BWAPI with Starcraft Remastered NEWEST VERSION

General Discussion
1

So many of you know that it is possible to play against certain created AI by the community, universities,freelancer, or whoever through the BW version 1.16.1 of Starcraft.
Often a total mess, when you are new to it and actually have no real clue what you are doing…
After somehow managing it, you face the big problem that you Mouse accuracy will be totally different and maybe your Hotkeys are not the “orginals”.
All things that Starcraft RM gave us …

So you thinking: Basicly “training” or having fun trying to beat some of those “hard” ais

It will actually not be quite so much fun or practise …

THese are only some of the problems you will face …

Wouldnt it be cool, if Blizzard cooperates with all those people and helps them somehow, in some way, so we all can enjoy those super hard AIS on the newest versions of Starcraft RM ?
I even think, this could lure some players back to the game or some new ones …
It would also help those people, who arent interested in the multiplayer experience…
IT would help all those amazing people, building their AIS and letting them compete against each others…
AND it would make the AI more reliable as training partner or fun partner …

For me, as a kind of new player that came back to this game through RM, going back to the version 1.16.1 is just really hard mainly because there is basicly not a friendly user interface.
Not so many options to change things fast, the application crashes a lot of times when iam trying to play against an AI, all those applications Chaoslauncher, BWCHART, BWetc.
To much to digest…
THen you put your AI scripts, dll dokuments into the V. folder and the game just crashes…

All this!!! Only to play a little bit, with a totaly different mouse feeling for some reason … No menu in the main page , etc.

THis makes me really appreciate the RM version … XDD

So, this is a kind of petition to BLizzard and the community …

IF we do not get something like that, or until we get it …
I would like to open this as a topic to get all important information to make this possible with the least contrast with the two game versions and as easist as possible…

How to play against AI computers :


…
THis worked for me a bunch of times, but the last trys just ended in crashed after starting the created game -> so the countdown comes and the AI window just crashes…
…
I guess you can put your own Hotkeys through Chaoslauncher, but i havent looked into it yet …
…
Mouse accuracy is off, it is not the same as in Starcraft RM … -> Dont know what to do about that …
ok, this quite difficult … to be honest. …
If you turn off Cpu throttling and put mouse scroll(in 1.16.1) to your RM, i think you are good off … But iam actually not quite sure it is the same some of you maybe could look into it, it is just f. hard … Some kind of programm would be nice here … Also you can put on, one of the RM options, in the menu that gives you the same feeling that 1.16.1 has with cpu throttling on, in th (1.16.1 version) …

thx for effort, take care …

Edit later post of Moataz talks about a better way …
link :slight_smile:

…
And …
"
@The100YOU, @Leonix:
Sorry 2 say guys that u 2 r following ancient methods dealing with BWAPI, the vid mentioned above is very old and very confusing and very limited !!!
.
With BWAPI Revamped , u just extract a compressed file, double click an icon, and BAM ! u r in BWAPI:

U can also try BWAPI Revamped with an isolated ICCUP ver http://files.theabyss.ru/sc/starcraft.zip if u want to test in a clean environment…"

2

BWAPI is on blizzards to-do list. It’s just a lower priority for now.

Clans, BWAPI and Team Match Making are all on there.

It would be fun to play against a tough AI, but nothing compares to beating another human player… AI just never have the same feel as a human.

BUT still. It’ll eventually come.

3

Hope so, certainly …
2vs 2 Still not there … Didnt they say Starcraft would launch with it, when they annouced it … ?

Iam not so much into those annoucer packs and skins, and i dont care if they realize them first, but it is worring that they are puting so much effort into those …

THose RM need more money making for BLizzard, so they put more employers on it ?

4

Ok i have to answer to this because this is my dear subject.

I have been talking about BWAPI in forums since a decade it seems now, its been so long…

BTW leonix, the best way to run BWAPI is to have a Virtual Machine, the way it works for me i have a small shortcut in the desktop with different AI that work for me in fighting spirit etc, i double click and it is already in the game room waiting for me to press OK and start the game. Is not that easy to do this, because most virtual machines would crash if you load a state with a program opened.

In this virtual machine you must have the “multi-instance” opened and running, all your keyboard and mouse settings, 1.1.6 installed (of course) etc… it works like a charm. I can send you the virtual machine file which is huge… because is the virtual hardrive also.

Now, BWAPI has been announced as a “lower” priority in the 2019 priority list, which honestly breaks my hearth. There are some reason why BWAPI is not a priority, and some other reasons why well… they dont want people to play Starcraft Remastered offline too much as you can probably understand.

In other words, if they would implement BWAPI as an offline feature it is possible that a big chunk of players would avoid playing online, and there is also the possibility that people would pirate the game just to play vs AI.

Now what ReasOn says is 100% true, no AI is like playing a human, but is great to restart a game, play over and over again etc… AI are stupid, they are not programmed to be as good as PRO players, adapt to whatever they are scouting as a good player would do. What i am trying to say is that playing AI wont necessarily make you a good player…it might even give you some “bad habits” on what the game really is.

with that said BWAPi is a feature of highly importance to the community for several reason, and i will state them here in order:

  1. It would give training grounds to people that want to practice without losing points.

  2. It could potentially make the campaign harder, considering the community would create AI for each mission, making playing the campaign much more interesting again giving the product new value.

  3. It would BOOST the overall interest in the community regarding streams and other Starcraft media entertainment aspects. Who wouldnt want to see how someone like Rain plays vs the Best AI there is out there, etc…

  4. It would create a community of AI designers, or better said, spread and make bigger the one that already exist (BWAI competition channel)

  5. It would give reason for people to re-install the game, those that played during the original hype of the game but now are bored and have the game forgotten.

  6. It would create a “tie” between the Starcraft Remastered community and the AI computer science community, as it did for SC2 with deep mind for a short period. AI is going big next years, it would be a great step in the right direction to invest in API that allow people to play with AI both for the longevity of Starcraft in the long run (as a student tool) and for the community overall to show the world how hard is to create an AI that wins a Korean pro (the world is ready to discover that making an AI for Broodwar is far more difficult that making one for a MOBA)

  7. It would help people train some aspects of the game that sometimes are hard to practice online because of lag, particularly micro and multitasking (Imagine being able to play vs a great AI in slow speed then go up notch by notch) just to practice a build, some players know early game, but they dont even get to play middle or latter game in a real build with perfect timing which is a life changing experience.

  8. There are a LOT of BWAPI bots out there, hell the community is at least as old as 2004.

And now what is my suggestion on how to deliver this feature:

  1. Make BWAPI work as simple as droping a map or a replay to a folder. Just have a new folder called: SCAI and let use drop the .dll and the script right there, then go to custom. if we are choosing a map that is NOT meant for the AI warn us etc… common sense.

  2. Talk with the developer of ScmDraft 2 (Sinsanity) for the posibility of developing a Scmdraft 3 that allows this and some other features modding and playing around. (Very unlikely, but this is the correct way to go).

  3. POLEMIC: include an option in RANKED online so people can play humans and AI if they like to, some times waiting times can be long, just give people an option to launch an AI game quick, whether this should count as points in the RANK, i doubt it, maybe a different ladder? or simply less points?.

  4. Adapt BWAPI in such a way so people can create online games with AI also, either as team mates or against to. This is also polemic, but casual players like me would like such a thing.

  5. Give us a simple “very easy - easy - normal - hard - very hard - GOSU” slider when playing both the campaign and any custom map. Yes, there are BWAPI that are capable of playing almost ANY map, they are a buggy mess, but some seem to work just fine.

  6. Let the community build training UMS maps and eventually integrate those in a “Training Mode”. The community will make it, the developers will just make an offline UMS mode.

  7. DONT MAKE BWAPI FREE, that way you will avoid a big chunk of potential piracy issues. Make it LOGIN ONLY also but please make it a fair price, is not ethical for instance that it ends up costing up 50% of the product price (15 bucks or 10 bucks), so 5 is fine.

  8. This is a great opportunity to launch an “Achievement system” (related to point 3), this generation whether we like or not likes Achievements, even more than winning other humans online, just trow them into a game vs an AI.

Thats it, i just felt like writing a long wall about BWAPI today, kill me if you didn’t like it, we can dream, i can dream, you can dream also.

This will never be… but i am sure there are other several reasons why BWAPI is a great idea beyond what i just said, for instance it would be nice to just pause a game in custom and just come back latter and the game is on with no un pausing… WAIT there is no pause in custom games???..implement it please is a weird thing not to have.

1 Like
5

custom game … Just open the menu (f10) and it is paused …
and in multiplayer there is a pause button and the menu…
Dont know what you mean with that …

thx for your inside …
Would appreciate if you could talk more about the problem with mouse accuracy and hotkeys and the how to deny crashing of Ai Starcraft window in the 1.16.1 version …

6

I mean you cant pause custom games, forget about it, you can open the menu, but i like pause because you can move around and think then un pause while everything is black and white. Forget about it is not relevant.

So you understand what a Virtual Machine is?, i guess not let me explain.

There are some programs that allow you to “emulate” Operative Systems, so you can lets say have older versions of Windows running inside a window in your Windows 10 installation, just like any other application. So that is how i roll when running Broodwar 1.16. I dont run it on my main Windows 10 Installation, i run it in a Virtual Machine with Windows XP Service Pack 3 installed.

So once the Windows XP is installed i setup Starcraft Broodwar 1.16 with the chaos launcher, open the “multi instance” and load the BOT that i want to play against, obviously load the map etc, then launch Broodwar 1.16 and go all the way to LAN or UDP see that the BOT is there already and then take what is called a “Snapshoot” of my Virtual Machine, which is like saving a particular moment in my Virtual Machine state.

Then i save all of that in a Shortcut in my Windows 10 Desktop and when i double click it everything is loaded and the only thing i have to do is press OK !.

The advantages of doing this is that Broodwar 1.16 is not running the annoying old Window Mode Addon, but in fullscreen, also VMware (which is the program i use) is very stable on the snapshots and allows movement of the mouse inside and outside of the Virtual Machine Window, drooping and dragging things into the Virtual desktop etc. Also i set the resolution to a particular size that i like and TADAA !!! i have Broodwar 1.16 with Iccup (haven’t visited Iccup in almost a year) and other bots to play at a single click, also something i LOVE about VWware is that it allows to have all of this in borderless mode, which looks awesome. I modified a few things for my convinience, when the Virtual Machine is opened i can move the mouse inside and outside of the virtual machine which is a great pluging, but before i press OK i have a special hotkey that is “hostbutton + alt + m” which tells the virtual machine that i want the mouse to stay inside the Windows XP window.

Its all very easy to do, if you are using windows 8 and 7 you can have virtual machine right now !!, if you have Windows 10 well… you will need to have the PRO version.

I hope you understood. If anyone is interested in this i can write a step by step tutorial on how to accomplish this, i love doing things like that.

7

With the current pace of development, just give it around 5 more years, and it’ll happen. In a year, we’ll have the dynamic turnrate finally fixed, proper non-regionlocked 1v1 MM with a more robotst network infrastructure. 2 years from now, we’ll have team matchmaking, 3 years from now we’ll have clans and unified gateways, 4 years from now all the extra stuff we had with 1.16, and 5 years from now this as well :smiley:

8

THx, a guide would be really helpfull, not only for me but for others that are interested to do this aswell…
I actually have some experience with WMvirtualmachine, but it is years old, not sure how you would make a shorcut to start all applications on one click …

(I will try to update the inicial post with some links)
Best supported by some links for WMvirtual machine and xpwindows 3 pack …
So it is all together … Well, only the Questionmaker can put links in the question, right ? So i guess i would need to put them up … but yeah

Thx for your effort and time… I really appreciate it …
Thx

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Its crazy you take the time to write this all up but dont take the time to read the to do list where they already said they are going to do exactly what your essay of ignorance stated.
Wow.

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Why? what do you get by being mean?, that only show YOU ARE THE IGNORANT, because you have no idea how to be nice.

Is because people like you that the world is burning right now.

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??? Lol, and you apparently dont read the complete question …

So, tell me, how are you better?

This is a question to guide those who want to know how to play against AIs…
By the way, i already read that list before, but what does it serve me or any other person to see what they are going to do it, if these processes need many more years ? Lol, and what is the problem to demand for it multiple times ?
Some must do it with the goal to make the developers get their priorities right…
On the other hand, it is just sad to see people like you, who kick the effort done by other only to saticfy their little ego for a short moment. With the intention to feel powerfull and intelligent, two things you seem to have a problem with…

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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Remember, that doesn’t make you less of a good person. Not that you care of course you are to poisoned already.

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@The100YOU, @Leonix:
Sorry 2 say guys that u 2 r following ancient methods dealing with BWAPI, the vid mentioned above is very old and very confusing and very limited !!!
.
With BWAPI Revamped, u just extract a compressed file, double click an icon, and BAM ! u r in BWAPI:

U can also try BWAPI Revamped with an isolated ICCUP ver http://files.theabyss.ru/sc/starcraft.zip if u want to test in a clean environment…

BWAPI was very hard to configure before, I just mentioned the only video that talks comprehensively about it :muscle:

The100YOU, I don’t know why u insist on using VM when dealing with BWAPI, and u still think BWAPI only runs in W-mode ? u just uncheck the addon buddy, it’s just an option for testing purposes and easiness only (not for playing), we’ve talked about that b4.
And with 1.16 you can run the classic graphics (SD) in fullscreen, filling your huge widescreen with no black bars right/left, unlike SCR.

BWAPI has a connection mode called “Local PC”, u don’t have to use LAN/UDP, u don’t have to have another PC or VM to play multiplayer!

@fazek42, they also need 5 more years to secure BWAPI, not to be used as an automation tool or maphack memhack (I mean anyone can use Locutus/SAIDA to play instead of him in ICCUP and gain the points, without touching mouse/keyboard !), I just hope my children will see BWAPI in SCR :sob:.

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@Moataz
The answer is quite simple with virtual machine i can:

  1. Double click an item and load the game INSIDE THE MENU JUST TO PRESS START, like i have Figthing Spirt icon and Python icon for diferent bots, so if i want to play “Iron bot” in Fighting Spirit i just double click that Virtual Machine and i only press OK.
  2. Not that i think it runs on window mode, i want it to run in window mode “borderless”, i dont understand what you are saying.
  3. I know 1.16 has no black bars, why did you assumed i did not knew that.

Now FUN FACT

  1. I installed BWAPI Revamped when it came out and it was great, been using it for Coach AI also, i mean i use it (Have not opened it in like 5 months), but the problem is that i love jumping into the game menu so much now… i am used to that and how my virtual machine is place perfectly in my central monitor etc, nothing personal against Revamped which is probably a better method.
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  1. I don’t get it, r u saying ur making a separate VM for every AI u want to play against ?
  2. Why u want to run it in w-mode “borderless”, while u can run it in fullscreen and ofc “borderless”?
  3. Because most games made before widescreen invention (2006 I guess), doesn’t fill the whole screen, unless u change a VGA setting in ur Windows (But Blizzard intentionally run it with black bars, to show players how bad 1.16 compared to SCR !), and many players doesn’t know how to make their games fill the whole screen.

What fun fact, I c u talking normally. @The100YOU

BTW anyone knows why when I reply to someone, he is not informed (unless I say @), is Blizzard has some kind of shadowban against their users ?

17

@Moataz

Hmm let me explain a bit in here, sorry if its long, i think is worth it because other people will read this in the future and i can help them install this how i have it, is quite useful.

So i use Virtual Machine with Windows XP Service Pack 3 because of several reasons:

  1. It allows me to have a Windowed Version that is “borderless” in which i dont need to minimize or alt tab, just like i do with Remastered, of course the game is Running in Fullscreen inside the Virtual Machine, but i can move my mouse inside and outsode of the VM window, “resize” and “stretch” as much as i want it. This is very ussefull, because 1.16 with the Chaos Launcher pluging in fullscreen moves everything in my second and third monitor, and well… takes the whole screen which is annoying for me. Also i am the kind of person that likes using Facebook and Watching a movie while i wait for a room to fill up so i have a small script that is use (Ctrl + Space + ç) to move the window from my second to first monitor (which also resizes to a bigger place) when i am about to start the game

  2. Another thing that i love about using Virtual Machines is that i can save states, this was actually REALLY hard to acomplish, because some Virtual software like Virtual Box simply crash when i try to save an state during a game and then load it. Then i learned to save states the correct way in Oracle Virtual. With this i have several icons on my desktop for particular Bots and settings i have for practice etc… just double click and Voila!! i have everything loaded in the exact place i left them, and i mean, i could save the state of a game that i was playing. You understand?

  3. Just to reiterate, Borderless for me is an obsession,i hate windows mode with the explorer.exe frames or the Wmode frames that are just awful and pointless, i prefer moving things with commands. I like my window to be at the center screen starting at point x = 0 y = 0 and then i scale it down to barely touch my task bar.

  4. I dont need to atl tab or minimize the game, because in Virtual Machine i can move the mouse outside just by using the “host keys”. But the thing here is that i have 2 mouses, one for the virtual machine and the other for my regular windows and that is the way i operate.

  5. I feel insulted that you suggested that i know how to change between window and fullscreen mode in Wmode XD, just kidding, i just realized that was what you where trying to say to me in your last post.

Sorry what is this? this flew over my head i dont understand it:

So yes, that is why i use Virtual Machine in my Windows 10 PRO, because it allows me to have somehow of a better experience, i really dont like playing Starcraft in Fullscreen because like i told you everything moves and i cant multitask without Alt Tabing and such, plus i get to save states and have multiple bots loaded just once and i can avoid loading the menu and doing all the .dll change name etc. I hope you understand. Cheers and thank yopu for replying.

We should make a tutorial on how to use Coach AI, i wanted to start playing that again, it was really hard for me i have some spare time noe and i wish to jump back again.

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1- Can you try these w-mode shortcuts and tell if any of them serves the purpose 4u: https://i.ibb.co/4gPdH5q/W-Mode.png
2- So u have several what for each AI, SC folders or whole VMs ?

I think the CoachAI is documented enough, it doesn’t need a tutorial, it needs more practice, more players streaming their games with it (ofc not in ICCUP ranked match !) or maybe for showing its in-replay capabilities, to spread the word.

Please accept this advice:
  • Try to be succinct in your words/expressions (I also waste a lot of my time but not in writing).
  • Use spell/grammar checker (like Grammarly addon for Google Chrome, it made me a lot better in English).
  • People might ignore/ridicule/hate u if u didn’t :ghost: or even if u did :joy:.
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@Moataz i am an english native speaker because my father is from Boston and i am an American citizen borne in the US just never lived there,

Also you need to review how you are standing on those reading skills, or try to read some literature or something (in English obviously) so you can practice comprehension, like, why are you advising me on using shortcuts to change between window and fullscreen mode?, i mean why?.

CoachAI need a tutorial here, i dont see any in here, i might do just that one day for this forums i think is worth it.

I have several states, go, install a virtual machine and try what i am describing in here, i dont see how you can understand any of what i said above if you never used a virtual machine before, trust me, is like running an emulator, that is exactly what i mean with “states” you know… those “save points” you can do at any point of an emulated game “state”?, well you can do the same with 1.16.

20

I was looking for ways to make the use of BWAPI Revamped more intuitive, by seeing how other players are using it.

Sorry, for the slight misunderstanding between us (I just hope Blizzard allows private messages between users, so we don’t need to mention every detail online, I guess they want us to talk, talk, talk)

I was practically using VMs since Virtual PC ~2006, I used Parallel, VMware, VirtualBox, Qemu, Hyper V, and I know about Snapshots, since a long time also, you just didn’t explain your configuration in details, but never mind.

CoachAI tutorial is here:

If u want to make a vid for it, ur welcome, but I guess its better to be a gameplay rather than a tutorial.

1 Like