I see the hate in the forums, I’ve heard the map isn’t in rotation for OWL or something like that, I’ve never personally had any issue with it, there’s things I like and dislike about ever map, personally my least favorite is Busan’s Mecha Base, but it’s not so bad I’d give up and quit the match.
What makes Paris make you give up?
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Paris is GIGANTIC. That’s my biggest issue with the map.
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Interesting, It doesn’t feel particularly bigger to me. Why is that something that’s a deal breaker?
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Most of my games on Paris either fall into one of these categories with almost no in between:
- attack steamrolls point A and proceeds to steamroll point B
- attack unable to even take point A
- attack spends the whole time limit to take point A in overtime, then spends all game to take point B in overtime to either win or lose (50/50).
Just as with volskaya and horizon, the gameplay feel (which is entirely a consequence of which heroes exist at the moment and the current balance philosophy) doesn’t feel great with these maps given the very long walks to point for either side and the respawn times. It feels like banging your head against the wall the entire time either waiting to lose the game or waiting for defense to make a colossal mistake which then you can maybe capitalize on.
The only 2cp maps I really am ok with are Hanamura and Anubis, because they’re smaller and a bit more nimble.
4 Likes
It takes an eternity to get anywhere when attacking. Most people playing this game actively refuse to coordinate. This results in damn near impossible to win games (common problem with 2CP). If anybody dies on your team attacking point B, it’s pretty much a lost fight. Try walking from spawn as Cree and then getting sniped or killed by Hanzo spam. It’s awful.
choke-point on point A is the arguably the worst in all of Overwatch. Needs a doorway to the right. Game clinched in a point A full hold or defense doesn’t communicate a lost fight and gets rolled on point B.
3 Likes
BTC’s video is a good summary of the problems with the map and his proposed changes to fix it:
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My experience is entry of the map gives the defenders a giant height on a choke and attackers a very narrow area by which to bypass it. Unlike similar maps (eichenwalde/hanamura), very few attackers can go up and over the wall and then they cannot get into a hidden area.
This means that everyone who is attacking is forced to play aggressive or fast characters. And if the defending team isn’t prepared for that tactic, they’re going to get rolled.
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Oh that could be a nice change of pace, I do think it would be nice if there was an actual alternative-route instead of the pseudo-one through the police station. I still personally don’t have any major issues with this map, I like the aesthetic and this map doesn’t give me any more issues than any others, I have more issues with my team not coordinating or me being too stoned to react fast enough.
I’ll also say, personally, if attacking I like to either go for speed so I can pop through the choke and flank through the police station or food shop, or I’ll take echo and hang behind my team to wait for the enemy to be more focused on the choke, and I’ll fly up over the low roof on the left, sticky bomb, primary, and turn their focus backwards so my team can get through the choke easier.
As defense spawn does feel unfairly further away from the control point, which doesn’t matter if you can hold down the choke, but I think the single choke-point and the closeness of the spawn at the second control point always kind of make up for that. I kind of like that the map isn’t symmetrical, but I’d be down for a few reworks.
Attacking the first point is utterly miserable. One tight choke, with a second doorway halfway through the choke… like who on earth designed that??
Also why do defenders get free high ground with cover right behind the choke? Stupid in my opinion
The angles of attack at the first choke point are terrible. It’s preferable to just take the following Heroes:
- Winston
- Pharah
- Junkrat
- Wrecking Ball
- D.Va
- Sombra
And “rush” (or sneak, as best and fast as possible) directly onto the first Point (as Attackers) to provoke the enemy team to reposition onto the Point itself to defend from there. It’s better to do that than to try and “strategize” your way through that terrible choke. It’s similar to Hanamura’s first choke point, too. Although Hanamura’s is more manageable, but there’s similarities.
The 2nd Point in Paris isn’t too bad, in terms of available avenues of attack (3 ways basically, from the front directly, or from either sides). The problem, however, is that even for the 2nd Point, although there’s 3 paths to choose from, they’re all contained within a small space (especially true for the main hall from the front path to the Point). There’s VERY LITTLE freedom of movement and ‘leeway’ to avoid, dodge, kite or escape.
So basically, the main issue(s) with Paris is just the map layout in general. At least in my view. I have the same problem with Lunar Colony and 2 maps out of 3 in Lijiang Tower. Some maps (only a few select though) do have some pretty bad layout / physical design to them that favors one side A LOT MORE than the other.
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I’d argue there’s plenty more viable heroes and strategies that could get you through the choke, I said in my last comment how I utilize Echo on that map and I can’t think of a time that didn’t work for me, as long as you know who to target first. I’d also argue that it’s just a new challenge playing in tighter corridors and spaced, you can’t play the same way you would in a more open space.
I don’t know, personally I try not to get too hung up on “what’s wrong with the game” and instead, step my own game up, strategize, and just have fun playing the cards we’re being dealt until the next patch/update
The choke for attackers going to point A is pretty rough and needs another route… other than that the map is fine.
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Attacking a is cringe walking to b is cringe let alone the attacking part
2 Likes
Everything. When I see that bunker with Torb and Bastion, Double shield with any supports, I am out. They keep the high ground early on, which is a huge disadvantage to attackers. And then, if you get through somehow, second point is so hard to take unless you snowball them through first and second, which doesn’t happen that often. It’s a worse version of Temple of Anubis, and I don’t even like Anubis
Everyone knows the A choke is atrocious, but falling back to point still gives massively favorable terrain.
B you need tons of range and mobility to get anything done.
All of this and you get all the 2CP problems, but worse.
Point A is a badly designed Anubis. The only options attackers have is to barrel down the middle of the map or TP past choke. The flanking routes are absolutely useless to the attacking team with police station being extremely difficult to get to safely and the balcony on the other side providing no cover for your team. This point badly needs the Eichenwalde treatment to make it more bearable, with some changes to the balcony area to provide better cover for both attackers & defenders.
The distance between the attacker’s 2nd spawn and Point B are among the longest in the game. The ridiculously long sightlines at B offer far too much value to defending snipers and give far too much time for defending teams to reposition.
a rework to the map would be a good idea and i wonder if blizzard would concede if the hate is strong enough. that is the question lol
Paris is awful because:
- Point A Chokepoint has high ground directly opposite making it pretty much impossible to push through the choke if the enemy are playing anything that can spam. e.g. Junk, Pharah, Bastion.
- Point B has so many entrances that it’s impossible to cover of every angle at the same time.
- Attackers spawn is much farther back than other maps, at least it feels like it
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I can confirm ball is broken in paris
I played mystery heroes once
was ball
we were about to get rolled on second point until I got hammond and spun above the enemy team but still contesting so