Agreed
And I was on of the die hard haters who was against it
Until it came
Now I couldn’t fathom going back
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2-2-2 is great. Deals with too many DPS player problem by making DPS players deal with DPS saturation instead of forcing it on everyone else.
2-2-2 is not LFG. LFG is not auto queue, has a group leader, and involves auditioning and pofile creeping and other team assembly components etc…, and also drops you in the stack queue potentially against other teams. Fundamentally it is team v team as opposed to pick up games with auto queue.
Composition is not necessarily even the biggest issue. Before role queue I played primarily main healer with some tank play (1800-2300 ELO). Vast majority of games wound up with 2-2-2 comp, sometimes a 3 dps variant. 4+ dps was extremely rare. Queue with DPS partner in duo though and 4+ dps throws became much more common, so I guess as DPS player games ruined by selfish picks was more common.
A lot of the time you notice really bad play from someone who ‘filled’ and find out that your rein or ana is really a hitscan DPS player who can’t perform off role, so even though your composition was ok you team is not performing because your combined hero pool is out of whack. Just because someone filled does not mean they were capable of playing that fill at the rank they were at.
2-2-2 also solves things like the dreaded 4+ support mains on the same team. Or when your team gets unlucky and has NO dps players (GOATS was real sketchy to make work at lower ELO). Now at least both teams get the same role distribution at same rank. Yes double off tank etc… happens but that also happened before.
It also solves DPS chicken where you get 3 selfish DPS instalocks followed by tank player refusing to solo tank and picking DPS then healers swapping to DPS picks because we throwing now anyways. Eventually someone runs back to spawn and comp normalizes but at this point usually first round / point is lost. Not super common but sometimes you get 3 games of this in a row.
Well, I shouldn’t really say selfish DPS pick since if player is only capable of playing DPS then a win would still be unlikely if they flex off. Rather it was selfish hero pool - knowing that DPS is over-saturated and not learning how to play tank or support as well even though they knew teams were randomly drawn without consideration to hero pool. In anycase, 2-2-2 enables DPS players to only play DPS without worrying about that. They will just need to deal with the consequences of that choice due to queue time now.
3 Likes
- separate role SR
- being able to play off-meta heroes without getting kicked
- you can play solo (if you prefer to do so for whatever reasons)
- 2/2/2 for BOTH teams, not only yours
- automated system VS having to do the job of the matchmaker on your own
- having to do the job of the matchmaker AGAIN every 2 games, because 4 people left after 1st loss
- your 6 stack of randos isn’t getting matched with a 6 stack that plays together on a regular base and completely stomps you
- people actually USE the Role Q, while LFG is basically dead
Most of the things that keep LFG from working can’t be solved without turning it into a Role Q system.
I mean if you are to soft to realize you have to take criticism then maybe they should quit? You’re employed at one of the largest companies; people will take shots at you.
If workshop is so great then what did it do for the game balance wise as well as hell fix other underlying problems. It is fun and has good uses but is it great for playability? Not really it just allows people to make goofier modes that are not available in arcade. Would I trade the entire mode of workshop for good solid balance? You bet I would.
Don’t know what streamers you’re watching but most of the ones I’ve been watching lately have no problem finding games
Your last bullet point is explained by the rest…all of which CAN be addressed…at no point am I saying bring back LFG as is/was…IMPROVE what they had put in…like actually work on it…they never did
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role based SR and RQ are not tied at the hip…could’ve literally added that in before LFG even existed
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which is why creating a group exists…and lets be honest kicking may not be happening but reporting sure as hell still happens…also see note about grouping below
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DONT ACTUALLY GROUP PEOPLE…I hated the fact that it did as well…and for truly solo experience…get ready for it…don’t use LFG…biggest difference with RQ: not mandatory
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easily addresses with something as simple as a checkbox to only consider pairing against mirror comp
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what do you think is happening right now when a match finishes and people leave?..only difference is the game is forming the group for you …honestly sounds like more like laziness to me than an actual problem…but I’ll give you benefit of doubt and say it’s a pro of RQ
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that can still happen today and also greatly exaggerated as you were FAR more likely to be paired against another 6 stack of randos also using LFG like you were (probably the largest exaggeration of all the “problems” with lfg)
And I’ll throw in a few more improvements to help people use it since your last claim isn’t false
- move to front page
- incentivize using it
- improve the interface
Like to sit there and just blurt out it was not capable of being worked on is just ludicrous…we can think about things more critically than that
Role lock has less value for LFG.
With LFG you pick your team and can talk about hero pools before hand so if you wanted to run 4-1-1 or 3-2-1 you could make sure you have people who play appropriate solo tanks / healers etc… to make that work.
Role lock is important for random, unorganized, queue because otherwise the match maker does not know what roles the players will play when it assembles teams, which means you could in the worst case get 6 one-tricks on the same hero. That combined with DPS oversaturation and that ‘maining’ is far more popular than flex made role-blind matchmaking silly.
If you don’t like queue time maybe pick up playing tank. Queue is almost instant.
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Then wait. Your problem.
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And it’s Blizzard’s problem when they have people leave.
The game community would greatly improve when some dps left the community. 
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And people call me toxic
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I don’t understand the connection to “toxic” now.
First of all, that “mess” is not Role Queue’s fault. Have you ever heard of something called “supply and demand”?
Second, without saying “just flat out remove it” (which they won’t and god forbid they even consider it), how would you personally recommend they improve role queue?
Gee. You know what? You’re right.
It sure does suck that we are now being given the option to play in lobbies using legit game modes other than only the laughing fest that is “skirmish” while we are waiting for our game to start.
Which you’d still get long queue times waiting for because hardly anyone uses that for comp and you’d also have to wait even longer to actually get a 6 stack going against another 6 stack (assuming the matchmaker doesn’t screw the other team over).
Map pool system is fine. Less maps equals more room to improve on each one you are more likely to play on later.
You mean an inconsistent dead wasteland where more than half of the players in your lobby are just sitting at the CSS if not just sitting in their own spawn?
Play QP classic.
If you are strictly attached to one or two heroes in a particular role, then I can understand the frustration to some extent but if you solely only play (what I’m assuming) the damage role just to strictly “deal damage” and see yourself on the killfeed more often, there are tons of other heroes outside of the damage role where you can do that too just as well.
Ana, Bap, Brig, Rein, Sigma, Orisa (especially with the incoming buffs), etc.
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I think “5 DPS in all matches” just raised to the same “common sense” status as “Mercy was mandatory because of mass rez”. A lie repeated thousands of times that some people eventually believe it was true.
You can set your LFG to autoqueue as soon as you complete the required slots.
What is the problem with that? I mean, if you want a true team experience, you need a captain. Otherwise you are not a team, just six random players grouped together.
I never did any of those when I used LFG.
Heck, I didn’t even locked roles! I set them as 1-1-1-3, with no locks, and told the people who picked the non-flex slots that if they wanted to play another role, just give us a nod before swapping, so that we could cover for them.
You don’t need to be a control freak just to have coordinated play with randoms. If you want to actually form a real team, yeah, assign roles and make sure you are doing your best in your assigned role. But for LFG? Carrots are better than sticks.
I still remember one of those groups where our assigned DPS was verified by another person on the team, and they said “our DPS is a Mercy main”, I said I don’t care and if they want to play DPS, it’s on them. As soon as that player started to rant that it was dooming the team, I kicked them out. I don’t mind playing with any player out there, but I have little to no patience to control freaks.
Which is also one of the main reasons why I always told my team that they playing whatever they like and are confident playing is more important than making a “proper” team comp. A proper team comp is only relevant after you already had a proper team, and not 6 randoms playing together. For wild cats team, playing your best hero achieve better results than forcing half of your team into playing something they don’t enjoy playing.
All member of the team need to adjust to the other 5 members. If you have a solo Moira healing, you need to stay together so that she maximize her healing output. If your solo healer is a Mercy, you stay slightly separated so that you can give her full mobility options. If you have double snipers, make sure to play at their line of sights so that they can make picks in the chaos. And neither of those requires the team to fit a specific team comp, just to be considerate what your teammates are playing.
It’s Blizzard’s fault for not balancing that demand before implementing role queue. For starters, before implementing that system, we should had closer number of heroes in all three roles.
And I’m not saying to wait 8 years so that they create 10 new tanks and healers before implementing role queue. But they could do what they did to Symmetra and simply move and adjust some heroes around. Make Mei and Doomfist into proper tanks, and turn Sombra and Symmetra into support units. That would give us 12-9-8 ratio, which a a lot closer than 16-7-6 like we had when the system launched.
WoW have 60% of team slots going to DPS and they still face long queue times. I keep asking why Blizzard thought this would be different in OW, when you have literally more DPS options than tank and supports combined.
So while a small part of that issue is on “selfish DPS players”, you can’t forget to point out that Blizzard did nothing to minimize the issue before implementing it.
How can they balance it before implementing it?
You know how long that would take?
So wait another few years then?
Oh okay.
So DPS are basically never allowed to have anything new?
Also… let’s do some math.
Overwatch came out mid-2016. Since then, the amount of heroes they added are 10 new heroes over the course of 3 1/2 years.
That means on average, they have released 2.86 heroes every hero according to the equation below:
10/3.5 = 2.86 (rounded)
But for the sake of argument, let’s round this number up to the nearest whole number which is 3 heroes every year.
This would mean that if we added 10 more non-DPS heroes as the main focus for hero releases, we would have to deal with the inconsistent matchmaker with mega toxic teammates, stubborn one tricks, and steamrolled games for another 3-4 years if we waiting for 10 new heroes to be added not to mention it may tank longer as time goes on since the more heroes added means more balancing to the overall game.
Honestly im looking forward to this feature. I queue up for dps, load up an aim training mode, practice until the game loads and then play. I may be biased because I also really like deathmatch, but I think this is a great feature for dps players in particular
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Now that’s just not true. High ranks had to wait a while before role queue.
its all relative…how much of an increase did they get? were they also feeling compelled to play other games in the mean time before?
There is a reason, why QP Classic its always active… it is so u can go there to do your things without delay… without nothing like old widow-genji-hanzo matches. The new role queue Quick Match serves a new role now. As Jeff said, QP Role queue should be used for a warm up before a competitive… if u want to train a hero aim or have fun/throw I dont care how are u gonna call it, go to Arcade Classic QP!
People need to learn that… Quick Play Role Queue NOW is for playing heroes you know in competitive conditions without fearing to lose points or just for warm up! Everytime someone in a QP says “Its QP relax” (or anything similiar) I have to explain him that some of us are not here to throw or have fun doing random stuff… if u want to have a relaxed match go to Classic QP! Its active 24/24 hours, 7/7 days, 12/12 months ! Jesus… read and listen what developers saying/ publising on videos (and after all that explanation, they usually call me toxic. TOXIC, for explaining them what Jeff said!)…
You call it “downplay the mess” I call it “Do something fun while I wait”. Skirmish is not even near to “While you wait” cause you end up alone in an empty map.
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Read carefully what I wrote and reply to that, instead of what you think I wrote.