Really cool concept. I would take over Echoing Blade.
Comments from people who play assassination and tested the changes for 1h on ptr:
I find it bizarre that blizzard doesn’t listen to feedback from Slice and Dice… This would be the perfect time to make a skill passive. Sad…
I still think that echoing reprimand has nothing to do with rogue “fantasy”… It just doesn’t go together, in my view…
I thought the nerf to the Dragon Tempered Blades skill was unnecessary…
I don’t know who tested it, but I found the new tierset with a weak bonus, I’ll test it better later with more time …
I’ll test more, including the other specs and then I’ll comment more about…
7 Likes
Not sure how me and my 3% haste will feel about Swiftslaher. We’ll see.
Airborne Irritant is exactly what I wanted though.
Grappling Hook baseline is sweet.
Seems ok so far? Just hope ST damage in the end will justify the our aoe hard cap tbh…
1 Like
Assassination Feedback:
Deathmark didn’t get touched, no dispel protection or CDR, blizzard is really trolling with this, it will remain as the worst major ability ingame.
Slice and Dice still exists…
Echoing Reprimand still a thing. This trash should be removed from talents for good as it has nothing to do with rogue class in general and you are still forced to pick it, because there’s not a better option…
Indiscriminate Carnage - I don’t know, but for me it looks like a nerf, it is still tied to getting restealth after every pull, which is the most annoying thing, when playing M+ with pugs and now it’s also limited to only 2 additional targets. Where is the improvement ? The previous iteration were 10x times better.
FoK nerfed to 5 targets doesn’t make sense either.
I understand the DTB nerf, since you can finally pick both DTB and Kingsbane, but hey, the Sudden Demise looks like a must have pick now, atleast in PvP, so Kingsbane will probably rot another season.
Tier 4 set bonus is just a copy paste of Poison Bomb, but with 99% reduced damage, looks very boring and worthless right now, dmg needs to be buffed a lot or replace the 4 set bonus with something else. What about giving envenom a small chance to apply deathmark on target for 5 seconds for example, or every envenom reduce the Deathmark cooldown by 0.5 sec.
The rest of the changes looks fine i guess, but there could’ve been more changes, like making Ambush useful and adding it back to core rotation of the spec, (yes talking about Dispatch from MoP, just give us this spell back).
8 Likes
You see the thing with dragon tempered blades though is even though that it reduces poison application by 30%, and envenom increases the application of poisons by 30% and since you’re doing it so often, it’s basically a wash.
I’m absolutely loving the rogue rework, especially for assassination. However, my biggest gripe right now is that cut to the chase shares a node with elaborate planning. Can we please please just get rid of slice and dice and bake it back into the class like it was pre-shadowlands? This is an unnecessary maintenance buff that is no longer needed in the game.
Edit: fixed typo
7 Likes
Really? Because somebody in the ravenholt discord shared a screenshot just by hitting killing spree. They did over 550k damage with a ton of procs.
1 Like
No leave my echoing reprimand alone. I quite like this mini burst option. I do not want deadly throw
2 Likes
You will kill yourself with KS on PTR when used with 7 cp and Dreadblades, kinda funny.
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Talent calculators are updated on the 10.2.0 PTR on WoWhead, btw.
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Ok well then just you can have it. Id like a different option.
3 Likes
Between lust, the haste in stealth talent, and the haste from finishers in the class tree, the talent works out to be ~20% bonus attack speed over a normal raid fight.
Thats assuming 0% haste from gear, and theres a strong possibility that this talent makes it worth getting some haste on gear. With zero haste quick dirty ugly math puts it a a 2-3% raw dps gain, which isnt terrible for a talent so early in the tree.
An interesting way to give us haste scaling to say the least.
And yes it is funny but its also a bug that Kspree is proccing dreadblades damage hit on every attack instead of just the cast. Its not intended.
Also to clarify a few things, the new AR extension (and BF and SnD) during stealth applies to subterfuge and UHUH as well as dance. So with these talents every vanish gives you 6 seconds of from stealth abilities and extension to AR/the other buffs.
Also 6 seconds of crackshot. Its a very nice combo.
Subterfuge is currently bugged and not extending AR but the class dev said its intended to.
Also CB still only effects the first hit of Kspree, not the whole ability, so cold blood still pretty useless for outlaw.
Changes looking good so far.
2 Likes
DTB with Kingsbane is pretty insane. I think i saw some 150k+ ticks from Kingsbane on the PTR.
1 Like
1 minute CD exsanguinate definitely makes more sense in single target than the passive one, but as soon as there are multiple targets it feels really bad gameplay wise. Opening on a pack with bleeds, pressing exsanguinate, even if you don’t press any buttons you’re gonna run out of energy whereas before you felt like you had nearly infinite energy with multiple ruptures out. I think that this ability would work better if it was just a flat energy amount rather than scaling off the amount of bleeds you have if the energy requirement stays at all. Personally not a fan of taxing my energy in such a major way though.
Passive exsanguinate I think is also not an ideal gameplay loop despite seeming to have good tuning at the moment. This idea works more with an ability like Breath of Sindragosa from Frost DK where you can be more interactive with your resource generation. Assassination Rogue currently only has a few ways to increase their energy regen, bleeds on multiple targets (which is now counteracted by this version of exsanguinate), Thistle Tea, and passive generation which ends up looking like not pressing any buttons. I think the energy cost of this is what makes this unfun whether its the current amount of energy or even a reduced amount.
My suggestion for the passive exsanguinate is to make it interact with Envenom, maybe making the buff of envenom also increase your bleed damage in addition to your poison application chance, this way you’re taxing your energy through also needing to upkeep the envenom buff while also running you through your rotation in a non-stagnant way.
3 Likes
Indiscriminate Carnage is an interesting concept but it is very bad because it doesn’t have a priority targeting. So it can reapply to targets that already have garrote and rupture making it useless if it just keeps reapplying to same targets. The same thing can happen with shadow crash.
Cut to the chase should be in the rogue tree for all rogues.
Why did assassin lose 7% damage? lost the 4% vers from the rogue tree and 3% from Elaborate planning.
Why not replace 4% vers with mastery, every other class gets a stat increase, Ret paladins get 4% to strength 4% mastery and 4% haste.
Also, why is the rogue tree set up so we can never get 2 points in lethality as assassin?
3 Likes
its doing 600k damage crit its quite literally warrented
could be to compensate for all the new damage talents. Also talking numberwise is meaningless right now because its subject to change and tuning.
1 Like
Lulmao 
I don’t think that is going to last long.
I would imagine Kingbane is going to get a nerf to its modifier (20% or each poison app), or not count the second lethal posion from DTB, or perhaps get an internal CD.
Or DTB is getting nerfed again, idk.
1 Like
Outlaw’s biggest problem is button bloat and by making some active talents baseline and buffing other actives, I feel like that problem will get even worse. Someone tell me it isn’t so.
5 Likes
Never really felt like button bloat is the problem personally. It’s more the APM.
My action bars aren’t much more clogged than any other class but rogue is probably the only class I can’t play with just an MMO mouse.
If I could play outlaw rotation with just my thumb it would probably start wearing sunglasses, a Golds gym shirt and start asking me if I even lift bro in a Stallone voice.
Instead I’m like literally flailing around like Stevie Wonder on my keyboard.
1 Like
Indiscriminate Carnage, with the current design, cannot be saved. All this talk of smart targetting, making it active but with a shorter CD just isn’t going to fix what is fundamentally a bad design.
Just make is so Crimson Tempest does some upfront damage and a bleed, enough to justify it even in ST, or at least to not be a DPS loss, and the talent called Indiscriminate Carnage to say:
Crimson Tempest spreads the Garrote and Rupture from your current target to 5/8 enemies in 10 yards, at 25%-50% their duration (subject to tuning).
Further, bring a talent in that says “Applying a bleed effect to your target extends the duration of current bleed effects on the target by 2 seconds. Applies to Garrote, Rupture and Crimson Tempest”.
DTB does not need a nerf. Arterial Precision needs to just AOE increase nature damage taken, and not bleeds. Instead, give us a Poison that increases bleed damage taken by the target.
Exsanguinate energy drain needs to be capped.
Thistle Tea can be moved up the tree with the mastery component removed
In place of it, bring on a talent that makes SND passive and makes it restore 2 energy/sec, or 1 energy per melee hit, whatever.
Shadow Dance has no place in the rogue general tree. Put Death From Above in it’s place, finisher which does the same as Envenom/Dispatch/Eviscerate and replaces them, but with a bit more damage and a travel component.
Sudden Demise should be 100% of mob remaining health, 200% in pvp only. If it is to be an Assa execute, at least make it an efficient one, not a crutch that still wastes damage.
Alacrity gating Deeper Stratagem / MFD is horrible, always was.
ER really needs to go. At this point, just put Sepsis in it’s place, it’s already in all the spec trees.
swap atrophic/numbing with cheat death/elusiveness
6 Likes