Why does every support have to play in the backline

Seriously, brig was so unique as a front line support but you know what happened with her…

Why dont we get more mid or Frontline supports, maybe a support with a hook? Maybe a support with a close range uppercut?

Why does every support have to be nearly the same as a, backline healer with one self heal, one stun or boop\enemy debuff, or a anti death ability

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Moira… She isn’t for backline play :slight_smile:

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Because when a Healer can stand in the Front line and not run away… DPS Mains get salty and cry that they are “Too OP”.

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wasn’t brig intended to be a backline defender against dive, but then goats came along and promoted her to an all rounder?

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Moira, Brigitte, and Lucio definitely aren’t required to play backline. Being close to the front lines is not the same thing as being a combat specialist or tank, though.

Supports are defined by their focus on supporting teammates. That inherently makes them the highest priority targets for opponents to kill, since the rest of their team relies on them for survival. When the highest priority target to kill is also the most difficult target to kill (which is what lets you be in front of your team), you have a serious game balance problem, hence the original Brigitte issue.

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Good luck playing brig… last few matches I tried whipping her out I got spammed “I need heals” from Sigmas and a few rando DPS until I switched off… :expressionless: no matter the situation or if they’re 100% topped off. It’s like she’s the new torb/sym/mei picks of old. I have been able to make her work in a few matches as a frontliner(-ish) if someone pushes with me (or I with them), but the negative stigma leads to a lot of players letting her do her thing alone like an idiot (and literally spread out and away from her) and spam until you switch.

Like someone pointed out, Moira still works well for that, tho.

We still have DPS Moira, there is still hope!

Because the OW team doesn’t know how to balance these things. Symmetra, Moira, Sigma, Doomfist, Mercy, etc

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Brig was supposed to play backline protecting the other healer but since she deleted flankers out of the game she became a frontliner lol

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Moira is a dps disguised as support…

she’s a flanker…

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Jeff forbid a support isn’t a healbot.

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Her damage output is pitiful.

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Nah stick with her mate, I duo, quite often, with a Moira, and were Trade game per game on who actually has the higher healing. She is quite capable of putting out serious healing numbers.

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That’s backwards. The highest priority targets need to require the most resource investment to remove or you have a major design flaw. From both the perspective of ensuring equal player engagement regardless of role (equal time staring at death timers) and presenting meaningful tactical decisions (if the most important game piece to remove is also the easiest to remove then that’s a non-choice).

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Moira’s a frontline support. Brigitte no longer is because you can’t have a hero be an off-tank with a 20 meter healing aura.

No one said that. Healers should be able to win 1v1s and have some DPS ability, but they should never be at a large advantage in a 1v1 like Brig used to be. You have to trade some raw fighting ability to be able to heal your team. Zen’s damage output is quite good and both he and Ana have plenty of 1v1 ability, but no one complains about either because they’re frail and have to outplay their opponent.

Both are problems. Extreme damage doesn’t justify extreme healing, that’s what power creep is.

This isn’t purely about lack of mechanical skill. No one complains about Rein or Winston. Brig (before she was nerfed) had a lack of mechanical skill on top of being very strong in a fight against many heroes, so that advantage she had felt more unearned.

The problem was that Tracer and Genji couldn’t adapt to a Brig. They were never worth picking against Brig, mostly regardless of the Brig player’s skill. No other counter in the game has ever been that extreme.

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The high priority targets require a high resource investment to remove because of the resources invested in defending them. That’s what defines a class-based team game.

If you play Chess, the highest priority target is the King. The King is the hardest piece to take, not because it has some ultra-powerful self defense, but because all other pieces will attempt to either protect the King or threaten yours to draw you away from it. If it were somehow safe to run your King straight into the middle of the board to defend your Pawn line, the game would be really silly.

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That’s bad team game design. You do see those sorts of design in games more often than you should, but it’s an anti-pattern that drives players away from support roles. It’s also part of why MOBAs are notoriously toxic (only partly), because of the inequity it causes between player impact. I think it also feeds the “supports should require support” misconception that pops up in so many forum discussions.

It’s perfectly fine to have that sort of imbalance between pieces when it’s a two player game. In a 12 player game, everyone needs to be a Queen. If you’re playing the King, your not so much a player on the field as you are the ball. (The King contributes very little power to your board - it more defines the objective).

Players don’t sit down at the keyboard and think, “Gawd, I really enjoy feeding because of crap game design. What game can I play that makes me feel the most helpless?” I mean, I’m sure someone out there wants that. Ain’t trying to kink shame. :slight_smile:

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Brig was not designed for the frontline either, she was designed to be able to defend the other supports who can’t go toe 2 toe with the enemy dps that try to flank.

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Brig was made to counter dive. Like she was built for that express purpose and ended it (a meta that had gone on for more than a year) overnight. This was before goats even mind you.

Her role was to neuter dive heroes by burst healing their targets and stunning the divers. That’s clearly a back line role. She was never meant to go past her own shields to lead the charge and go toe to toe with the enemy rein. She was just so strong she was capable of doing that and was rewarded for doing so since she was released.