I’ve been keeping up with this thread, but had not played the map yet. Seeing your post here has made me want to play now. I rarely ever solo anything unless my partner leaves, but I’ve believed co-op to be far too easy for a while. If this is a map that actually requires you to have an ally to have an easy time beating it, then I am very excited to try it. Solo brutal should be brutally hard, and thats what you have described. The map sounds properly balanced for brutal to me.
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You’ll enjoy it then. When I played it it was proper hard.
I definitely had to retry it a few times on my Dehaka solos. Learning proper timings and where my units needed to be requires a few attempts generally.
It was fun.
There are multiple problems that make a number of commanders not workable for the map.
- You NEED a defensive commander to protect the launch bay. Unless you’re paired with an Abathur vs ground (who actually breaks the Hybrid AI that spawn there), you’ll have to HEAVILY invest into static defenses up there just to even have a shot at keeping the waves back. Especially since they scale up alongside the normal attack waves.
- If you don’t get the bonus, you die. You legitimately die. At around 22 minutes, the game will send a deathball at you from the bonus, and then ANOTHER deathball at 24 minutes, leaving little time to rescramble your forces again. These waves include multiple Hybrid Dominators AND Hybrid Behemoths, backed by high numbers of Tier 3 units.
- Objective defenses don’t scale. I went to test this idea out by skipping the base and natural launch bays, and went for the one next to the bonus. It’s heavily guarded, instead of lightly guarded. This cost me my entire army, and subsequently the game.
- Double Thrasher spawns around the same time frame as the 24 minute deathball. You have to pick one or the other to deal with, can’t get both or else either the main launch bay or your base will be flattened. (Or both.)
This seems like a good time for a side point. Tangor: what you’re doing is amazing, and don’t forget that you’ve put more time into this than every person testing it put together. You’ve been really quick to listen to people’s input, and that’s great, but don’t lose your own vision in an aim to people-please!
In my first reply I avoided giving feedback because I didn’t want you to give it too much weight. That’s esp. true because I was playing mostly solo games. My view is that casual first impressions are important in duo games (the map should be accessible), but solo play should be a challenge using experience and map knowledge. We don’t have that yet, so our solo feedback might be very uninformed.
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Played with Mengsk and a friend as Vorazun. Beat it first try. Didn’t get the bonus, or even try to get it. We split up for double thrasher spawns, and each handled our own sides with relatively minimal trouble. Had a good time.
Soloing would be crazy hard. It seems nearly impossible with some commanders. But I say nearly, because I know that there’s going to be a Korean that would make me eat my words otherwise. This is what I want out of Brutal. A game that is so hard that I NEED my partner to be able to do well. It should seem nearly impossible to solo. This is great. However, I am not a solo runner, and I’m not a pro, so there’s probably issues I don’t see.
It is possible to set your mastery points into negative numbers by clicking very fast. This allows you to allocate the other mastery points to an amount higher than the default 30. If you set one to -5 you can set the other to 35. You can also set the total mastery level as high as 156 by using the same method. This allows all masterys to go as high as 52, without needing to set one of them to a negative number.
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To me, that sounds like it’s a map designed to need two people, or at least that’s expected to not be solo’d easily.
There is no meaning to do this. Each mastery are tied to an upgrade, and even if some mastery is used in triggers, upgrade count is used. And in each mastery upgrade there is a max count set to 30.
Yes, that was the idea, when I made a path to warp conduit and a full enemy base there.
Maybe protect warp conduit? And answer is no, one commander can just build some forces ASAP and attack that base at around minute 3 or even earlier. Because, I say this again, that base don’t spawn, but produce units. If there is no production buildings remains, nothing will come to warp conduit, except hybrids that spawns. That base has nothing (not even Gateway/Barracks/Spawning pool) but a few defense buildings at start and only begin to build stuff at around 2:30 (some units present for terrans, since bunkers don’t shoot by themselves). And hybrids spawn depending on completion %, so you can remember, when they spawn.
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I can promise you that it was working. My friend who went Vorazun used it on the Dark pylon size mastery, increasing it to 76 points (combonation of raising the total mastery level to 156, and making the opposite mastery skill go negative) and the radius was massive. Just one dark pylon could have 6 cannon thick walls on either side of it.
- Made “MutatorSafety” area bigger to match increased main base area.
- Enabled Help Menu button in commander selection screen.
Base pylon power radius is 6.5, with 30 points (+60%) it will be 10.4, you can fit a row of 5 cannons on each side of the pylon. With 76 points (+152%) it should be 16.38, so you should be able to fit 8 cannons on each side (or 5 gateways) in a row. I couldn’t click fast enough to see this. But this is still impossible (for this mastery at least), because there is a separate “power source” behavior for each point of this mastery.
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Hmm. I tested it, and you’re right. It’s no larger than the default 30 point radius. However this glitch will still let a player increase both sides of a mastery slot. I used an auto clicker that clicks once every 0.025 seconds.
I took a couple screen shots for you.
https://i.imgur.com/JwrSkzk.pngWith this one you can see the negative numbers I was talking about. Some of them are higher than they should be able to reach, because the other mastery is negative.
https://i.imgur.com/05Mkz7q.pngIn this one I demonstrate allocating nearly 30 points to both sides of the same mastery. The 173 mastery levels I have in this screenshot is the highest I have ever been able to get it. usually it stops me in 150s.
Could you add a command to choose player 2’s commander when -solo2 has been used?
You can normally choose ally’s commander when you solo play this map. Just select commander you want to set for ally, then select ally’s current commander.
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It’s incredible how people are willing to waste time on doing something that developers are supposed to do, except for free. It’s one thing with Arcade, but developing an official game mode… I perfectly understand why you are doing this. I just hope you wake up to reality that life is not infinite, and things are not free, and that you should be paid for what you deserve to be paid for. And if company is not willing to pay for your work, maybe you should apply your talent somewhere, where it would be rewarded. I doubt you are growing as a map developer from posting and replying to every post or doing small things to perfect the map for public use, when you could be moving on to the next project. And of course, there is the side not about people like you but the corporations you are doing the free work and promotion for, the reason they get lazy is partially because of people like you.
That reads like a backhanded compliment to modders.
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If you can’t read or think that’s your problem. I’m literally saying they are worth more than they sell themselves for (free) and you are saying I’m insulting. Typical moron logic, unable to think outside of the box, but ready to open their mouths at the drop of a hat.
And that removes all doubt: you’re a jerk.
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Oh yeah, you’ve got it: throw some labels, so you can make your compartmentalized brain feel better.
Literally insulting me from the first word addressed to me, calling me ill intended, falsely accusing, then calling a jerk, what a friendly specimen. I should learn to deal with stupid people and not reply to them.
But you are making a lot of assumptions. You said it was a waste of time, yet that is completely and totally subjective towards the person “wasting” their time. What if he enjoys doing this kind of editing, and he loves the game and is passionate about it? He and his closest friends or loved ones would be the only ones qualified to answer the question “am I (are you) wasting your time?”
He should get paid for his efforts, but if your goal is to tell him to move on and take his talents elsewhere to get paid, I’m sure there are more direct ways to say it than to insult the developers and possibly him (if he takes what you said the wrong way).
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Didn’t you just call me a bunch of different nasty things just 'cause? Talking about literally insulting from the first word.
Edit: I see you deleted them, but that ain’t gonna save ya.
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