Will blizzard keep pushing experienced players away with overpowered easy heroes?


#14

Ment og 2.0,

shes now just up and still as unfun to play as before.

she has a lower skill floor and skill ceiling so theres no real way to improve except for perhaps here movement but even then you master that within the first 10 hours.


#15

to be fair at the start when ow was released it was meant for 6 vs 6 and was meant as a group game not a Solo Q game. Tell me if that is how the community play it as.


#16

Heroes are not easy because of their ceilings. Easy heroes are easy because of their floors.

A hero that is easy to pick up can also be difficult to master.

CS works because it’s fundamentally a match between pure skill. It’s simple and straightforward, and has had a LOT of time to iterate on and perfect it’s recipe without really any competition.

TF2 has hats.


#17

well, on this account I play solo queue. it’s why I got this account. I want to play with 3+ on my other account, and use LFG for the rest. a 6 stack of my real life friends is ideal but we can’t usually get 6. even if we can, it’s rare that our 6 strongest players are online at once, and some people are going to get carried.

Even with 6 of us who play together a lot, goats comp is still hard to crack. they just walk at us and hold m1 on point. I’m a tank on my other account, and I’ve been practicing cycle contesting and staying alive as my dps wears the frontline quad tank comp down. but that is so much harder than what the other team doing. that is not balanced. same goes for bastion cheese on Junkertown, it takes a lot more work to beat it than to play it. We can do it, yes, but one mistake and they have the first point for free. they can make all kinds of mistakes.


#18

Well her playing style has never changed while doing her rework. symmetra, bastion, lucio, dva and even roadhog you could fell the playstyle change, and during engagement changed.

Mercy’s problem is that Rezz exist in a FPS like game. That is something the majority will ever dislike.


#19

Her playstyle has certainly changed.

The problem isn’t rez itself.

the problem is rez on e and the problem with old invuln mass rez was that it had little counterplay, and rez before that was a kamikaze burst of impact,

we need a middle ground between that while also adding a higher skill ceiling to mercy.

we NEED our only pure healer in the game to have a high skill ceiling or else things like 2.0 happen.

she should’ve stayed a single target healer always, and she should’ve kept mass rez.

could’ve avoided a year of grief and bad game design is so.

see titanium’s thread for a more indepth explanation on a rework that could fix said issues and more.


#20

CS hasn’t particularly ever changed its recipe, and tf2 isn’t played intensively for its hats for most people.

They’re played because they’re enjoyable contests of skill using well designed elements. Theyre basically the only two shooters that were able to maintain a player base long term, and I’m fairly sure that’s a key reason.

People in OW have basically never been happy with high end competitive. That doesn’t help longevity.


#21

exactly playing how like it was meant to be played is impossible unless you mainly stack with friends for fun.

imo games are harder in a 6 stack than if you are Solo Qing. people who used the LFG feature also realized that aspect.

Welcome to the painful world of OW.


#22

Tbh, Overwatch is more of a MOBA than a FPS game.


#23

If two heroes are equally good, the easier one would be picked over the hard one most of the time if not always.

The easier hero should trade effectivness for reliability. That’s balance.


#24

Mercy already does this with her lack of self defense and brig does this by having a lack of range.

they already use this principle.


#25

I was not implying that they do or do not use this thinking already.


#26

but that doesn’t mean it’s balanced. there are compositions that can be built that make it incredibly difficult to exploit those weaknesses.

Hence: goats.


#27

It sure is balanced.

goats is hardly used as is and when it does in ranked you can just run a counter comp if your that scared of said possibility in your rank.


#28

Heroes with a low skill floor should not inherently be bad at higher levels of play. They should however be more of a challenge to play effectively making their skill ceiling something to be proud of should a player be able to make a hero like that viable at higher levels of play.

Meanwhile high skill floor heroes will have more of a challenge at the beginning because you are learning how they functuon and how you can get the best value out of them. Once you master their basics and begin to climb you should be able to get more value more consistently, (not easily) just consistent.

So if both of these players meet on opposite teams you know the player with the 1star hero worked hard to get value out of that hero in order to play at the same level as the player with the 3star hero. Whom in turn had to learn the hero at a basic level before they could climb.

I just feel all heroes should have their skill ceiling and skill floors. No hero should be better simply because they are easy to pick up or more mechanically demanding. It should always be based on the player’s willingness to make the hero work and do so by their own merit. Not because the hero was OP.

Mercy should not be made useless simply to give Ana more room to breath and be viable. If making one hero worse just to make the other hero better is the kind of balancing system a dev team is using then I can’t say I find that “fair or fun” as they like to claim.

If Mercy is able to be picked up for beginners and mastered for more advanced/competitive players then she should be viable at higher levels of play based on each individual player.

Likewise if a beginner picks up Ana they will struggle to figure out what works and they may become frustrated with the knowledge that they are lacking certain skills to make use of her properly. That’s ok, if they are a competitive by nature and truly wishes to master her they will learn and take each of their loses as a lesson. Whereas other players who are casual or not interested in the challenge will move on to a hero more “beginner” friendly.

Should the Ana player not be rewarded for sticking it out and learning what works, of course they should. However they shouldn’t be given a leg up for free simply because she is a harder hero to learn. That is the challenge her player took on when choosing her… you risk dumbing her down by giving her more power and making her far more easily accessible to which her pick rate goes up and the usual community outcry for nerfs following after.

Ugh so late I’m going to bed. You all have a good night. Sorry for text wall.

Tl;dr
Haha… you lazy? So am I read it. :joy::joy::joy:


#29

I see goats all the time. I also see it played in the world cup all the time. Finland almost beat South Korea with it. it came down to OT on the 5th map


#30

Then you should know that its easily countered?


#31

if it was like season 1-2 where ults occurred more often, than certainly. however since that the time ofg mid fights have increased, the aspects of aim and who gets the first kill have become a bigger advantage.


#32

mercy has a low skill floor and a low skill ceiling. so does brigitte. they both have far lower floor and ceiling than eveyr other hero in the game. that, and bastion.


#33

I’m saying the game as a whole is more of a MOBA than a FPS. I mean, FPS games usually don’t have blue dragons that can one shot most of the hero roster within a second.