btw am i the only one, who wonders, why blizz doesnt even bother anymore to make balance updates etc sticky?
why does every natural have a possibility for wall off?
or every main base has a small ramp?
Because if it didnât than lings would end every ZvT and ZvP game pretty much immediatelly
and now ask yourself, what is needed for zerg, to not die to any kind of push in the early game - right, vision. with zerg, you simply die, if you build a round of drones, when a push is coming. especially in the early game, which no creep whatsoever. just try to think outside of your terran brain for once.
I play all 3 races
Overlord spire is a free scouting. Its a luxury that neither Protoss nor Terran have.
Every second game against Zerg on the ladder is a game against some kind of cheese and I need to have sentry as my second unit and sometimes even sacrifice adept, or sacrifice reaper and sometimes even waste energy on scan to know whatâs going to hit me.
For Zerg whiner though, spending even 75 75 or 100 0 on complete scouting of opponents base is too big of an investment. What the LOL?
yeah right⌠looking at reaper jump in cliffs
this is clearly a learn 2 play issue. if youre losing your adept, you need to work on your unit control lol. for starters, every diamond player knows, that lingspeed finishes at around 3:30. so to stay longer than that on the zerg side is⌠dumb atleast. also, your maingoal with the adept is to scout the drone saturation, which means, you dont need to commit in any way. but hey, i guess you allrdy know this.
so now tell me, if you would remove all ovi pillars. what tools would zzerg have to scout in the first 2-4 minutes?
btw, sentrie in the early game is standard anyway, depending on your bo, since sentrie is one way to scout in the early gameâŚ
would you sacrifice a depot, everytime you wanna scout, clearly knowing, that if the opponent is atleast a litte decent, you wont see anything, because its long dead before it even reaches the mainbase?
No we can surely try out maps without pillars. not every map. just 1 or 2. then we will see. we already tried out very open and wide maps or maps where you cant wall off that easily or maps with 2 entrances (mineral patch blocked or simply just one open spot where you have to put down a depot or pylon). we can at least give it a try. Zerg is not nearly as dependent on this pillars as many would think. You spot incoming attacks with your lings which are spread out around the opponents base. thats how you see incoming wp or medivacs too.
actually yes?
you often times see pros building pylons/depots around the map just to spot possible dropsâŚ
also, what about adept scouting? pros invest 1 or 2 adepts in scouting zerg. checking tech, counting workers, checking gas and they are not always succesful with it. but its for sure worth a try. its better than dying to random bs.
or scanning? thats like 225 minerals worth. just to check if something is fishy. and trust me, its worth.
also, worker scouting? costs about 100?
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difference is, if you place your pylon/depot in such a way, that drops etc get scouted, the investment of the 100 mins is always worth it. with ovis, i send them in and pray to god, that the opponent is bad enought to not see it, until it sees something usefull.
and ive allrdy mentioned adepts. every m2 toss is capable of scouting with adepts and not losing them. if the toss loses the adept by scouting, its clearly a huge mistake from the toss.
and thats why nobody scans in the early game. well, nobody beside platinum league heroes (so basicly the major part of the whiners on this forum).
worker scout is only usefull for terran/toss and only in the pre-ling-phase. for zerg, wallins are why it doesnt have any use.
but if we do so, we also should try out maps without reaper cliffs. would only be fair, right?
That is pretty ignorant. There is a limited amount of pylons and area of the base. dont be silly. if you dont see anything you did a bad job or at least you can work with the infomation that he wants to hide something. play safe and check his third timing. you can be almost sure that there is something fishy if he doesnt want to take his third in time.
that is very very ignorant too. even heromarine does it from time to time. but also only if he messes something up or like the protoss is walling too âgoodâ meaning something smells fishy in there. or if the terran opponent killed his reaper. granted against zerg they rarely do that because they can scout by being aggressive.
but once again. protoss and terran invest a fair amount of gas/mins in scouting. and yes drone scouting CAN be useful. do spot proxy or check gas timings or else. but granted against terran its nonsense because you really cant look into the base and against protoss its not worth because you know what he is doing. he HAS to wall or he is simply dead. meaning he cant be aggressive in the early game besides cannon rush. that would be the only threat.
i dont know if these two are comparable but sometimes maps dont even have these backdoor reaper cliffs but ok. besides that they have to play without reaper cliffs vs most protoss. because they wallâŚ
If you canât put a couple of lings on reaper ramp entry point than this is your l2p issue.
Zergs who cheese often can. At least in Diamond on EU.
I know that Diamond Zerg put their 3d between 1:50 and 3:30 and if there is no third after that some sort of all-in is coming. So if I fail to understand whatâs going on with hallucinated Phoenix, I will have to send an Adept, and its not coming back.
Actually no, pros donât make Sentry as second unit because it delays the timing of tech building (e.g. Twilight).
You fly around with overlord.
Single Marine or Stalker wonât kill it even if overlord flies from end of main to the other.
In not so distant past people used 2 Overlords with one serving as a distraction to agro player AA units while the second one did the scouting.
actually, occasionally I have to - by making a depot on opponents third (or e-bay on toss natural) to find out when he will finally decide to switch to plan B when his cheese/all-in fails
occasionally I even have to spend a scan to scout. Supply Depot is 100 minerals (plus spent mining time) and scans is 225 minerals.
if you research overlord speed you will fly around opponent base without loosing an overlord unless you fly directly into ball of marines
Diamond Zergs actually scout with Drone every other time. Probably because proxies are so popular on the ladder
golden wall is good though
industry just feels like playing scrap station in a custom game
lotv map making is an art form at this point though its hard to deliver every single time
I dunno I hate both of them.
Golden Wall is quirky and it feels I am playing against some BS every time.
Industry is just so freaking ugly.
Simulacrum was great map. Nightshade was not as good but looked gorgeous. I wish they stayedâŚ
i love nightshade its a high quality map one week left
Why the hell did Purity and Golden Wall stayed in map pool?
Thereâre the most vetoed map ever. GSL even made a map so nobody would end up playing on Purity!
or start with pool frist
sim city and build a few more units instead of tec.
So lings donât win every game
so maybe zerg should have to use their brain to scout instead of just moving their overlords to the exact same spot in every match, a spot that gives the perfect view of your whole natural. I wouldnât mind if the spires acted as a safe retreat point so you donât have to suicide an overlord. You act like zerg is incapable of moving an overlord around. Didnât they reduce the cost of overlord speed for that reason?
itâs 100/100 again. have removed them.
but it would be interesting if you remove the spot and see if terra starts again with marine or tosses with stalker instead of adapt.
how much linge do I need to âSUMMON EXODIAâ?
purity and Industry got waxed off the map pool for next season. I hope you guys are happy.