Yeah that’s not a “poll” at all. Thanks for proving my point. The forum equivalent of TV ratings.
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When their argument (in the title of the thread itself) has them being a “top player” as a part of it there is not separating the person from the argument. When someone claims to be an expert their expertise and qualifications to claim such becomes a part of any rebuttal as much as it became a part of their initial argument.
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Lets recap.
Objective question? no answered.
Attack the title and “poll” yes, so we can remove this blemish…
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So no argument, just a question, do you want algorithmic handicapping in your games?
(mind you “top player” is also subjective. being above average TO ME is “top player” - just sayin).
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Same question presented in a way that does not inherently bias the results
Do I want games that are fair and balanced with both teams having an equivalent chance at victory? Yes as do a lot of people.
(Mind you “top player” in percentile and in overall population is also different, would you call someone who played in the minor leagues for baseball but never got out of AA a top player? Because by percentage of people to ever play baseball they would be, but they also wouldn’t even be in the top 1000 of players to play the game in a given year.)
Either way what does this thread add that their manifestos that have been posted multiple times don’t outside of their claim of being a top player. People have seen it, they’ve read it, and reading it 12 more times won’t present anything new to them.
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How would you like the system to achieve these results? What Variables should they look for?
And already… baseball is different to a video game. Good point, but AA as of 2018 - maybe that same player is in the majors 2022? Blame the devs for lack of recent stats, and platinum was what perctile? 5%? Overall its STILL relative. you didnt counter the argument you just made it an example.
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It’s not but nice try.
Like I said top by percentile is different that top in population. Can we honestly say that someone is a top player when there are 2 ranks (diamond and master) between it and gm?
Could they have made it to gm or top500 if they had dedicated time to it? Maybe we don’t know their potential. But it’s like a top prospect that ends up never making it in the majors because they chose a different sport or career. We can’t say they would be a top player eventually if they gave up.
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Clue 3 - when you have to quote yourself - something is wrong. (talking points dictate that you shouldnt go down certain paths).
Whats the number? 5%? 10%? I was just wondering. And what do you think it is now? Like when does the budget run out for your retainer?
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Clue for you if someone isn’t interested in responding to your question, quoting yourself won’t make them more interested. Just because you ask a question doesn’t mean it deserves an answer.
But I’ll humor you this once. I don’t care what parameters they use as it is not my job to determine that nor is it any of ours. If it were my job or if I were extremely interested in it I’m sure I could examine the possibilities and come up with at least an idea or two of what would be ideal. But why would I? I have other concepts for games I want to make that I’d rather devote my free time to.
Even then why focus on things out of our control above what we can? When I play destiny or hearthstone (the games I play a lot more than any other right now) I don’t concern myself with why numbers or cards are a specific way instead of what changes I can make to my build or deck as well as my piloting of those builds and decks to improve their performance.
Why do you insist on numbers we have no way of knowing? Like I said above (though admittedly I was editing to add it and you replied after so all good I’ll just put it here.)
Can we honestly say that someone is a top player when there are 2 ranks (diamond and master) between it and gm?
Could they have made it to gm or top500 if they had dedicated time to it? Maybe we don’t know their potential. But it’s like a top prospect that ends up never making it in the majors because they chose a different sport or career. We can’t say they would be a top player eventually if they gave up.
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Just because you dont care, doesnt mean you should set a goal to discredit others who DO care.
ahh you slipped this one in… and you have a point. A game is what it is, its shipped and packaged and we buy it or not. However, when we it comes to games of “chance”… some where someway lawmakers made it that variables should be known, BUT NOT HERE!
He answered this question, he DOES believe to know and wants to control the variables you dont. Thats HIS decision. Weather if he is GM or bronze, thats his decision.
If this OW stuff is successful, whose to say they start slipping in some algorithms as to what cards you start with or who you play in OTHER games. Just cause you play OTHER games doesnt mean its any less important.
And why?
By you hiding out dated numbers actually weakens the argument of
because
Its subjective, me barely making plat - I consider him a top player. (predicition: High elo ego coming in 5…4…3…2…)
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The matches are rigged. That’s not even in question.
And I totally hear you, if only others would follow-suit and stop endlessly coming to the defense of and acting like the unpaid marketing interns of exploitative mega-corporations.
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How do you know? What’s your evidence that most people from any population just don’t like MMR and would rather see it removed?
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TBF both sides of it are obnoxiously spammy after the first couple of posts. If only there was a “suggestions” category so the rigged kiddies could go spam that instead, and draw the people determined to prove them wrong out as well. Then maybe this subcat would be… well, useful. 
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Let’s take a step back for a moment. You’re leveling an ad hominem attack against these “rigged kiddies” as you call them (good to see that hypocrisy is alive and well, as just the other day you were telling me, essentially, that I shouldn’t attack people, that I should keep it high level and classy and discuss ideas). But putting that aside, since the operative word here is “rigging,” what is your understanding of how “rigging” is definitionally being used by the “rigging kiddies?” What’s your articulation of the rigged argument?
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ad hominem is when somebody uses your character fault as a reason to discredit your argument, not when feelings are hurt. I’m not really making an argument about the matchmaker right now, so it’s not really possible for me to be employing the ol trusty ad hom about it. 
besides, “you’re wrong because you smell bad” != “you’re wrong because of XYZ, plus you smell bad.”
don’t be afraid to throw a little friendly shade 
no no, you just assumed all of that without it being said. I said I didn’t want to bother debating something with you. Don’t read so deeply into things… You’re free to live your life how you want, I’m not imposing anything on you. I just don’t want to get sucked into a long winded discussion that will go nowhere! lol
I don’t have one and don’t care to engage in one. I don’t care if it’s rigged because climbing is easy and I think most people can figure it out if they’re pointed in the right direction. 
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Climbing is easy - where “easy” is subjective. I wish I knew what else I was being measured against.
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If you can’t comprehend how calling someone who disagrees with your point of view a “rigged kiddie” is ad hominem, maybe google the definition again. In fact, let me help you out, since, oddly, you believe you must physically be in the act of debating someone to engage in an ad hominem attack.
“This fallacy occurs when, instead of addressing someone’s argument or position, you irrelevantly attack the person or some aspect of the person who is making the argument. The fallacious attack can also be direct to membership in a group or institution.”
If I publicly start a post (I am not replying to anyone, instead I’m making a public declaration to no one in particular) that people who believe X are immature, stupid, and delusional, I have attacked those people. The fact that I am not literally engaged in a conversation with any of them doesn’t change the essence or the irrationality of my statement. Implicit in “rigged kiddies” is of course negativity about those people and what they believe. The smell bad analogy is just off-based and ill-conceived since your insult about these people is rooted in what they believe and not some irrelevant aspect of their person.
Even if none of this were applicable (and it is) I believe the point of your last criticism was that we should be and do better when communicating, rather than looking for justifications to excuse poor behavior. I guess you’ve changed your mind. If rigged kiddies is ok, do you mind if I refer to you as a sycophantic-corporate-apologist?
Incorrect. I didn’t assume anything. You accused me of attacking you and being negative, which is why you didn’t want to debate. That’s fine. I don’t take any particular pleasure in debating this topic. I do it to correct the many flaws and attitudes I endlessly see in these conversations, especially by those who get it wrong while being haughty.
Lol. Of course you do, it’s why you use “rigged kiddies” as a pejorative. But I don’t blame you for turning tail and running. Those who say “there’s no rigging” apparently don’t understand rigging, nuance, or context, and so it’s an indefensible position.
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You’re not being measured against anything. You’re being given empty rhetoric: “increase your skill,” which doesn’t address any of the arguments or criticisms usually being made.
This is like being told “just make more money” when you complain about an embezzling employee. This is what often passes for logic here.
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didn’t assume anything lol
My guy, you took it upon yourself to twist this:
into this:
I’m sorry if it offended you, guy. Let it go and make peace. You’re beginning to make me feel like I’m stepping in tar. Better to just walk around. 
I’m sorry, and this is crazy off topic for OP, but if I refused to debate something with you last time under the reason that it didn’t seem productive or enjoyable… what makes you think twisting it into “running” is gonna work this time? 
LOL I glazed over this part sorry
Not really, no. It’s actually kind of funny. 
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This week , because there are like 1k people left playing comp.
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