Widow's 10 second grapple hook is actually ~12 seconds in practice

For anyone that likes to say that an 8 second cooldown was too strong, you clearly have never played Widow. That 8 second cooldown is, in practice, 9.833 seconds – it was effectively, already 10 seconds.

First thing first. Grappling Hook does not go on cooldown right away.

Unlike almost every character in the game where the cooldown starts immediately, the exact moment you release the button, Widowmaker’s grapple hook doesn’t go on cooldown until after it has stopped reeling.

And it doesn’t start reeling, until after the cast has completed.

Grapple hook has 2 parts; cast and reel.

Casting

The cast time it takes to fire and latch onto a target. This is anywhere between 0.1-0.833s cast time, depending on the target distance. Since most players aren’t looking to shoot the grappling hook at a point blank target, and everyone takes time to spin around to find a suitable target, that cast ends up taking roughly about a second (especially on console where you are limited by your turning radius).

note

  • The bugs present on Grapple Hook (which, by the way, are not fixable using the sensitivity slider) make the ability so cumbersome that players in GM resort to casting at the ground a few feet away to slingshot, which would cut down the time by at least half.
    • However, this doesn’t save much time at all because they typically aim at the ground nearest their healers/a health pack (because they’ve been dived upon by an enemy attacker). The time it takes to coordinate that is still lengthy.

Reel

The Grapple Hook also has a reel time. At the farthest ranges of the hook (20-something meters), it takes exactly 1.0s to reel to that target. The hook’s autoaim often procs at targets near the outer limits of its range, beyond her control.

Slingshotting can help, where you jump mid-reel to cancel out of the reel. It saves a bit of time. But slingshotting also opens up some risk of failing to reach a ledge.

(hidden, third timer)

Because the grapple hook’s auto aim often likes to tease you (literally like a bully) by having the cable go to an auto-aimed target that’s just a tiny bit out of reach, only to not latch onto it, it forces the hook to be recast. That means that the cast time can double, or even triple. And in that time, especially with a Monkey riding on your coattails, you’re dead.

This is why so many Widow players just give up and stand still when Monkey pounces on them.

On the other side of the fence, if you play with the slider turned low (you can’t turn it to 0 because 10 is the lowest you can go), the cast time is also extended, because you have to be looking directly at the target ledge for a successful cast… you have exactly one default-sized circle crosshair of tolerance, if you’re off by a pixel when you press the cast button, your hook hits thin air.

Oh and it’s buggy…

The hook has a huge swath of bugs that make it the buggiest ability in the game.

  • Argue all you want about Sombra, Rein, and Doomfist having buggy abilities, but Widow’s grappling hook is, factually and numerically, the buggiest ability in the game;
    • While Hack, Earthshatter, and Rocket Punch might not assign effects to enemies in some situations, at least some part of their abilities work with 100% reliability.
    • Every single component of Grapple Hook’s components has bugs.
  • Every single one of these has a bug related to them, and half of these are map-specific – what might be fine on Gibraltar, suddenly doesn’t work on Eichenwalde.

The ability can literally lead you to your death for no reason.

When other abilities fail and you die, that’s because it has an element of risk being directed at an enemy. Moreover, at least there’s a visible indication that some sort of shenanigans caused the failure.

Widow’s hook fails for no explicable reason. It’s a hazard to herself. You have no clue if it will actually work this time, or if it’ll decide to pull you to a floodlight or a phone booth… entire vertical areas of maps are inaccessible because of the hook.

No other ability is that much of a liability.

Widow mains have literally picked up a habit of compensating for every single hook by slingshotting every single time in order to course-correct for the hook’s misbehavior. Doing so means that they don’t land as quickly to their destination. They waste dozens of second every game to ensure that they have at least some air control to get close to where they wanted to go.

And now it’s being nerfed.

At 10 seconds, the hook is effectively a 12+ second cast.

This doesn’t even take into consideration other bugs that she has, like the hitscan misprediction bug that actually (really, no joke) causes missed shots (because of the sniper’s first-person camera recoil), or the rendering occlusion bug where enemies are temporarily invisible (especially at lower framerates) when rounding a corner.

And this also doesn’t even consider the fact the upcoming falloff changes which nerf her considerably;

  • she now has falloff, SMG is worse, she loses long range cleanup kill potential with descope>SMG burst fire (which was objectively faster and more damaging)
  • other hitscan characters have more damage
  • because other hitscan characters have more damage, the aim punch in scope when she gets hit will be stronger and more frequent

None of these changes are welcome.

At the very least, bugfix her before nerfing her.

22 Likes

sorry, but someone that can one-shot with their left click shouldn’t also have better mobility than most of the cast. Mobility has always been the traditional weakness of snipers in other shooters, so be thankful you have some kind of mobility option

38 Likes

Talking of someone who can one shot with left click shouldn’t have more mobility than the rest of the cast… While Widow doesn’t fit that description, as her mobility is lower than most of the cast.

Hanzo on the other hand…

The one with the most mobility in the game, has throughput on par with pure spam-DPS heroes that can’t even deliver critical damage.

And why can’t we deal with Widow? Because this guy exists to prevent anyone getting close to her.

4 Likes

I believe Hanzo having leap was a huge mistake. Way too much survivability and mobility for a hero with one-shot logs that act as hitscan in close/mid range

8 Likes

Name one shooter that does.

I’ll wait. And I’ll wait forever, because what you said is not true.

Every single game that features snipers has medium or fast movespeeds with snipers, which get slowed down upon scope-in.

  • Call of Duty
  • Halo
  • Counter-Strike
  • Unreal Tournament
  • Quake 2 onward
  • Team Fortress
  • Day of Defeat
  • Titanfall
  • Destiny

Even single player games give them average movespeeds;

  • Crysis
  • Borderlands
  • Bioshock
  • Doom 2016
  • Fallout

What you said is just not true.

8 Likes

10 seconds is a nice middle

1 Like

10 seconds is the one we currently have.

The current “8 second cooldown” quite literally is 10 seconds.

1 Like

“sniper in tf2 running slightly faster means mobility is not a weakness”
just lol

Your 10second widow grapple can launch you to the other side of the map. That is some damn powerful mobility

9 Likes

Because over-extending with Widow is a really smart move.

1 Like

Being above average movespeed, in a game that doesn’t have the same degree of movement options as Overwatch, is literal proof that snipers don’t get a mobility weakness.

1 Like

Dude,she was basicallyspider man with 8 seconds.And 8 seconds ain’t 10 seconds. If you know how to use it.

You’re smoking something strong haha. Sniper is not going to be able to outrun his opponents once he’s jumped by a solider/scout/demoman/spy/flying pyro etc. They will get the kill. And mobility in tf2 is pretty crazy, you should look up some soldier videos

Overwatch on the other hand, Widow can grapple to the other side of the map. And then grapple again once her pursuers finally catch up.

Actually, if you understand basic physics, the most it can go is about 26 meters. And that’s assuming ideal conditions with a perfect 45 degree target hook location.

Realistically, it’s the same range as Roadhog’s hook.

hahaha you are on drugs kid if you think widow can barely grapple further than this

h ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWQDMZFAKyw

Grapple jumping cannot exceed 26 meters, except if the landing zone is a lower altitude than the starting location.

And given the fact that you will almost never get a 45 degree angle for a slingshot, you’re lucky if you get 20 meters.

Omg, does that mean Widow is unkillable?!??!?!
I never knew it! After 300 hours of playing Widow, i finally understand why i constantly get fu*ed by winston, tracer, genji and literally everyone else! I just didnt grapple fast enough! Because apperently this gives me so much mobility that im unkillable. Woah!

6 Likes

It’s still better than the 12 second CD she had from launch

2 Likes

“12 seconds” that was actually 14 seconds.

Yes, because being twice the length of Monkey/D.Va’s mobility cooldowns is such an improvement.

“10 seconds” is 12 seconds, and it’s still on a buggy hook.

2 Likes

I agree. He already had too much mobility with wall climb so the leap was just overkill. Snipers need to be vulnerable to dive, but in the current state of the game they have no problems taking out dive comps.

2 Likes

what are you saying here?
almost all skills with animation or travel doesnt go directly on cooldown.
thats not special for widows hook.