To all Brig nerf advocates: tell me how

General Discussion
1

I’m neither for nor against a nerf. For now results in Quick play seem to give the impression that she’s very strong. I personally don’t have any troubles playing agaonst her. Yes I am A LOT less effective with Tracer with an enemy Brig on the map. However, while my individual stats as Tracer have gone down, I still win a lot of those matches of my team even barely follows up on my offense. Brig is basically pulled like a Magnet by Tracer. I don’t know if it’s stupid supports who are obsessed on “settling” the score woth Tracers or what, but injust need to poke to make brig’s leave their post and chase me anywhere I want, as long as I give her that impression that she might be able to charge me.
This leaves the enemy team down 1 support. She doesn’t peel, she doesn’t heal. Yeah I don’t get my 31-3 stats anymore but hey, I’ll still take the win.

Admitted, as a tank main I struggle a lot with an enemy Brig, especially as Rein. But I think Rein needs buffing, not Brig needing a nerf to be honest. It will indirectly nerf her ofc but I mean Rein is basically a 500hp ult battery at the moment. Or i just haven’t found a way of actually playing around a brig as a rein. If anybody knows a way there, I’m open to suggestions!

So back on topic: I see LOADS of brig nerf topics. I’ve even see a Junk main pretend she counters him which made me breath more air than usual out of my nose…

But I’m not trying to dismiss all of you pro Brig-nerf partisans. What i however do want is to know what your suggestions are?
She has lost her OHKO combo against Tracer meaning she can’t combo anyone to death without being interrupted. Her heal, although it can become very high overtime, is very situational and her self sustain is not that high if nobody feeds her. She gets 80HP per 5 seconds. How low do you want to make that? Her shield has 600HP yes but it gets absolutely melted down in no time, only slow heroes and Close combat heroes have trouble taking that out. Also don’t forget that reducing her shield HP will make her basically lose an ability. She needs the shield to get close to her target. If her shield has 200hp and keeps breaking she basically loses shield bash.

Her range is pretty short and her shield so small that AoE which directly hits the shield often still damages her.

Her ult is indeed incredibly “OP” not because of it’s effect itself but the fact that it remains. Having a 300hp tracer is nothing to laugh at. Especially since it’s 150hp armor…
I admit that her ult could have a more short effect. I’ve had instances where by the time my team and I had lost the shields I already had my next ult. Ready.

But so I’m done talking, it’s your turn! What are your suggestions for Brig? I want to hear realistic and reasonable nerf suggestions that don’t make her trash tier.

My solution would be to buff those who are hard shut down without it being the goal of the character like rein.

I also remind you: her goal is to be a peeler and protect that Zen or low mobility dps from flankers. She is, as far as I’ve understood, supposed to be one of the strongest 1v1 heroes.
So, now i’m done.

Forum Moderator: Edited for toxicity

2 Likes
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She lost her combo against tracer? Please tell me you’re playing the game instead of just posting in the forums? I still keep one shotting tracers easily and it is very easily doable. The only thing that change did is to not let u animation cancel ur melee weapon by doubling your dps.

So getting that out of the way… It’s shield bash really for the most part. I think most accept that her ult is powerful, and it should be such. But shield bash is a 1 sec duration stun, medium range, extremely short cooldown. humongous hitbox. and shields can not even block it. This ability counters most heroes more than the heroes she’s supposed to be good against (Tracer, etc)

4 Likes
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I don’t think we can accurately tell her balance right now. Blizzard has more stats available to them on the things that we can’t see. Like how often she interrupts ultimates, how much armor she is providing per match(people are just flaunting her healing), how often that armor boost leads to winning team fights, etc.

Brigitte is like Ana and Moira before her. It’s not that easy to quantify her impact on being just released and a lot of her stats are going to be effected by bad players who don’t know how to take advantage of her kit. Brigitte is essentially a brawly support, a Roadhog player would do probably do better than someone who mains Mercy but a lot of her stats are being skewed by the people that play the easier supports and can’t take advantage of her kit.

If I were to do anything it would be to increase the cooldown on her shield bash and decrease the size of the hitbox as it’s basically foolproof then let Blizzard decide the rest with their stats or wait to see how she’s doing in comp.

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:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

Lol, yuuuuuuup. I’ve seen that mistake way too many times, it’s the tunnel vision effect that supports so often get mad at dps for. I play flex though, so i don’t fall for that stuff, cuz it’s the same strats i would use.

Edit: Actually i’m gonna address a few other things cuz i really agree

So very, very true. Rein needs a passive to help keep his shield up

I saw that one too. I was flabbergasted.

I agree on pretty much everything else right up to:

Idk, its the armor’s permanence that makes the ult worth it right now, a direct nerf to that would make it very low-impact. But i do also understand the snowballing health concern. So i would say if it did need a change a good compromise would be to lower the max armor and add healing.

5

Hitbox on shield bash is absurd. I don’t see how it can remain the same. There are no-skill abilities and then there is shield bash that hits even on complete miss.

Why not make sleep dart Roadhog-sized? Supports need to protect themselves.

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As far as I know shield bash does 50 and her whiplash does 75. So if i go against a good tracer i either deal 50SB+30melee and she recalls or 50+75 whiplash and she recalls woth 25 hp left. That’s assuming she has no aoe heals or anything taking place. Also if I get hit by a Brig as tracer I always manage to recall. A combo is a combination of hits you cannot stop in any way. Meaning the brig is supposed to be capable of dealing 150damage without tracer being able to react ever.

Edit: wow… so saying people are brig nerf criers actually got my topic modified… foe toxicity… I didn’t even know that was considered being toxic. Is any “negative” word actually legal anymore on these forums. I put “negative” in quotes just because I’m actually not sure if “negative” might be a "bad"word too? Anybody who would have read the whole topic would have seen that I clearly am not roxic about this but trying to genuinely look for suggestions.

But sure, just brand this topic to be “toxic” from the get-go. Thanks mod!

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Mate. 50 + 35+ 70 = 155. Shield bash does 50. Melee does 35. Whip does 70. U can combo this EVERY time before she can recall. I do it all the time.

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I manage to recall out every time. So do enemy tracers. Maybe it’s a latency issue? Any way, doesn’t work for me. I can’t chain 3 hits. I’m on console btw, don’t know if the latency there will generally be higher or what…

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Shield Bash is a flashbang that’s easier to hit on a shorter cooldown. It doesn’t just affect Tracer, it affects every CQC hero- more so than Tracer- and that is stupid.

I would just like a longer cooldown on a powerful ability.

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I agree that objextively speaking, her stun is very powerful and could have a longer CD but there’s one problem, she’s supposed to peel for supports and they get constantly harrassed. Right now a lot of Brig’s use SB to engage in a fight. In pro or high level play, I think it will rather be used for peels fro zen’s especially. And if the CD is longer than 5 it will be too long and the Zen will get shut down. I think that’s the idea behind it. But the problem is that the sprt cooldown ends up shutting down tanks hardcore. A hog can effectively no longer take a breather…

Balancing thia so she can still be a huge threat to flankers without shutting down tanks along the way is almost impossible to balance out…

It’s a real haed challenge and problem to solve.

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It’s because topics that discuss how to proactively fix things don’t get any attention, every comments in sh*tpost threads instead.

Since you asked, here is what she needs:

  1. Buff. - Fix her shield so that it does, well, anything against splash damage. Pharah and Junk hard counter her. Everyone else is boned.

  2. Nerf. Switch the effects of whip shot and shield bash. Whip now stuns, Bash now knocks back

  3. Increase cooldown on new whipstun to 8 seconds.

1 Like
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I think she’s pretty balanced except her Shield Bash hitbox, it’s massive and doesn’t match the visuals at all. It’s almost as bad as Genji’s Deflect.

However, if she was to be nerfed, I think shield health from 600 to 500 and Shield Bash cooldown from 4 seconds to 6 seconds could be it, though it might be a little over the top. Maybe Whip range reduced from 20 meters to 18?

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As a support flex Almost everything about her is balanced. Everything BUT shield bash.

IMO it needs 1) a hitbox fix. 2) 8s cooldown nerf OR make it unable to trespass enemy shields.

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htt ps://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/overwatch/t/make-shield-bash-cost-some-shield-health/49605/27
I direct you to a thread I made.
space is in the https

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I personally was thinking of increasing CD of SB up to 6 AND have shield stop the bash, especially for rein. The thing with the hitbox fix is hard. Because it can quickly end up like DF and make it become rather a mobility tool rather than a stun. And for that it’s too weak.

To give you an example: DF whole body Hitbox is smaller while using RP than in being neutral. Meaning: if you get bodyblocked, you can pass through by using RP…

It’s sad to think RP is used as a fleeing tool rather than an engage which is to be feared…

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Spamable CC is never fun to play against. I’d say test a 6 to 7 second cool down on Shield Bash and call it a day.

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(Essay incoming. The answer to the OP is in the final two points for anyone who wants to skip ahead.)

I think it’s important to look at what Brigitte is intended to do, versus how she works, and to try and bring them in line.

So Brigitte was intended to counter Dive-style strategies. So let’s dissect that first.

  • Dive generally uses two Dive Tanks, Winston and D.Va, who have high health and mobility, but do low tickle damage, and also have some defensive abilities.
  • Dive heavily favours the use of flanking style heroes, such as Tracer especially, but also the likes of Genji.
  • Damage-boosting abilities like Discord Orb and Mercy’s damage boost are also crucial, allowing for the dive tanks and any mid-liners like Soldier: 76 or Widowmaker to do much more damage than normal.

So, looking at Brigitte’s design, it’s clear what each bit of her kit is built for with respect to the above.

  • Being able to actively deploy armour significantly dampens the effectiveness of the Dive tanks, and the ultimate renders these heroes borderline useless.
  • Brigitte is more difficult for flankers to engage due to her shield, and bash. Her primary attack is also very difficult for flankers to avoid, due to its wide sweeping arc.
  • Brigitte’s shield gives her a degree of protection to damage that other heroes don’t have.

But as with everything, there are some gaps and issues, so let’s look at some side-effects or oversights to those three points.

  • Dive is not the only strategy to use pepper damage, and the readily deployed armour also punishes balanced or underpowered heroes, like Roadhog and Reaper. Much of the roster uses this kind of damage.
  • Flankers are also best equipped to circumvent her shield, and can easily avoid a bash, whereas less mobile heroes like Reinhardt and Roadhog get punished quite badly by it, without much ability to play around it. The flail has poor range, meaning flankers can avoid it.
  • Brigitte’s shield is not especially durable, and she’s countered quite badly by Zenyatta, or the extreme burst-boosting that Mercy offers.

So I suppose the issue is that Brigitte isn’t overpowered, but more that she might not effectively counter the things she was designed to, and may adversely affect heroes who are already struggling or just about making it by.

So in terms of ratifying this, I have two key suggestions.

  1. Instead of granting Armour, introduce a new health/status type (we’ll call it Safeguard for convenience), which protects those with it from damage boosting effects. This will substantially hinder the effectiveness of Zenyatta and Mercy’s ability to single out targets for Winston and D.Va, without adversely affecting heroes like Reaper. Without the ability to single-out targets, Dive loses a lot of its power.
  2. Change the shield-bash mechanics so that instead of a full-stun, it only temporarily disables movement abilities (similar to a hack, but for things like Dash and Blink only). This will make it only effective for punishing mobility heroes, whereas other heroes who don’t depend on their mobility to function will continue to operate normally.

And there you have it. She plays basically the same, but her match-ups now actually work against what they’re meant to.