The 12s cd after destruction of tp nerf made that issue worse. If double shield meta wasn’t a thing, this issue would be extremely apparent to everyone. She can’t engage, disengage or survive independently now nor live long enough in her effective range to do what she’s intended to do. Something that’s very important for a damage hero to damage.
Her beam changes did not touch this issue much, only increased the reward of a successful engagement and living through her engagement when her issue is about not being able to engage, disengage and live to do her job.
Try playing sym without double barriers and with a sigma on the enemy team and you’ll see, she was never overtuned.
i.e. play without a sigma frequently delivering a shield to your front door and without 2 barriers to frequently pave a safe runway catwalk to the enemy’s front door.
Nerfing sym because other heroes are covering up her weaknesses and enabling her isn’t the solution.
This is so true. When I have tanks that just won’t tank, I end up pushing forward BY MYSELF and doing like 100–300 damage before dying, b/c I’m squishy as heck, half the time my healers refuse to heal a Symm, and I have basically -0- mobility. I can’t reach 3/4 of the enemy players with my beam before they’ve killed me, it’s a little t-rex arm of a beam. I’m left with the bubble gun and filling their faces with turrets. And praying.
When I have tanks that work with me however, and we push W as a team, I consistently get lots of elims, 10k damage per 10, and roughly 6 or more kills per death. But I need that tank support in order to even reach the enemy before they squish me like the BZZT BZZT bug I am.
The nerfs feel rushed and and just a little too harsh. The damage nerf seems reasonable but cutting her Primary Fire width in half on top of that seems a little much.
On top of that players are asking for nerfs to double shield meta but nerfing Symmetra is just removing the best counter to fight against that.
How many of those matches did your team run Orisa and/or Sigma?
Like a sym shouldn’t really be harder to kill than a reaper or zarya in the same position tbh, esp now that her tp is a lot more unavailable for her to use it as an escape.
the sad part is, sym mains were able to use old 3.0 tp to mitigate this issue whether it’s to pincer attack with primary, flank tp combo, turret bomb, claim new space, set up traps, escape threats, etc. but that got gutted because most other people, the non-dym players, thought that to was purely their ability and not sym’s and wanted to change it accordingly.
I mean the point of contention has been whether it’s sym being the deciding factor or whether double shield (on either or both sides) hard enabling sym being the deciding factor.
Honestly some of it just has to do with dummies and her turrets. Understand I love the character and I would play with her but now everyone is playing with her.
My issue is the beam it has/had 190 damage a second and all she has to do is swing it back and forth that was my issue.
But like I mentioned before something is needed against double shield and she might be it. She can either cut through them or tp the team around the Shields.
But for a player to have a long azz light saber along with a zarya (the deadliest tank imo) on the same team.
I only get to player with masters folks every once in a while so most of my games have very little coordination.
as a symm player, my ability/inability to do anything depends on whether or not I have shield coverage.
Bubble gun’s not really accurate enough or high enough speed to reliably use for hitting anything other than shields. (though I have recently bubble gun’d a tracer in the face with a full charge bubble and that was nice)
The T-Rex beam of Symm’s gun versus Zarya’s beam or Moira’s ult is a literal pain, but people expect me to dual a fully charged Zarya and win (which I’ve never managed because she’s a/ being healed and b/ got more range).
I’ve even been known to keep an enemy Symm dead and we STILL lost the game because either our tanks aren’t doing their jobs or Somone’s being pissy and not healing like they should.
I’ve been told in the last week once that “you’re playing Symm so don’t expect heals” like that’s a valid choice.
–
Your comments about “even dive she wrecked” - those are bloody fat tanks, only baby d.va’s not huge. Monkey is HUGE, d.va’s mech is HUGE. Easy to hit and gain charge. Fat tanks and shields are my favorite things as I get charge from them and just start stompin. (seriously dive’s easy to counter with like a symm and a mei, just demech dva and freeze monkey)
–
It really feels like Symm’s finally becoming a part of a meta and the reaction of a good 80% of the fan base and the Devs is “Oh no, we can’t have that.”
I mean do you have any evidence or sound arguments for that claim?
Because like I said in my original post, the contextual facts about sym’s kit is that her primary is literally the most restrictive primary in the game while that aspect actually got worse in the sigma patch, she had 195 dps before and wasn’t an issue (no the bug fix did not change that), so what’s in sym’s kit that makes her “OP”?
I never said she was OP I said her beam (one part of her kit) is nearly OP.
I mentioned how my games are swinging based on who has a sym, or whose sym is better.
I can only report what’s happening.
I stated that sym may be needed to deal with double shields. But it also turns her beam into a light saber on console where all she has to do is strafe and swing while you may have to aim and shoot. So since it’s 190 damage per second she is a killing machine once her beam gets charged.
Also that her beam charges super fast to the top level.
The only way to mitigate her power is to not run shield but you have no idea who they have on the team in the first fight and since double shield is easy to understand for uncoordinated teams (most of overwatch), sym is going to have plenty of charge.
But that’ll literally almost never happen now that 2-2-2 is a thing. 2-2-2 pretty much guarantees you’ll get double barriers as it is now the popular comp with Sigma.
Sym being nerfed is an unfortunate side effect. She’s too powerful with proper coverage.
I’d like to point out that before sigma, 2-2-2 was often sought in comp and there have been many games that did play 2-2-2 and was the comp double shield then? no. right before orisa sigma it was orisa hog and sym wasn’t charging up and w+m1 so frequently as now. even before goats it was double sniper (2 snipers, rein, zarya, mercy/ana + zen/lucio; oh hey 2-2-2 again), before that was like dive iirc which oh hey that was pretty 2-2-2 again…
nerfing sym at a kit-wise level to accommodate double shield meta is just going to result in sym being put back into bastion level niche status that she was in before the 3.0 rework i.e. “you need to run orisa sigma with sym otherwise you’re throwing” kind of status. at which point I don’t think people supporting these nerfs (esp the tp cd one) have the right to complain about someone “throwing” by picking sym after all these changes and when double shield meta dies down (which it will).
Sym is currently the best hero in the game by A LOT. She makes doomfist look balanced. She absolutely needs nerfs. The ptr nerfs might not even be enough.
She doesnt counter double shield. She counters everything. Dive? No worries, sym counters it. Rein/zarya? No worries, sym’s got this.
On every map and against every comp she is the best. She is completely broken.
It’s noise like this which is why sym hardly ever gets actual healthy changes tbh.
sym’s got nothing on df that dives her. playing death ball with sym makes her team vulnerable to splash (pharah, junkrat, etc.). can you really say sym counters snipers when the only thing she has for them is a wall that takes like 15s or so to charge? sym only counters a rein/zarya duo if the zarya doesn’t know how to aim and kill a sym trying to charge up on a rein barrier (not to mention 3 swings from rein kills sym and that’s a lot quicker than sym charging up). and the list goes on. if she really did counter everything, she wouldn’t only be meta just now.
I have a friend who had previously never been out of diamond and he has 1-tricked sym to GM in about a week. It has boosted him 600SR by how broken it is. If you are struggling on your sym to the point where you don’t feel how strong it is then I can get him to come and post here and give you some tips. I find it strange any sym mains wouldn’t just play sym and completely dominate in her current state, when I know people who aren’t sym mains and they are being boosted 600 SR just by playing her.
I like how you she/he replies to you about how you said sym counters everything and then you go on to talk about your friend getting to diamond. Anyways sym does not counter dive and hammond is a tank that counters her
none of this is about my, nor sym mains’, skill to play sym. This is about the balance health of symmetra.
The point being raised here is nerfing sym’s kit just because of double shield meta just doesn’t make sense and would just make her dependent on double shield compositions and be terrible in any other kind of compositions, the exact BS the whole sym3.0 rework was done to avoid.
you bring up brigitte yet you fail to see the thing we’re raising is to not repeat the same mistakes as what brigitte went through and the fact that sym has been released for a year like this and she wasn’t OP at all in the way you said for the whole year.
