Isn’t that a better , more free situation. At least you will have a reasonably viable team each game.
The slippery slope to 2,2,2 is that people will soon start wanting every game to have exactly 1 main healer 1 off healer 1 main tank 1 off tank 1 hitscan and 1 utility dps.
I mean heck, that would certainly be balanced right? And everyone would have fair matches right?
4 Likes
It is better and more flexible, but the “forced 2-2-2” premise is largely about banning GOATS/0-3-3 from play. You’d need at least 2 forced Damage role slots to avoid it just being “Sombra GOATS” or “Mei GOATS” instead of standard/D.va GOATS.
(Not that I agree with the forced 2-2-2 idea at all)
For role lock, that is something I recommended, it means you have more divergence with a team comp.
I wanted 1 main tank, 1 main heals to be locked to certain heroes, and a DPS main of any kind. The other 3 players can flex.
What is a main dps? I would be careful about suggesting that level of restrictions, it could create a really stale meta where every team has the same composition
IDK what main DPS is. I said DPS main, meaning someone who plays DPS only or is their best role.
Also, my recommendation would stop full goats, 5DPS comps or more, while providing a team with someone who actually plays a main tank (which is uncommong at the moment).
1-1-1 + 3 Flex does not get rid of 3-2-1 and 4-1-1s.
I honestly just want someone who plays main tank to be in the game.
1-1-1 still leaves the door wide open for quad DPS with a Roadhog as tank and a solo healing Zenyatta.
However, I do not play MT without a off tank anymore, used to, then the game took an arrow in the knee and now it’s unbearable.
3 Likes
This just sounds like the 1-4-1 us tank and healer mains hate, with extra steps.
I would much rather 1-4-1 locked and healer/Tanks balanced around having 1 of each.
A big point of why people like role queue is so that they don’t get forced to solo tank or solo heal. This would change nothing except banning 3/3 comps.
Slippery slope fallacy
All I want for RoleQ is a system where we can queue up as a team defined by the following locked roles:
- 1 Main Tank (Hammond, Orisa, Reinhardt, Winston)
- 1 Off Tank (D.Va, Roadhog, Zarya)
- 1 Main Healer (Ana, Baptiste, Mercy, Moira)
- 1 Off Healer (Brigitte, Lucio, Zenyatta)
- 1 Main DPS (Bastion, Hanzo, Junkrat, McCree, Pharah, Reaper, Soldier: 76)
- 1 Specialty DPS (Ash, Doomfist, Genji, Mei, Sombra, Symmetra, Torbjorn, Tracer, Widowmaker)
You can finally queue up for what you want to play and be happy not needing to “fill.” You can specialize. You can have six separate SRs for each role, and not need six separate accounts or be worried whether switching to a completely different role mid-game would be classified as “throwing” or “smurfing.”
A 1/1/1 with 3 flex loses a lot of the benefits of forced 2/2/2, but has the added downside of forcing at least 1 player onto each role regardless of if they like it or not. Without 2/2/2 you can not have a role queue because the match maker will not know what role a player will end up being on when they get in game. The balance won’t necessarily get any easier either as tanks or supports can still be stacked up to a maximum of 4, which also means Sombra GOATS is still playable at the professional level.
This is exactly what I was scared of. The game will turn into cookie cutter team comps. Where everyone plays the same. Sure it would be balanced but it would be so boring.
That is just… wrong… GOATs and other problem metas are a symptom of a deeper problem, that balancing for every possible six-stack is unfeasible in roster projected to grow over 50. The point of 2/2/2 is to reign in the balance problem, make more opportunity for characters which right now get overshadowed by 3-stacks, and allow for more per-map metas.
If you think its just about “GOATs” that couldn’t be further from the truth.
I tried to explain it here…
2-2-2 can have more advantages then 1-1-1+3. The most important is with 2-2-2 lock each role has the same responsibility. You cannot play widow and pop once every 5 fights because there are only 2 DSP and when one is not performing well it is immediately clear who (or at least it is 50/50). As support player I have to learn all supports because when I select the role there is only one other player who can help and when I don’t do my job he has do it for me.
There is no easy escape ether where people start to think “if I could play Rain then we would win but because I’m a flex and have to play DPS now we lose”. Of cause you still can flex and select all roles (this is an easy way to shorten Q times by the way) but at the start of the match the match maker assigns a role and you have to play it, there are no what-ifs.
It will still be possible to play a wide range of play styles (and of cause there will be a meta we don’t like). The team can focus on damage or bunker or dive but it will limit things not to get too crazy. 2 Tanks help to limit the health pool, 2 Support limit the healing and 2 DPS limit the individual damage potential. When one DPS goes on flanks or snipe then there is only one on the team so it is more of a trade of.
At the end these limits (health pool, healing and threat level?! of short 2-2-2) make it easier to balance each hero and the whole game. No hero limit was a similar step. It is impossible to balance a 6 stack of one hero or a 3-3 so it helped a lot to let go of this liberty. Nobody seriously argue “we could beat goats with no hero limit so it was bad to remove it” and in 2 years nobody can use this argument for 2-2-2. Obviously you have to beat the meta with in the rules and not from outside. That’s why 2-2-2 is not a counter to goats even many including blizzard might think so and I hope we will not see it in OWL this season.
You’re the hero we need. I always select off tank just to see seconds later, a dps who lost his role pick another off tank.
That is a good thing.
It doesn’t work, most compositions will be still full of DPS.