Things That Don't Make Sense

Why im not surprised about dukenukem and platys xD instant whine :smiley:

What doesnt make sense - you can only put 8 marines in a medivac, but you can put 2 tanks in it, while tanks a much bigger than marines or even medivacs.

Or how does an ultra fit into an ovi.

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standing still is better than gaining detection and constipation at the same time

i really think overseers should be allowed to poop, if you gotta go you gotta go ok blizzard

i mean he always had double pistols at least it doesn’t get death blossom mega life steal fire shot like the other game

thors suck versus zerglings and locusts when they could just trample them
15 tempest at once shoot on them same marine!

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“I want free wins against Zerg every game and I’m going to cry my eyes out until Blizzard helps me”

Is anyone stupid enough to actually believe this?

You wouldn’t realize this in plat league but without queens being strong against hellions Zerg would lose every game instantly. Hellions are still much faster and regularly do game ending damage against mass queen.

Can neither confirm nor deny the statments above. I don`t feel any balancing issues regarding the unit tags, they are that way for balancing.
What is crazy though, is that ultra,collossus seem to have a smaller collision box than tanks, thors (is this intentional?). The former can fit through gaps, the latter can not.
Another thing is, why is it that obs and overseer got observing mode (more sight, stational), but raven did not? Is it because they have sensor towers?(probably).
On last thing that I feel like every Terran hurts the most is the missing spell AOI (u could argue ->EMP but its mostly for TvP (+energy depleting) and even then just temporary dmg). In the lategame it becomes very unlikely for T to win for that very reason. Sure we have the nukes, but their cost + chanelling time make them inferior to spell AOI.

Hmmm. That sounds pretty interesting. If anyone can check this in the editor that would be great!

Shhh. We don’t talk about this. Just let it happen.

I lost some PvP games to this. Turns out logic is illogical heh

Man there are some ridiculously mind numbing replies here.

I will say for the baneling part, it’s kinda similar to where the ravager morphs and becomes just biological.

They gave the hellbat a strong base attack so that it has a better chance of fighting non-light units as a front line tank. I think it’s just a tradeoff to switching modes.

Workers are stupid. You just gotta mineral micro them and hope they don’t mess up or move away from the close mineral fields.

Fun fact: Roach hard counters Helions.

Fast lings on creep do so as well. At least if you keep mineral investment same.

You dont need catch all unit. You have units perfectly capable of covering anything enemy can throw at you and best scouting of all 3 races.

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Most of your questions can be answered with the words “timing” and “counter” or “map control”.

So for example hellions do extra damage vs. late so you can pressure the zerg and force either queens (instead of drones) and even lings (high larva cost; slows down drone production; can be kited well by hellions) or roaches (very costly before 2 base or 3 base saturation, cost gas so slows down the zerg eco a lot if produced early).
Then hellions can get the blue-flame upgrade to make runbys more efficient (upgrade takes so time so if you hit a timing window where zerg can’t just make drones non-stop, you can get an advantage at battle for larvae and income / worker- & income lead the zerg tries to get).

BCs are kinda similar to Phoenix as the zerg has to stay very defensive and drone a lot with queens and spores and once there is a worker advantage, hydras or corruptors can start pushing the balance.

Also think about health or shields as some sort of “armor”. If you increase the base armor, big units like thors that should get countered by marines, lings or zealots, survive longer and thus create an imbalance where the other player can’t create a counter to efficiently destroy the thors.

So every time, you give an armor upgrade, you might make a few tactics less or even not viable and thus make the game less diverse.

So giving queens the light armor tag would mean that you HAVE to open roaches vs. hellions and you can’t buy time with queens to get a few more drones or defend your creep.
Every terran would open hellion/BC one base every time. That’s hardly a diverse game so it’s bad / not fun to watch.

Protoss units have a lot of health/shields compared to other units so a protoss unit surviving is very important - especially the tech units like immortals, collossi, disruptors, HTs or carriers as it costs time to get produce them / fill up the energy.

Also carriers can counter corruptors if the zerg doesn’t get flyer carapace vs. a protoss that chrono-boosts the weapon upgrades.
You can get a lead here to squeeze out some archons to push back the zerg.
Or the zerg can kill carriers over and over to keep the protoss army value low & manageable (respawn / remax).

I think the main thing about balance is diversity. So if a lot of strategies are viable, the matchup is fine.

Most armored units do have at least one base armor with the notable exceptions of air units and Infestors.

Blizzard probably decided that it was easier to balance some armored air units without that armor since armor would make balancing Queens, Marines, Phoenixes, Sentries, capital ships, etc more difficult.

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Queen has armor, all capital ships have at least 2 armor and Marine, Phoenix and sentry are all light units.

Only armored unit with no armor is terran viking. Protoss Zealot has 1 armor while being light, queen and ravager have no tag with 1 armor.

These are 4 units that have armor values missmatched with their tag.

You forgot Void Ray.

Aye. Nobody makes them so I didnt know. Sorry about that.

Void Ray, Viking, Oracle, Liberator, Infestor. and Overlord.

Both Vikings and Void Rays are intended to lose to Phoenixes; and the Phoenix’s base damage would have to be buffed if either unit had base armor.

Void Rays would be far more difficult for most ground armies to deal with if they had 1 base armor, and so would Liberators.

There are a few other light or non-armored units with 1 armor. The Raven is an example; and Zealots definitely need that 1 light armor to be effective. Otherwise Zealots would be far too easily hard-countered by Zerglings and Marines.

A unit’s base armor is not based on its tag. It is based on the stats that a unit needs to be effective and balanced.

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finally some true words!

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No worries, after writing it I realized Overlords and Overseers are also flying units with 0 armor :stuck_out_tongue: (and so is the Liberator).

The biggest irony of this is that adding an “armored” tag to the unit actually results in a nerf, and “light” units end up being the more tanky ones.

That depends on the unit and match-up in question, but usually there is a health difference to compensate for that. “Armored” units can be balanced with a lot more health than “light” units; and they usually have more health.

You can actually look at the Science Vessel compared to the Raven for an example of this. Science Vessels have 200 health. Ravens only have 140.

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It would be great example if one wasnt epic tier caster while other probably worst caster in the game.