Thors have quite large DPS and range advantages, so I am fairly certain they do.
Even if that is true, you should expect Thors to win consistently because of their range advantage.
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I found hydra lurker best combo to deal with Thor. Viper long ultra can work if flank.
As a Terran i 100% agree Thor are too strong in mono AA mod. But only at lower level because at highest level Viper counter them.
Up to a certain point, once mass thors hit the field even at the top level, the few times it has happened I thing I have only seen neural be somewhat successful since AA wrecks them. But I am sure you can deal with them with Ravager ling bane viper in the hands of the top players.
another game i got wrecked by mass thors and BC… why is it so overpowered ? why does Thor have the same range than brood lords, this does not make any sense at all
Hahahaha sweet zerg tears, thors are not that good. But i am not gonna tell you counters. Since you have probably 30 iq, you will lose all your games to mech hahahaha. REKT!!!
Imagine playing 2nd best race currently and complain about mech, which is not even that good…
I guess you wanna play against bio, because banes have free combat shield. So you can just split army into 2-3 parts and than f2 a move without any micro or skill and autowin…
And fly one op muta groud, while terran has to control 3 units groups at the same time and corner your mutas, while reparing turrets microing scvs, re-saturating mineral lines, repairing buildings, having perfect map awarness, perfectly split units against ground attacks. If you don’t have your army together against frontal attack you autolose, while zerg see whole map and control 1 group of mutas and inject with rapid fire on 10 minutes ahead…
I agree with the OP, “Archer” units are not supposed to beat similar priced Melee units. Archers are supposed to beat Air Units and provide a second line of offense behind melee units.
The Ultralisk should be balanced to beat Thors, because they cost the same thing, but Ultralisks are Ground-Only specialists. The 6 Armor Ultralisks currently do not beat anything on the Terran tech tree cost for cost. That was a very, very dumb revert blizzard made.
Currently, there is no reason for a Zerg to ever make Ultralisks, because everything beats them cost for cost.
3 Likes
If Thors were OP mass Thors would dominate pro level. Since they do not this means either
a) Terran pro player do not care about money and want to play nice or
b) Thors are not OP.
That something is hard to deal with at casual level does not mean it is OP. Carriers are OP if you are a gold player, but not against someone that can use all the tools the game provide you. Same thing with Thors.
If you let them mass up 20+ Thors you lost the game long before that. Same with Carriers.
4 Likes
LOL.
You think Pros do everything right?
I’ve watched pros for years, and they do stupid stuff like use the wrong, totally invalid, build order 4 games in a row and get beat 4 games in a row.
In Broodwar Pros do stupid stuff, like not training Queens vs Terran or Protoss, and then wonder why they can’t stop Tanks or Templars. Or Pro Terrans just mass 50 siege tanks vs other Terrans or vs Protoss, which is definitely the wrong thing to do, that won’t even work against the A.I, and it definitely doesn’t work against Public Noobs,
Ultralisk are supposed to be Zerg’s most powerful Unit, according to Abathur in the Zerg Campaign, and yet in Ladder they don’t appear to beat ANYTHING on the Terran tech tree cost for cost. and about the only thing on the Protoss tech tree that they beat would be Adepts.
Ofc pros don’t do everything right, for many reasons. E.g. parting complained that pros don’t know how to stop cannon rush properly, because they probably don’t care. Since how many times you get cannon rushed in pro game. So it depends.
That’s not how StarCraft has ever been designed. You are playing the wrong franchise. Try WarCraft 2.
No, Ultralisks are high armor splash damage units. By design, that is good for killing units like Marines and Zerglings that are very vulnerable to splash and deal damage in very low bursts; and bad against units that deal damage in much larger bursts (Marauders, Immortals, Thors, etc).
Ultralisks would have to be a broken unit for them to operate the way you want them to.
Hellions, Marines, Hellbats, Zealots, Zerglings, and Hydralisks all get slaughtered without anti-armor support (enough to kill the Ultralisks before they can slaughter) or something else to prevent the Ultralisks from getting close to them.
The Ultralisk’s stats are also very good for such a unit; which is why the usual complaint people have is about their pathing and collision.
2 Likes
Again another game against mass thors and a couple helions… this is becoming really annoying… why are thors so OP ?
TERRANS DON’T EVEN MAKE VIKINGS ANYMORE THIS GAME IS NOW COMPLETELY UNBALANCED, I HAVN’T SEEN A VIKING IN LIKE 30 GAMES WOW
You want to counter mutalisk ? make thors, you want to counter broods ? make thors… so why not remove vikings from the game ?! they are useless
Why dont you make lurkers? Heck even Vipers are good if they have thors. If they only have a few togetehr, Vipers are pretty tanky and have almost as much range so you can still pull small groups (3 or less) of Thors.
Even if they get siege tanks, you can out maneuver thors and siege tanks with adaptive talon upgraded lurkers.
1 Like
A Terran unit can beat 2 Zerg units? This is unfair! Nerf!
How about it can beat most zerg units and beat the only 2 tier 3 units we have as zerg ?
I copy the batz commentary from another thread, this is spot on keep the anti massive part but tone down the anti light clumping units like mutas =
Thors trade supply efficiently vs literally every single zerg unit that’s not a caster. The only zerg unit this is arguable for is lurkers, and even then thors have to engage from a choke/lurkers pre-concave for the zerg to win.
They need to tone down the aa, it doesn’t make sense for the thor to be decent vs all ground, being good vs clumping air units, and also hard countering air massive.
No they don’t GM and M players just micro those units and kill the ultralisk.
I’ve seen a GM kill 3 of the 6 armor Ultiralisks by microing 3 marines and running around circles off a vespene geyser and supply depot.
And something similar can be done with hydralisks vs a 6 armor ultralisk, you can just run around in circles and stutter-step the hydras around a structure, and kill 3 ultralisks with 1 or 2 hydralisks.
Just so you know, I’m very, very good at Warcraft II and Warcraft III. As in defeat max AIs without losing a Unit in Warcraft II, although I’ve only played Player vs Player one time in Warcraft II because I had a crappy internet connection back then, but I won the game. I’m level 30 in Warcraft 3 without practice. I don’t need to practice to get back t that level, even after 2 or 3 years of not playing the game.
In my Opinion, Warcraft 3 is a better, more balanced game than StarCraft 2.
Terranic:
You are Gold league. I vary between Number 1 Platinum and 50 Diamond, although I haven’t played any games on this account.
Look, I’m not saying Zerg needs an across the board buff, they don’t. IMO Zerg needs NERFS at tier 1 and tier 2, and needs buffs at Tier 3…or just nerf Larva Inject to 2 larva per inject, and give Ultralisks even more armor again and some kind of stampede/charge ability, like Kerrigan’s “Psionic Shift” ability.
Buff Ultralisks to 8 armor max and stampede.
Nerf Ravager by 25 minerals
Nerf Roaches to 2x8+1 damage
Nerf Marauder back to 2x10+1
Buff Battlecruiser’s Ground Weapon to have even faster cooldown. So 8+1 with ridiculously fast cooldown would do at least some damage even to an 8 armor ulatralisk….but primarily you’d just double yamato each Ultralisk.
Nerf Thor’s Ground Weapon (It isn’t needed, Terran has so many anti-ground units this is not needed).
He doesn’t get that. I play Random, and Zerg needs a tier 1 nerf, and a tier 3 buff of Ultralisks. The game has always been warped. I laugh when I see a GM train 6 armor Ultralisks vs Terran, because they’re just going to die before they even get off more than one attack.
In the campaign, Ultralisks Curb Stomp just about anything, in the cinematic, they soak siege tank’s weapons in the face, and stomp on tanks and crush them to bits. In the game, they get killed by cheaper siege tanks and generalist Thors.
It does not make sense that a generalist unit (thor) beats a specialist unit of the same cost.
Terran Already has several other hard counters to ultralisks:
Ghosts Steady Targeting
+3 Banshees (2x15 damage -2x6 = 2x9 damage penetration vs 6 armor ultras)
Battlecruisers with Yamato
Marines with runaround micro, lol.
Marauders curb stomp ultras (tier 1 vs later tier 3, which is dumb)
there are countless videos on the Internet for M and GM players defeating 6 armor Ultralisks using nothing but (a lower value) of Marines. the Zerg would have been better served just staying on BAnelings the entire game.
Because lurkers blow. Terran just scans and lols over them. As with cancerhost before them, much more deadly vs. protoss.
It’s just bad game design for units to wreck one race yet not another.
And it’s a shame about the ultras by the way. Blizz finally got it right. But you can see the effect the game killing terran whine cancer has.
The terran whiners managed to whine away the 8 armor ultralisk. Within 1 or 2 months iirc. It was pouring whine.
The game killing truth is, the tearans kept on whining none the less. And they eventually whined blizzard into making marauders back into retauders. Sad. Very sad really.
It’s ridiculous, now i see mass thors almost everygame, why?