Multiplayer Matching

With Orc Blades Of Steel,

I just purchased the WC3 Reforged Beta tonight :slight_smile: What I’d like to see the most from my investment, either now or in the future, is a solid multi-player experience.

Background: Both in childhood, in youth, and as adult, I’ve enjoyed Blizzard games, including, but not limited to: SC1/SC2, Diablo 1/2/3, Heroes of the Storm, WC3 ROC/TFT, and Hearthstone. As a casual player, RTS was one genre that always appealed to me, I always liked trying a variety of strategies, and trying to improve on them :slight_smile: Yes, there is much strategy in single-player, but multi-player, particularly quick team-matching system (4v4, 3v3, 5v5, 2v2v2v2, etc) always appealed to me better. It has elements of unknown, team aid, team defenses, coordination of attacks and forces, surprise, variety, just trying your best etc, adapting, and to me it was more fun and more challenging. I hope multiplayer is implemented well and will have plans to continue to improve :slight_smile: I’ve also enjoyed creating in the world editor, having released custom multi-player games for both WC3 and Starcraft II.

I remember back when TFT and ROC were new, being able to quickly find a new game, and seeing the levels of people you were up against, and your numeric level climb (even if slowly climbing) was rewarding. I liked how there was an instant multiplayer match and every game was another fresh try and you could refine and adapt strategy. Present day, similarly, I like how in Hearthstone Standard, that each game starts from scratch, is matched quickly, and I can adapt my strategy, say add/remove cards, from any dust I earn from salvaging.

As I mentioned in opening, is what I’d like to see the most from my investment, either present or in future, is a good multi-player experience. To me, one thing a good multi-player experience encompasses (1 of many) is: short-to-no wait times. Players should not have to wait many minutes, and hours, to find a game. If a long-wait is ever the case, there could be a notice to players saying, “hey we detect low activity right now, but this is your estimated wait, and here is a day and time that might be best for you, based on our gathered data and AI”. Players shouldn’t have to log in and out of servers to find the most active one. I feel the game should pull from as much of the player pool as possible to match too.

I enjoy playing in a random team the most, especially as a casual player looking to try out new strategies or get better at existing ones, though arranged teams are fun too, and I’d imagine many players prefer those. As a random team player, I didn’t mind playing against arranged teams, it just usually meant had to pump out T1 units, instead of other strategies I more preferred trying. It was worth the challenge though. Best when my team won, though still fun when lost.

I think rewards (progression, even if slowly) and fast solid smooth gameplay experience (even if losing) can help retain players and keep new players arriving and interested :slight_smile: I’m not expecting these things instantaneously… I believe the focus was on graphics and gameplay parity with the original, and ironing out bugs and getting a good baseline… but with time, I’m sure there are many casual players, who like me, want the game’s built-in matchmaking multiplayer experience to to be prime focus :slight_smile: I haven’t ran the Beta yet, so don’t know what the experience is currently, but I know there is always room for improvement.

Custom games in TFT were fun as well as multi-player back when there was no waiting. Start with a good base multiplayer experience. This leads to good competative game. If the core game is good and new players become familiar with the basic mechanisms first, this is one way they can expand to custom games and creation, like I did at TFT, and continue to grow community and interest.

Though I haven’t had time yet to try Beta, good multiplayer on WC3 reforged, to me, would also include handling a variety of the tricky scenarios that can and do occur in TFT like: [disconnects, idle players, bugs, lag, trolls/abuse, etc]. :slight_smile: So those all should be accounted\planned for in future. I’m repeating a little, but what will retain a lot of warcraft reforged players I feel, new, or casual, or veteran alike, is a good multiplayer experience: sturdy, fast, bug-free, fair, competative, rewarding, fun, sense of progression and improvement, fresh start and new challenge to every game :slight_smile: Also sense of humor, like hearthstone :slight_smile:

I liked that in the original game the new icons you unlocked :slight_smile: Maybe this time around it is new unit sound effects you unlock too :slight_smile: In reforged and new systems, progression should be important. That progression could be level numbers, or win count, or league advancement, or AI recognizing unique gameplay, or AI that can look at players chat and reward randomly to veteran players who help their team do their best, or unlocked cut scenes, or earned unlocked unit sound effects, or whatever other ideas might be considered and implemented. In my opinion its all about doing your best and having fun. All players like to improve, strategize, etc. And to survive and prevail (especially in custom games). And feel powerful. Hero’s with their items make the WC3 RTS a totally distinct type of fun. There could be advanced AI that could even offer optional tips in a replay recording (e.x. “here is one specific spot in the replay where the AI has detected you contributed the most in this game”, “here is one specific spot where the AI has detected you could improve”) :slight_smile:

As for un-even matching, maybe there could be a mechanism where in the first one minute of the game, if one of the many things that could go wrong happened: [someone didn’t join correctly, or was dropped, or crashed/bugged, or lagged, or was afk, etc] you’d have the option to have the game not count towards the other players stats or no longer be ranked, and play could still continue in an unranked fashion for fun. There could even be rewards for game completion, such as in hearthstone when you get gold for winning. Anyways, these are just some ideas to consider :slight_smile:

Another idea is having new types of multiplayer matchmaking that support uneven teams (of different skills) or paired FFA’s :slight_smile: So if you like team games like 4v4s and 3v3s but want additional flexibility to match players of different skill bases, there could be (4vs2 or 3v3v2 or such) that was built into the search for games feature . From my experience releasing a custom game, I discovered most people like and want even teams, though. But that’s not to say there could be a matchmaking challenge mode where once you reached a certain pro level, you could face off 1v4 casual players, and get a reward :slight_smile: This could solve a challenge of high level players waiting… I’ve also supported paired FFA (e.x.2v2v2v2), which had a lot of people joining at the time, cause it was different, so this would be a fun mode to support, where in-it, arranged teams could join, and also solo players could be matched with a random partner too, for players that would like to try FFA with a team-twist. But before tackling other modes though, I just think 4v4 would be good to nail down solid though. Haven’t had a chance to play yet, so don’t know what’s been done or not already. I’m sure there’s cool stuff that will surprise me. Looks great from what I’ve seen! But am looking forward to the release and when I get a chance to play. Thanks. Great job tackling everything you have so far and good job and keep it up. P.S. Go Orcs! Work Work. Attack! For the Horde! :slight_smile:

1 Like

“Another idea is having new types of multiplayer matchmaking”

a 6v6 and 12v12 playlist or 24 player ffa playlist would be great fun.

And yes you can do this in the original wc3 Warcraft 3 - 12 vs 12 - YouTube

1 Like

It sounds great but think of the strain on the hardware. It would be a slideshow.

I will wait for the film better… you talk too much without say nothing

why do you write like this? this is the internet, nobody wants to read a book, just get to your point… did you forget to mention that it would have also been nice to have had in the past, too? what about yesterday? or in an hour from now? why did you have to keep repeating “either in the present or the now or the maybe later time frame”

whats do you think is broken about the multiplayer experience? you know the beta is far from complete and that many features are missing from the beta right? you should probably hold off on judging the game or requesting new features until the game is release, which is only like 3 days away now. At this point, its not like blizzard is going to read your post and think “oh, we need to get on this stuff now before we release the game”

I would try to answer your questions but Im not about to read a 5,000 word essay when I cant even figure out what you are asking for within your first 2-3 paragraphs. Most of your requests like for 6v6 already exist, but they will never be part of the Ranked Ladder system

Next time you want to discuss “Matchmaking” you need to be more specific about the differences between ranked and unranked. If you ever played the Classic original TFT game, you would know that many gamemodes are not played much anymore, Ranked 3v3 was unplayable for many years prior to the beta because not enough people play the game anymore, But you can always play and host private unranked games which is how people play 6v6. So asking for a Ranked 12v12 gamemode is like asking blizzard to make 10million people play the game, and thats just not going to happen

instead of writing a book on all your various ideas, you could try reading other forum posts that share similar ideas, such as this one…

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/warcraft3/t/penalty-system-for-abusers-option-to-replace-leavers-with-cpu/

now this is just dumb, you get Icons and Ranks in WC3 for winning, I dont even understand what you are saying, why would we get gold for winning?

blizzard already sold a bunch of dumb skins for other games in the pre-order bonus “Spoils of War” and ya know what? most people hate it, because why would we buy WC3 if we want content for other games? If I want content for hearthstone, I can go buy stuff for hearthstone, but dont force hearthstone or wow or any other crap into this game

this just seems like incoherent rambling IMO, do you think you work as a director at blizzard and are giving advice to the devs? none of this has any relevance to anything. THE GAME RELEASES in 3 DAYS THEY WONT DO THESE THINGS NOW YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN AROUND HERE YEARS AGO

thats brilliant! why didnt anybody think of this before? what would we have done if WC3 shipped without other ideas to consider for implementation? you just saved WC3!

You know that combining AT and RT is the most unfair unbalanced way to play a game like this? its completely unfair to allow AT players to go against RT players, and if they allowed that it would cause less people to play the game. There will never be an AT/Ranked 2v2v2v2 gamemode, thats what custom games are for

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/warcraft3/t/dont-mix-arranged-team-with-random-team-why-it-is-a-mistake-to-do-so/

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/warcraft3/t/allow-to-search-multiple-gametypes-at-random/

Try reading some other posts and actually learn about the game before writing your next book please :slight_smile:

2 Likes

Ouchies… One question nobody seems to ask, how this “small team” that actiblizzard put to reskin wc3 will fix the inminent maphackers?

Thank you for the feedback. Apologies for being long-winded. No need to be condescending- I’m very experienced with classic, both playing it and especially with designing custom multiplayer team games for it.

I wasn’t asking anything. As a returning player, I was giving my opinion on what I’d like to see be given focus- the multi-player. As you also mentioned, classic back when I played, didn’t have high enough user base, so my experience with the matching system then was the ambiguous and long “searching…”

Had a chance to try out Beta. I liked the Versus Portraits awarded for wins. Good progression example there.

Beta seemed to match quickly for me, which is good. Some matches didn’t start, or crashed, or desync, which is bad though, and can be improved on.

There were initial issues with my game UI not displaying. Also, reforged is not a toggle option for me (when hardware acceleration on). These issues are likely just due to my setup though. I’m using an unsupported VM (Windows 10 parallels), since I’m on an older mac, which doesn’t support battle.net. It is what it is. The menu UI is working now, and I’m happy using the classic mode in reforged.

Agreed RT & AT better separate [for ranked play]. Yes, for large FFA’s, custom games has traditionally been the route. Still favor RT-Paired-FFA mode (e.x. 2v2v2v2), as a mode I think could catch on, and be relatively easily to implement. FFA exists, so paired-FFA matching would be cool IMO. Combines FFA strategy with power of team and multiple races.

NetGuru, good concern. IMO, one solution would be having the editor (and game) support an output format that creators can export their map to from the editor, that is protected only, such as .w3xp, read only by the game. A secondary solution, IMO, could be to have the editor support a password that creators can set (to protect map from opening), and store your password on the server. In the past, I had used a third party tool to “protect” the map, which is really only damaging the map in a format that only the game can read, and not the editor. Instead of this, the best type of protection, IMO, would be if protection was built-into the editor\game\server. Having official versions on the servers, under the creators name, is good. When I created starcraft maps, I liked how there was a history of all the versions you uploaded on the server (and when iteratively developing and testing, there’s many updates). I also liked how you were able to host your games with various mods applied to your game, such as zombies (which you’d test the mod for compatibility in development too).

Game has always been fun :slight_smile: Good job. I like the loading screen texts. Looking forward to release! Please keep any future posts positive- I can do that. Be happy to. Work, work. :slight_smile: