Why I Have Yet to Not Despise Mercy's Current State

Well one thing’s for sure, as long as there are Mercy mains around to resurrect this thread, it will never die.

I’m going to go ahead and guess that joke has already been made several times in this thread… kinda obvious really.

You can always do what I did and say I want this thread to die cuz Mass Rez related discussions are detrimental to changing Mercy in a healthy and progressive way :slight_smile: It might result in a permaban so… Can’t say I didn’t warn ya :wink:

Edit:

It’s an ult. Holding down M1 as Soldier isn’t “skillful and full of expression” either. That’s how some ults operate.

She gets a lot more than just infinite GA hop with Valk. Underselling what it does doesn’t help to push the discussion forward. It just bogs it down in nonsense to be blunt.

What is “good enough”? Why doesn’t my wiffed pulse bomb just home in on the nearest target? That’s not “good enough” imo. It’s an ult, I should be able to Q and get at least 1 kill, wtf is with this getting close and actually aiming the toss and compensating for the weird slow toss and so on and so forth?

She has TONS that makes her “good.” Is it really the heroes fault if a player can’t make use of that? Pulse bomb example comes back to mind.

GA. Beam juggling. Etc. Are you trying to say Mercy is no aim no brain style gameplay? Trying to say that Mercy doesn’t take skill? Ofc you aren’t…

You’re kind of contradicting and undermining yourself in a lot of ways with the arguments you are making. Just things to consider.

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Hear me out here for a moment… I think I’ve got an iteration that actually encourages Mercy to prefer keeping teammates alive over rezzing them.

Let me know what you think:

before I say anything else: I have some fundamental mechanics changes to propose for Rez.

Kill the Mercy!
Enemies will be able to stop Mercy from rezzing even after she has already pressed Q. if Mercy is killed before her allies are finished reviving (which takes 2.75 seconds), the Rez is aborted and the targets immediately go back to spawn.

Heroes never die! For a price…
A rezzed player will experience a longer respawn timer on their next death. This makes it much harder for Mercy to use Rez to stall out on 2cp and general overtime.

Emergency Treatment

AoE: 12 meters
Cast time: 0.65 seconds

Dual effect ult:

  • rezzes allies in range
  • Turbocharges Mercy’s staff

For every ally rezzed, Turbocharge’s duration is reduced by 1 second

Turbocharge:

  • healing beam increased to 150hps
  • damage boost increased to 50%
  • Regen delay removed

Max duration: 6 seconds
Minimum duration: 1 second

Mercy can use Emergency Treatment with 0 dead allies in order to get the full 6 second duration on Turbocharge.

Mercy can get better, more consistent value out of Turbocharge than Rez, so it’s in her best interest to actually need rez as seldom as possible. This means putting more value on keeping teammates alive.

2 Likes

Hmm…

I respect you too much to beat around the bush. I love ya Sila. You make me think… So… Here comes to some bluntness.

I don’t like this. In situations where you are rezzing people you are too vulnerable during this period. It’s too easy to render any play regarding multiple rezzes basically irrelevant. Even with invuln and such Mass Rez was not an ult you’d be able to expect much return from. Something like this, imo, basically guarantees that it will always be a low value ult.

150 hps doesn’t really come into play if you’re trying to rez more than 2 people, as you will die in any coordinated setting. If you have to be positioned in a way where you are near to the numerous dead team mates you have, you will die. This is coming from someone that has ran a lot of Mercy and a lot of Tracer. I’ve been on both sides, and I will kill you if you try to pull something off like this with anything more than 1-2 team mates dead.

I’d assume you press Q, then this 2.75 type second thing goes, and while you’re doing that you have 6s of super beam. If people are rezzed, they then take away 1s from the duration of this turbocharged beam. Seems kind of jank. I don’t like the idea of dealing with a situation with said turbocharge and then 3s later my turbocharge basically ends due to the -1s duration.

This I’m okay with. I’d almost want it more on her beam on like the reload key in a watered down sense where she’s able to boost her per person healing for a period. Maybe like 70hps. That has to be put on a CD though that doesn’t make her the end all be all healer though.

I recognize I consider things in a way that a lot of the forum doesn’t feel. For instance, I argue Mass Rez was borderline useless in coordinated settings, where often I real people arguing Mass Rez was OP.

With that considered, I consider such a change a threat to her viability and such possibly restrictive when it comes to her enabling meta diversity. I do appreciate your approach though, and I really enjoy the various unique and considerate approaches you take when it comes to these changes, it can be seen that you are trying to address all sides of the argument.

The core of my perspective revolves around the sustainment of Mercy’s current viability, and I see this as a threat in scrim/organized/pro type settings, where people can take advantage of the numerous conditions in a way to render it in a way irrelevant.

That, imo, is inherent to the variable element of rez. As we place conditions on it, the easier it is to render it irrelevant. Like I said, I consider Mass Rez as it was with no restrictions, no LOS, no cast time, invuln on Q press, etc, a very weak ult. I don’t want to return to that.

Apologies for coming across as overly critical or anything like that, I just wanted to more respectfully get my oppositional perspective across than to sort of pander to making it digestible. I know I could’ve probably worded this better, but it takes effort xD

I hope i didn’t come across as dismissive or offensive. I truly do appreciate your approach <3

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I just wish that “THEY” had looked at a different iteration of Mass Rez (like some pre-launch) rather than completely scrapping it for the Rework, which was WAY too OP.

  1. 1 second cast time (one of the Pre-Launch versions) rather than Rez going off at the beginning of the casting of Rez. This would be tons better than the 1.75 second cast time we have for 1 person Rez.
  2. No ‘Slow’ so that Mercy has a chance to defend herself. Seriously, get rid of making Mercy “Sniper Bait” so that she doesn’t have to play ‘Hide to Rez’.
  3. Damage Reduction, rather than Invulnerability, for Mercy during Rez so that she can be countered during that 1 second cast time.

An I still say that the “Hide and Rez” was way overblown, first and foremost by Streamers then Jeff himself, and could have easily been negated if they would have just gotten rid of that SR exploit earlier. We have never gotten any figures on how often “Hide and Rez” occurred, but we always hear from many people it happened every game. An seriously, why have a mechanic in a game that guarantees gaining more SR whether you win/lose the match so long as you use your Ultimate. No other Hero in the game had this mechanic. This is probably the the Number 1 reason “Hide and Rez” became somewhat prevalent. Number 2 reason is teammates yelling at Mercy players to go hide once she had Rez.
If they had just waited more than a week for the SR Exploit fix going live to see how much “Hide and Rez” would have basically stopped before the Rework went live, or ‘THEY’ had come out with it weeks earlier. Then again, look how long it took them to start trying to ‘Fix’ the problems caused with the Rework…
But after 16 Nerfs, some of which were not even an issue, Mercy has become lackluster in game play and the BEST way to play Mercy now (or at least 4 Nerfs earlier) according to OWL Mercy players is to play her selfishly.

5 Likes

I have posted the v2 of the Dodo Compromise Mercy rework

it includes a change to Mercy’s base healing rate :slight_smile:

That’s a big if. I don’t think forcing 222 is inevitable, only Montecristo is for it, while the other analysts for Overwatch like the current diversity of team compositions – 33 and 411 is still seen in a positive light by most analyst, with Sideshow thinking that 33 in Stage 1 is the best meta so far in OWL.

Jayne thinks the same, and his thinking is that team compositions should eventually boil down to map features as the primary driving factor, and not just hero synergy.

What it boils down to, Sila, is that while I think 222 is the most balanced sort of composition (and still is in solo queue), I agree with most analysts that 222 should not be the only allowed team composition in the game.

If they DO enforce 222, anything is on the table – there will be huge changes in all the heroes, and I’m guessing dive will be back in a really HUGE way (either Genji-Tracer or Widow-Tracer variants) in the OWL scene. Your proposed changes are as good as any – we’d have to see what sort of changes Blizzard makes to the other heroes to see how it all pans out.

I think I read about that point of view in an interview with Ark and Neptuno – either way, they both have that luxury because they shotcall for the whole team. When Ark was still in NYXL, he can call the tanks to assist him to make sure he and JJonak survives. In my games, I only get that sort of respect when I play Lucio controlling the speed boost for my Reinhardt.

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That’s exactly what I’m looking for, my dude. I’m a blunt kind of person, so I appreciate that when we disagree on something, you skip the platitudes and give it to me straight.

Nothing of substance gets said when people beat around the bush… if there’s a disagreement, I’d rather get straight to the fun part where we debate the topic. I would have joined a debate club if my school had one. :smiley:

I think that Mercy with bunnyhop/superjump is much better equipped to deal with post-rez enemy focus than Mercy 1.0 ever was (especially if she gets the extra bit of polish I want for her mobility). I also gave turbocharge permaregen with this issue in mind, and have been mulling over adding GA buffs such as reduced cooldown and faster dash speed. Do you think those would help?

Mercy would need to start planning out her rez use past just flying in: she would also need an escape plan ready. With bunnyhop, she has the option of doing “fly by” rezzes where she lands behind cover at the end of her flight. She also has the permaregen from turbocharge to soften blows.

I think it’s very important that rez have reactive counterplay. Reading through the complaints about old rez, a common thread was “you couldn’t do anything about it once Mercy pressed Q”.

All other ults have reactive counterplay. There’s always some hero with something in their base kit that can prevent or mitigate an enemy ult’s effects once the Q goes off, but the sole exception was Mercy’s multirez. It created feelings of helplessness and impotence in the players who were playing against it, and I would rather not inflict that on them again. So, I created a way for players to be able to stop Mercy’s rez from completing, just like they can do with any other ult.

I apologize, but I must have messed up on the presentation because Emergency Treatment works differently from that.

What happens is that Mercy presses Q,
Turbocharge immediately activates with mega beams, permaregen, and possibly GA buffs. It’s treated as a transformation ult, so killing Mercy kills the ult (including the rez if it’s still going).

The duration of turbocharge is calculated by the number of rezzed:

No rez: 6 seconds
solo rez: 5 seconds
duo rez: 4 seconds
triple rez: 3 seconds
quad rez: 2 seconds
mass rez: 1 second

Something that’s stuck with me is Papa Jeff’s statement that he does not want a primary healer to get the most value out of her ult by failing in her duties to keep her team alive.

I’ve designed Emergency Treatment around that concept. Turbocharge is supposed to be the most valuable application of Mercy’s ult, with rez as a more niche, situational application.

I’m pushing the “keeping teammates alive > arriving too late and having to rez them” design principle hard by punishing Mercy for failing in her duties as a dedicated healer with less turbocharge uptime.

Rez will still be useful for keeping man advantage vs instakills and trying to recover from ults, but turbocharge will be better for contesting most of those same enemy ults and helping the team to push the objective. Don’t forget that it also increases Mercy’s damage boost to 50%!

That’s exactly what I’m going for.

(Tempo rezzes FTW!)

I know that rez on its own is too niche, so I tinker with “but how can Mercy use it to help her living allies?” in my design sketches. Turbocharge is my answer (for now), but in the early stages I had it at a set duration. What it ended up doing is making Emergency Treatment feel like two ults at once - doing a big rez, then having six seconds of turbocharge would be overkill. But if I made it a shorter duration like 4 seconds, it didn’t feel “ult-y” enough when paired with a smaller sized rez.

In order to put what amounts to 2 ults on one button, I made them opposite ends of a slider. Either Mercy’s rezzing a lot of people or getting a lot of turbocharge, but not both at once.

The lower ranks will still have their flashy huge rezzes, because awareness is pretty bad down there and you can get away with a lot more. But as everyone climbs, the unforgiving mechanics of Emergency Treatment will push Mercy players to prioritize a skillset of keeping allies alive instead of relying on rez to pick up the slack when they fail to pay attention.

Mass rez will prod the rest of the low rank players into learning better ult economy and awareness in order to counter it, instead of being able to climb on mechanical skill alone. It’s a positive feedback loop of players learning the more complex parts of Overwatch by necessity in order to counter each other.

I’m glad you like it. It’s what I intend Emergency Treatment’s main use to be, with rez only used as a last resort.

As far as secondary sources of healing in Mercy’s base kit goes, I still have my heart set on “Cure”. (I’m pretty sure we’ve talked about that one before?) A source of healing not tied to Mercy’s beams will help keep things spicy, and it enables Mercy to have an anti-cc ability without it being too situational.

The game needs more anti-cc, and all of Mercy’s themes go with the cleanse mechanic like peanut butter and jelly. A white mage angel doctor? Yes, please. She’s the first one you’d expect to have the cure for Ana’s nade poison.

I know this is weird coming out of me of all people, but I have been holding this in for a long time.

It took me a few years to figure out how to properly articulate it, but the reason I loved Mercy 1.0 so much is because of her flow state. It felt like opening my third eye and ascending to a higher plane, and multirez was the catalyst for a lot of it.

A major contributor to Mercy’s 1.0 flow state was how being capable of punishing careless ult economy was something that buzzed in your ear and effected your gamesense. It added a puzzle-solving twist to everything you saw, and it increased the stakes of everything you did. It also moved Mercy to the top of the enemy’s target priority list, which had a big effect on Mercy’s gameplay. (Aka you are always being hunted)

I really enjoyed the high-pressure internal puzzle-solving and external “survival-horror on steroids” that multirez induced in Mercy’s gameplay. I would like those elements to be scaled way up back to the levels they were at pre-rework, if not higher.

But the ult on its own… I view Mercy’s old multirez like a dirty child that knocked over grandma’s vase.

“I love you very much, but you are causing a whole bunch of trouble and you need cleaned up ASAP.”

I was a hardcore tempo rezzing Mercy during those days. I viewed it as an art and a science, and I had a pretty snobbish view on anyone who thought that the hide n rez meme was a viable strat.

I was also desperate for more agency in my gameplay.

I loved the flow state that multirez enabled, but I wasn’t happy with how there wasn’t any proactive features to help allies on my terms, before they died. I was straining against the limits of GA 1.0 and wanted it buffed, and I was on the forums regularly asking for an E ability so that Mercy didn’t have to resort straight to rez as soon as her base healing alone wasn’t enough to keep someone alive.

Yeesh… I don’t think I’ve ever been on the forums for anything but asking for a Mercy rework. It’s always been either “Mercy’s kit feels only half-finished, she needs more in it!” or “The valkyrie rework went about it all wrong, it needs redone!”

When the rework was still new and I was crusading the forums to try and convince people that the devs should revert it and try again, I wasted a lot of time arguing that multirez’s strongest point was not the mass rez… but it was like talking to a brick wall.

I eventually learned to write to my audience and fill my rework proposal posts with “it’s okay baby, the mean mass rez won’t hurt you again” sentiment so that the replies wouldn’t be carbon copies of “hur dur you just want to hide in a corner and 5 man rez”.

I’ve come around to the tea that making Mercy’s ult just a mass rez with a bunch of restrictions would hurt more than help her. Rez on its own is just too situational.

But I really don’t see any alternatives to making rez at least part of Mercy’s ult. E rez messes up Mercy’s flow too much and is holding the rest of her kit back from having any real power. It needs to go so Mercy can get an E that helps her catch up to her fellow main healers… But rez can’t be removed completely from Mercy’s kit, because it’s just as integral to her character as a shield is to Reinhardt.

A design goal I’ve had for a long time with rez is to figure out how to make it equally viable at both ends of the ladder. Easier said than done, as multirez was used completely differently in casual vs pro play.

Casuals used more mass rezzes, because awareness in those ranks is pretty bad. No one really put enough (if any) effort into shooting the pretty bird while it flew around in full view, and ults are a “use as soon as you think it’ll get a multikill” thing down there.

Pros used rez for solo rezzes and sometimes duo rezzes, and anything bigger wasn’t worth even trying. They consider never losing momentum at all much better than trying to recover it after it’s already been lost.

I hope I’ve found a middle ground with Emergency Treatment. The casuals will mostly use it to rez, while the pros will mostly use it for turbocharge’s mega heals and damage boost.

You didn’t offend me at all! In fact, I did a little happy squeak when I got a notification that you replied to my post; and that sentiment has not changed after reading it.

Not agreeing with someone on how to fix a problem isn’t inherently toxic. The sentiment of “I disagree” can be communicated in a toxic format, but when communicated in a civil tone and with coherent explanations of how the person arrived to their conclusion of “I disagree” it can be the catalyst of wonderfully engaging debates.

I’ve been sketching out Mercy reworks as a hobby since even before she was actually reworked, but all my early stuff was selfishly designed and only ever valued my fun when playing Mercy. It wasn’t until a I had thought-provoking conversation with you, Quest, that I realized that I was only trying to solve a fraction of Mercy’s problems.

Reading your posts that patiently explained why you disagreed with my self-centered position convinced me to start considering the Big Picture when sketching reworks. Is it balanced? Does it have counterplay? How does it scale on the ladder? Etc, etc. One of the biggest changes was that I used to actively ignore feedback on how Mercy or any of my rework sketches might feel to play against, even if it would feel horrible… until you convinced me that I should care.

You opened my mind to a much wider world of game design with honest, mutually respectful debates that all started with the sentiment “I disagree”.

I’m not a perfect person, and I don’t know everything. I try to be cognizant of the fact I don’t have all the answers, and that some of the ones that I already have may be based on faulty logic or knowledge. When someone disagrees with me, I usually try to listen what they have to say because there’s always the possibility that they might have information I don’t, or they might have discovered a flaw in my logic that I’m too close to recognize.

I think that the time it takes to tiptoeing around “I disagree” statements when two people have the same overall goal (just different approaches to reaching it) could be better spent getting everything out in the open and being specific about the smaller goals they want to meet in order to accomplish the shared big goal, and how they define that goal. It’s much easier to create constructive criticism if you know exactly what the other person is trying to accomplish.

Quest, I love picking your brain for critiques on my rework sketches because I trust you to find the flaws I wasn’t able to see because of my creator’s bias, and point them out to me. I want the flaws to be pointed out, because how can I fix a flaw if I don’t know it’s there? I trust you to point out issues my stuff might create that I hadn’t thought of before, and I really appreciate that you get right down to business when you have something to say.

Sometimes we disagree, even on what constitutes a flaw or a problem, but the debates that follow are always engaging - it’s discussing game design, which has become one of my favorite things to do since joining Overwatch.

We both have Mercy’s best interests at heart, and it’s honestly very fun working with you to try and find the ideal Mercy build. <3

5 Likes

I like this idea. If your teammates are alive, you can use your Ult and keep them that way for a few seconds. But if 1 or more die, you can Rez them but get less value from the Supercharge healing, due to it being shorter in duration. It keeps the 1-3 Tempo Rez that many liked and used, a lot more often than the Clutch Rez of 4 to 5 man Rez, yet keeps the ability to perform 4-5 man Rez available if need be. Quite a well thought out plan.

This would reduce/eliminate “Hide and Rez” from game play (if it even reared it’s head again) since the most value from the Ult would be the healing, not the Rez. Not that the removal of the SR exploit didn’t help. It was just put in way too late (1 week) before Rework going live along with No Rez from Spawn.

This could be made a ‘Skill Shot’ since so many people to this day think that Mercy is a no skill hero. Even with such streamers as Seagull an even xQc recently trying to play Mercy an finding out she isn’t quite so easy to play as they thought.

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The current iteration of Mercy is a heal bot with high mobility. She also has a basic ability that makes the game a 6v7.
I’d propose we take away everything the current Mercy Ult does , BUT possibly keep 1 or 2 things (depending on how the balance turns out) and lower the the duration of the ultimate to somewhere along the lines of 8-12 seconds. During the new shorter duration Ultimate, Mercy would be granted the ability to Resurrect ONE person at a time Instantly, on a 2 Second cool-down.
That’s my Summery. Continue reading to see why I believe this would be great for the game, as well as Mercy, and Mercy players.

The Original Mercy Ult was changed for two reasons:

  1. There was no Counter play. 2. Anti Fun
    Mercy began to be a problem when people started to hide or stay in their base. They would practically just not play the game and afk. This would cause a 5v6 (Anti Fun) and once the team with 6 people blew their team fight Ults (Grav into whatever) Mercy would come flying out of hiding and instantly revive 5 people while also being completely immune to all damage (No Counter play and anti fun)

With the new Mercy ult I have proposed, it would have an element of counter play being that Mercy is vulnerable and isn’t even guaranteed 1 revive.
As far as the Anti-Fun argument goes, for the Mercy player who is playing competitive, with a less then adequate team who has died right when it maters most. That player now has the ability to put the game on their shoulders as a Mercy which hasn’t been possible in a long time. They get that high and rush of knowing that they can win the game based off of their own great game play. For the Enemy Team they are in overtime and just nearly team wiped the team with Mercy. They only have 4 players alive and they hear the enemy mercy ult. THEY KNOW AT THAT POINT ITS GAME TIME EITHER KILL THAT MERCY, OR LOSE THE GAME !
It’s the perfect high and gaming rush for players on both sides, its extremely fair and balanced for everyone who takes part in it.

It presents Counter play and is fun for all parties.
Its rewarding the Mercy player for being aggressive and evasive. While being a high risk high reward option at times.

That’s pretty much it I’ll do a little FAQ at the bottom for questions I’d imagine will come up.

Q: What would you do with the 30 second “Resurrect” ability?
A: Take it out of her kit completely it is not longer needed, and is honestly and hindrance. For balance reasons it needs to have a cast time, and overall it being in her kit just makes balancing her more of a pain. Its also a hindrance for the mercy player because it is clunky and RARELY feels good for the mercy player anyway.

Q: Why lower the ultimate cool down?
A: The idea is that if the stars a line and mercy plays it well shes can pull of 5 resurrects like she used to be able too.

Q: When can she cast her 1st Resurrect?
A: The second she ults her resurrect becomes available to her, once used it goes on a 2 second cool down. Once the ultimate duration is over no more Resurrect.

Q: Why take away everything Mercy does now?
A: To put it simply I’d rather just be able to resurrect more then 1 person at a time again. I want mercy to be more like she used to be. They rushed the mercy rework because she was 100% a problem and needed to be dealt with asap. So they just gave her a bunch of random things, so that she was at least as good as the other support options that were available. With that being said, I’d just like if we got rid of the extra stuff that is no longer needed so we can get mercy back to what she was intended to be the beginning (A single target heal bot with powerful mobility and the ability to resurrect multiple fallin comrades). Plus if we leave in all the stuff her ult does now, she would be very over tuned.

I hope you all enjoy this post and agree with me. It would be insane if we saw these changes on PTR, I would be so excited.

Also one last thing to note If you would like to look me up on Overwatch Player Search it would be under: Xbox One EpicDBagger

I just made this post, but saw your post I think this is a very simple resolution to the mercy problem. What do you think? I’ll read your post I haven’t read it yet because its super long but if i am asking you to read mine that would be rude of me to not read yours.

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As much as this idea is tempting, there is big crowd of people, who won’t allow that to happen.

Still, if we have to focus down ulting Genji, why we shouldn’t focus down ulting Mercy?

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At the very least, we should be focusing supports with the same sort of priority.
Main supports = Ana, Moira, Baptiste, Mercy should all be focused the same amount.
Off Support = Brig, Lucio, Zen should be next priority.

I’m not so sure about making Cure a skill shot just to try and curry favor with players who have never respected Mercy. They likely never will respect Mercy unless her main beams get the Symmetra treatment (which as we know, would be as good as deleting Mercy and replacing her with a completely different hero).

I’d rather Cure stay as a lock-on “fire and forget” targeting system, like Zarya bubbles. Having to worry about aiming is time that isn’t being spent keeping your head on a swivel and making lots of probability calculations per second, which was the hallmark of Mercy 1.0’s flow state.

I like that idea, since Mercy is always busy. An you are right, most people will never respect Mercy, what with all the negative publicity from Streamers/Pros that have been perpetuated by “Those who shall not be named”.

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Just to be certain we’re on the same page though, do you know the specifics of the ‘Cure’ ability I’m referencing? I’ve put the “Cure” ability proposal up a few times on these forums.

Also: do you think I should add GA buffs to the turbocharge section of Emergency Treatment? I want Mercy to have some help surviving post-rez focus (which is why I added permaregen), but I don’t want to go too overboard.

I don’t think it would hurt to see it on PTR. :wink:

Supports never were about respect from enemies, they were about getting your team ahead by all kinds of shady and “unfair” tactics. Including sacrificing them all, so you can sneak by and capture remaining 1/3 of point.

Never really understood, why people were so upset with “hiding” in the first place. Enemies aren’t supposed to be convenient and easy to take out. Especially if they lack effective means to defend themselves, and rely on their team to do something.

Don’t like to have Mercy on your team? Fine, you pick different healer and show your skill. Oh, you don’t want to? Then I will play Mercy and you will keep your complains to yourself.

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Yep, just put in that ‘Skill shot’ because so many non-Mercy players complain about Mercy (non-stop, all the time, inside and outside of games).

GA buff, or a short duration Flight (Valkyrie) to get the heck out of Dodge.

Heh heh…

Being beaten because the enemy is better at shooting you in the face?

“Fair” by dps player standards, because it’s a “brawn vs brawn” fight with symmetrical skillsets being pitted against each other. They can handle the concept of needing some extra practice at pew pew.

Getting beaten because the enemy is better at strategy than you?

“Unfair” by dps standards. Supports often use an asymmetrical “work smarter, not harder” to the standard dps skillset of “work harder = more reward”, so being beaten by a support feels like being called out on a lack of intelligence. There is always the option of beating the supports at their own game by practicing strategy in addition to pew pew, but it’s more likely that the dps will dismiss that option as “cheating”.

DPS mentality at its finest.

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In curious twist of fate, Blizzard developers used same kind of mentality with SR exploit. It’s still there, it was “fixed” by hard capping maximum resurrect count per game.

Intelligent players are a threat, apparently, as they can find glitch in a system.

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