120 also win Lyn and Moon lots of times. Also what is the point of nerf banshee when both 120 and happy rarely use banshee. UD players across all levels rarely even build Temple of the Damned in the first place. With the current 1.35 update, all other UD players will have no way to play this game, while happy and 120 continue winning titles. UD have to finish game within 20 minutes, or will lose. All the balance update that nerf UD after 20 minutes is meaningless. UD is already the worst race after 20 minutes, UD’s opportunity window is 12-20 minutes, when lich get orb of corruption, that is it.
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Overall, this game has lots of depth and unfortunately real balance require way too much effort and skills, given how tiny the number of people play this game. If Blizzard keeps listening to that 2 EU twicher and their community, they will destroy this game. 1.30 balance is fine, 1.34 is slightly worse but still fine. 1.35 ptr is seriously a joke. If they really want balance, only slightly adjust the number, do not create something new. I know it is fun to see something new, but this game is very complicated, without great amount of effort, new stuff will quickly become neither imba or useless. And given how tiny number of people play/watch this game, will blizzard give that amount of effort? No. So better not create something new.
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I agree, I don’t know where they got the idea they needed to change so much. The balance has not been that far off, even after the previous changes made. The PTR patch messes with stuff that I’ve not known people to have any real problems with.
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You are not considering that banshees are one of the last game supports undead adds. Is like saying that inner fire rifles is weak because its not used very often. I think that banshees are a bit strong (at least vs hu), but most games are decided before the undead can reach that, so we do not see them.
Even if AMS is not strong, its a tier 2 spell with no counterplay. I think that changing that is ok. Maybe keep its power (although I do think is a bit strong) but allow a counterplay. Im ok with a hero ultimate not having a counterplay, but I do think all unit spells should have one. At the moment there is no way around AMS. Possesion is also a good spell, but already has a counter play. You can use staff or focus the banshee. Having a counter play in most cases is the correct way to do it.
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To Blizzard, I understand this game Warcraft3 have a tiny pool of players, so there is nothing to lose with these random changes. I, along with many people on this thread, is not suggesting to nerf/buff a certain unit because we happen to use that units/race. I am suggesting that you guys avoid make random changes, without give a reasonable thought.
I just give one example: The statue Spirit Touch mana restore reduced from 3 to 2. Undead player across all levels already rarely use Banshee or Necromance. Now with this update, both banshee and necromance is dead, no one will use it. And undead will force to even more rely on lich as hero because only lich can restore magic without statue. Statue is the only way UD restore magic, all 3 other races can buy potion from shop in tier1. With this change, UD which is already the least versatile race in terms of strategy, are forced to become even more lack of choice, concentrated on the single combo of DK/Lich/Fiend/Statue/destroyer/Orb of corruption. You see, one change, can have so many impacts. And all other nerfs you made to undead, is meaningless. Because the appear rate of banshee, Abomination, Necromancer, frost Wyrm, Meat Wagon is very low, at best 10% in total. What is the point of making these already disappearing units even more unusable?
I know it is still a testing/beta version, but at least give these changes a thought before releasing, to avoid people laughing.
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PTR Build 19805
We’ve just updated the PTR with a new build. Reminder: all updates are subject to change. Please keep in mind that some of these changes are more experimental than others.
Balance
General
- Reverted Tavern revive cost 5% increase.
Orc
- Reverted Headhunter lumber cost from 30 to 20.
- Headhunter build time increased from 20 to 22 seconds.
- Blademaster Mirror images damage increased from 10 to 15% of the Blademaster’s base damage.
- Great Hall build time reduced from 150 to 140 seconds.
- Brute Strength bonus reduced from 150 to 125 HP.
- Farseer Feral Spirit mana cost increased from 75 to 85.
- Farseer Chain Lighting mana cost was reduced from 120 to 110.
Human
- Siege Engine armor reverted back to fortify.
- Siege Engine targeting change reverted back to only structures.
- Animal War Training reverted back to having Castle requirement.
- Orb of Fire damage reduced from +10 to +5.
- Orb of Fire cost reduced from 325 to 250.
Night Elf
- Immolation mana drain per tick increased from 5 to 6.
- Immolation damage was reduced from 10/15/20 to 8/12/18.
- Druid of the talon crow form mana cost reduced from 50 to 25
- Druid of the claw starting mana reduced from 125 to 100
Undead
- Lich Frost Nova Damage reverted back to 50/100/150
- Lich Frost Nova now has a damage cap of 400/800/1200 (8 units)
- Lich Dark Ritual cooldown increased from 15 seconds to 25 seconds
- Haunted Goldmine build time reduced from 120 to 110 seconds
Items
- Circlet of Nobility toggle functionality change reverted (Will give +2 to all stats again)
- Wand of Mana Steal reduced from 75 to 65
Improvements and Bugfixes
- Added additional zoom levels (1750,2100,2250)
- Can now view other players’ profiles from arranged match history
- Fixed an issue where if you zoomed out too far on specific maps the player would lose visibility
- Fixed an issue where quitting a singleplayer game sends the player to the load saved games
- Fixed an issue where saving a custom campaign resets string data
- Fixed an issue with Custom Campaign loading screen text being misaligned
- Fixed an issue where the custom game list names bleed into the ping category
- Fixed an issue where the editor would crash upon saving a campaign without a map opened
- Fixed an issue where the world editor would crash when editing the damage/defense table
ty for FS buff. dont need the wolves around tier 2 timing anyways #chainlightningwaveGG
… Why revert Headhunter changes? Like adding two seconds for their spawn time is going to change much in general…
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However Patch 1.35 turns out after meta settles, BIG PROPS to the @Warcraft3 team for how they handled the Patch.
Drop Iteration
listen to community feedback
Adjust
Drop new iteration
Repeat
That’s way better than 1,5 years ago when we had the last balance patch
5 Likes
When are you fixing the custom game lobby chat bugs?
- When someone changes player slots the chat deselects, whether it’s swapping, leaving, manual changing, or joining.
- The chat doesn’t always update.
And more stuff which I wrote before but I cba repeat for ppl who don’t read.
20 years of playing Warcraft 3, and I just learned that Wand of Mana Steal saps 75 mana, thanks to these notes.
(now reduced to 65 in this PTR).
Always thought it was 50… O_o
Also, why are they NERFING immolation ?? As a non-NE player who absolutely HATES the DemonHunter, this change baffles even ME…
Honestly… WHY? O_o
I’d be happy to see actually a BUFF to immolation, as long as the DH gets nerfed in other places, to compensate… 
Stop with this nonsense please, UD worse race after 20 minutes lol. The fact UD can bully Hu, Orc and NE on one base while the others almost have to have an expansion just to stay alive is ridiculous. UD needed a nerf and you know it xd
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You read the patches notes wrong, immolation got a big buff. The tick damage is now every 0.5 seconds not every 1.0 second now, the damage was essentially doubled.
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I’m glad to see a lot of the more wild changes are gone. Tweaks are all that are needed, not conceptual revamps of things that have been in the game forever.
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Well that’s good, now that there’s a cap on the number of units, along with slowing their ability to regain mana, you could probably turn nova up slightly. Compare with MK’s second ability.
Balance issues aside. There are good fixes in this update but more still are critically needed. There is the data caching problem that makes it a lot more bothersome to try to enjoy custom games. Lots of maps track stats and stuff and the current state of things compromises the integrity of that unless you close the client every time you play a particular custom game. Plzzzzzzzzzzzzzz fix.
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The Immolation mana drain is per second, not per tick. War3 has 8 ticks per second.
The tool tip is still wrong for Immolation. It’s damage is per .5 second, not per second.
With the way it’s currently going they will revert everything back to 1.34 lmao
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Well, given that you think UD is so good, why don’t you use UD? I play Orc as main option now and have fun. Only small complaint is 40% of match is orc mirror, which I still find it a lot easier than UD vs Orc.
And when my Orc face UD of similar MMR(similar level), it is so easy. I know the opponent UD have only one way to win. I have so many methods to stop the opponent get into that way. Just to mention one way, I can just have blademaster and just keep building Fortified armor tower starting tier 2, across the gold mines on the map. And when UD use up his only goldmine, I build whatever I want to finish the game.
Or I want to finish the game earlier? Just load 1.35 PTR and get Mirror Image blasdemaster with 15% damage.
Or Opponent complain I only use one hero and build tower and expand? replace tower with pure Raider units and enjoy unlimited Ensnare. When I see the component UD, use unlimited Ensnare to trap opponent DK at one spot, press 1 for my group, right click to attack DK. Done. DK is dead, the rest of UD group is a piece of cake now.
Only complain is only 1 out of 10 games I can see one UD.
I can comment whatever, just like anyone can comment whatever, in a respectable manner.
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Fix the freaking FPS Problem caused since 1.33, it is due to SD GFX being rendered on CPU instead of GPU on hybrid GPUs
So i’ve spent hours playing the PTR and training my heroes (I have a sequence where I go around the map, collect money and train my heroes, I’ve reached ~50 full cycles which means roughly 50 full upgrades for str, agi and int to each hero).
Latest PTR update decimated all my saved games, but not only that - it reset my stats also for the acts that I did make it to, so my heroes start from their basic stats and without chen.
Update: I’ve decided to uninstall everything and requested a refund.