Poll: 12 unit selection - remove it or keep it?

General Discussion
1

strawpoll . com/zwcyhc2r (remove the spaces)

Poll some guy made, posting here as well. In my eyes it wouldn’t change much - good players will still use multiple groups but new players will benefit from it greatly. I say get rid of it or expand it.

9 Likes
2

Lol… Loophole. I have no idea if that is actually okay or not… :thinking:

3

Remove the cap completely, changing it for some modes but not the other will hurt the game more than help it. People will get used to it, being unlimited in custom games, then will get frustrated and unmotivated to play standard online.

I know it sounds like a good idea, to have a limit in some modes, and have unlimited in others. But all modes need to be kept the same, or it will cause problems

19 Likes
4

This, at least in campaign. I’m 100% anti-cap, but I would rather have it unified if we aren’t getting rid of it.

5 Likes
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I played the original and I was not good at it, so I sorta got outraged at the idea of removing the unit cap going “well now even if I get good at Reforged I’m still not good by WC3 original standards”…but the thing is…I never would have gotten that much better.
I’m mostly looking forward to playing the new age version of the campaign, and maybe I’ll tinker with multiplayer for a bit before dedicating myself entirely to custom games.
If what you’re reading here feels familiar maybe you’re in the exact same situation, and I think it’s not out of the question to reach the same conclusion I did: remove the unit cap. It’ll make life easier for most people, and it was basically only a limitation of the technology available back in the early 2000s anyway. This limitation does not define WC3.

5 Likes
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The cap was probably only there because it’s more work to make an unlimited cap. (Fixed vs dynamic arrays, lots of UI design and code to deal with displaying large groups).

This should be seen just like other computer-or-dev-power-related restrictions (eg: low-poly models, lower resolutions, low entity limit, low map size, hotkey restrictions). Fixing selection size is just like fixing those.

I haven’t heard anyone argue that balance will be greatly affected. It does however reduce the APM component of skill, making strategy more important (which IMHO is ideal).

Full flexibility should be given to custom maps though (including the option to remove groups altogether).

5 Likes
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The 12 unit cap is pointless. Honestly, it a no brainer to change it. Micro managing units is important regardless of where you can select 12 or more at the same time. Most great players use multiple control groups asnyway.

However, for most others it’s just a pain in the backside having to be limited to 12 units.

17 Likes
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Man I’m glad to see almost 50% supporting to take it off. :blush: Now let’s just hope Blizzard sees that poll too!

6 Likes
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i do think you underestimate the player base with that way of thinking
removal of 12 unit wont really harm the game and the story already teaches you to micro as long as you are not the type to use cheat code!

12 unit limit really feels pointless it wont get more new players and returning players that know how unlimited unit feels like gona lose interest becus of the limit aswell!

and yes starcraft 2 story mode and C&C teaches you to micro units anyways and they dont have unit limit aswell as other new rts game like northgard that game u need to micro units in anyway!

i think most people that are playing custom game knows very well how diffrent a custom games is from the standard games… not sure where you got that idea…

no i really think what unmotivate the new players and some returing players
is the 12 unit limit

people gona learn how to micro one way or another even if they have to lose to learn it

right now becus of 12 unit limit u see more tower defense and single hero type of custom games! i think the bigger player base in warcraft 3 is in custom game for good reasons single unit games wont make you frustrated on the unit limit

and saying 12 unit limit removal will do harm feels more like nostalgia talking

6 Likes
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I disagree with that assessment of players, it’s not like I’m going to stop playing “standard online” because I’m upset that I can’t do a specific thing in custom games. Players can and should understand the differences, and if simple unit selection is what would drive them away then they’d probably stop playing standard for all sorts of reasons that will exist regardless, like not being able to use DOTA heroes in Ranked.

1 Like
11

I am going to post this on every forum because people seem to not read them all XD

Looks like most people want more than 12 unit selection. The thing is sometimes you want to use some spells on the icons of the units (paladin heal for example). If you can select all your units…lets say 50 units…you will have 50 portraits on the screen…i don’t know how comfortable it would be.

But since a lot of people want to have more than 12 units selected there could be an option that allows you to customize:

  1. Number of units selected
  2. Size of the portraits
  3. How many columns/rows of portraits

That way those who want less units selected will have less…those who want more will have more.

12

No one is advocating for 50 portraits, we could have the same 12 per page as we have now.

2 Likes
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It seems like the issue is people think selecting more than 12 units will somehow break the game?

So far, not one person had made a logical argument as to why this would happen?

Also, provided the UI scales the unit frames it won’t have an impact on casting. Hell you could even compromise and only show a limited number of units with a priority in casters…however, even that seems pointless.

The reality is, good players will use many unit groups and micro manage armies to win. Absolutely nothing will be impacted on ladder by allowing average players to select all units

However, when you just want a monster mash versus A.I or a giant FFA battle, or any number of custom games then being able to select all is important.

Remember, not everyone plays games to be ultr competitive…there is a thing called fun!

6 Likes
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I think there are things you need to be careful of changing, even if they feel like bugs or technical restrictions, but this isn’t one of them… Having 13 units on the field, and only being able to select 12 of them is just plain annoying…

The only way I would be in support of a bug or technical issue staying in a game is if there was some direct benefit that people could point to, like say… bunny hopping in Quake. But I don’t see it with this…

How many units you’re able to select, or not select, is not what the game is about. Even if veteran players could select their whole army at once, they’re still going to do what they’ve always done and break things up into smaller manageable groups, and a change like this wouldn’t impact those players in any way.

If anything, this would make the game more noob friendly, and I don’t see anything wrong with that.

7 Likes
15

Was trying to complete starcraft 1 campaign only with zerglings…you guys dont know what pain is…i had 10 armies and it was not ENOUGH

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The options you gave were misleading… I’m in favor of an 18 unit selection cap, which wasn’t one of the 3 options.

1 Like
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You can chose 2 rows and 9 columns which is 18 if my math is good enough…so the option is there

18

Original Warcraft III has 2 rows and 6 columns.

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I guess the reason why they want to keep the cap is a technichal one. It is probably not possible or really hard to remove the cap in class Wc3. And they cannot increase/remove the cap in Wc3:Reforged and also implement balanced cross compatibility between classic and reforged.

It would probably be possible to increase the limit slightly (18 seems realistic, as that would only require minor UI changes in classic Wc3), but a change like that would not be enough to please the players who want the cap removed - so what is the point.

1 Like
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Can you link where Blizzard has said they want to keep the stupid 12 unit cap?

From everything I have seen they seem to want to improve these areas to bring the game into 2018.

Limiting selection is pointless IMO. Skilled players already use custom hot keys and micro small groups. So if they make it more friendly across the board there will be no change to high end play as a consequence.

So the logical answer is to get rid of the 12 unit limit for the sake of fun and ease of use!

6 Likes