but in raids in particular this would mean you could choose who was the better tank, the better healer, and the better dps.
That way you could both encourage tanks and heals, reward good play, and let dps share the limelight too
2) FFXIV: (Limited Commends) Healers and Tanks get an overwhelming majority of commends because you can SEE their contribution or lack thereof and you only get 1 commend to give out per run. DPS is a more subtle contribution. Do you reward high DPS over high utility DPS/dies less often DPS? We don't want a commendation system that is heavily skewed towards certain roles.
One idea would be to give everyone the choice to commend by role. In dungeons tank and healer commendations would have to be rolled together else both would automatically be commended, but in raids in particular this would mean you could choose who was the better tank, the better healer, and the better dps.
That way you could both encourage tanks and heals, reward good play, and let dps share the limelight too
That seems like a good way to go about it. You could offer up two sets based off of offensive roles and defensive ones so dps get more love.
10/29/2018 01:36 AMPosted by
Arisran Not only would a high commendation level be beneficial in helping tell the player base you're good at the game or at the very least a good person, but there could be a vendor in place that allows you to buy exclusive mounts and toys and transmogs once you reach certain thresholds (not exactly like a currency, but not exactly like a tiered achievement reward either to allow players the option to choose and aim for what they want).
If you've played FFXIV enough to know about its commendation system then you probably know how little people use it to determine your worth as a player. It just doesn't really come up. The system is good, but it doesn't really achieve what you want it to achieve. The playerbase there largely considers it to be a worthless gauge of your character.
That being said, I do like the idea of the commendations unlocking certain collectibles for you. At least there there's some degree of incentive to not be a piece of garbage in your groups.