Now I have seen it all. Looks like Sym’s next on the chopping block. Yes, let’s just nerf anything threatening the status quo. No need to overcome and adapt.
ah yes because sym’s uptime/job is entirely just putting down a tp, surely it doesn’t involve any damaging from her weapon fires or zoning with her turrets at all /s
if those “situations” hardly ever occur inherently because of the environment of the game, that clearly it’s a case of unreasonable expectations being held in balancing —> they are bad.
E.g. delete reaper’s mobility/nerf it to be as unavailable as infinite tp and he’ll be in the same situation as sym for uptime (i.e. highly dependent on team pockets for uptime), that simply “situational” or simply just being balanced to be bad? Clearly the latter.
And before you fail to understand why I bring this example up thinking it’s an unrelated tangent, it’s an example demonstrating how your argument is a fallacy.
The reciepts are there you know.
Clearly you acknowledge there being nerfs, but deny that the nerfs trashed her kit and instead claim that post nerfs she’s more viable than before. This further reinforced by the fact that you deny that infinite tp was a nerf despite that being the worst nerf she recieved that lowered her uptime.
You further proclaimed that despite how much vastly less independence sym has for her uptime, that you like her teamplay and also tried arguing that her level of dependence for uptime is acceptable. I.e. clearly claiming that she’s fine despite how much worse off she is compared to others and and despite her nerfs as shown in my earlier comparisons.
But sure. I’m the one with reading comprehension issues /s
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For what ever reason pros were not countering this comp as many would on ladder, As in Pharah/echo duo with a mercy in tow would normal destroy this style of comp.
But yet teams ran what they practiced into an off meta that exploits that kind of engagement.
If the top dps aren’t Tracer, Cree and Soldier then the game is in an unhealthy spot. No, I don’t want to play CoD.
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Are you intentionally provocative/difficult to speak with? It’s kinda ridiculous… 
This whole 
/s /s /s style of yours is a sign of your immaturity
You really need some lessons on how to speak with other people, because this is not the way pal.
This is your opinion. While you think Sym is bad, and likely think Brig/Sombra are bad for the same reasons of “most of ladder sucks at working together”, others don’t because they have teammates willing to work together. Sorry that you don’t. It’s not our fault that your teammates would rather play cluelessly and/or selfishly as if this isn’t a team game.
You would think you’d actually read what’s being said since it’s in writing, but instead you come up with ideas of your own of what other people are saying.
Yes, Sym has been nerfed. Her kit was not “trashed”, that’s your opinion. Infinite TP was not a straight nerf, that again is your opinion. You need to realize that your opinion is not fact. It’s no wonder your conversations go nowhere, you live in a bubble where you’re right about everything. 
You definitely are Again and again you prove that you aren’t comprehending what other people are saying, and on top of that you put words in their mouth. Those are 2 telltale signs that you are having reading comprehension issues. You also clearly don’t understand what a discussion is, as assuming your opinions are facts will get you nowhere. You have 2 ears and 1 mouth, speak less and listen more, it may actually get you somewhere.
Again, after countless comments, instead of asking questions to understand other peoples perspective, you continue to go on tirades to satisfy your own personal ego. It seems you’re a lost cause at this point, as you’ve made zero efforts to correct your behavior… maybe eventually you’ll realize how poorly you act…
It’s very telling that you conveniently left out the last part of Happys comment where they said
Clearly you have no interest in finding common ground. You just like to argue
Because all her “strengths” have huge caveats that were covered before.
She can’t get soldier level dps without being hard enabled due to all the lows previously mentioned.
Turrets ate easily destroyed if not escaped from and it requires the target to walk past them unlike a weapon fire that you can just aim and force feed damage onto them.
Team tps or any other “utility” use tps are conditioned on having a tp cast to do which was nerfed hard as downtime spiked up while demand to repurpose or relocate increased with tank nerfs. Thus more dichotomous for tp usage and resulting in less independence for uptime.
Tp use cases legit at best remained the same.
What strenghs?
Except
- Sym legit doesn’t have much close range burst (since toy mention going agaunst shields, I’d like to point out her primary legit is sustain damage, not burst)
- doom can more independently get uptime regardless of his niche (unlike sym) and legit he doesn’t have as narrow of a niche as sym does, i.e. a false equivalency
And a hero who’s balanced or designed to be incapable of getting decent uptime for themselves in a game environment such as OW’s and when most other heroes are being balanced and designed to be able to, this is factually a problem, i.e. they factually are worse.
As explained earlier:
i can see tracer but mccree and soldier lol, they are COD. soldier especially you have average cod archetype with an assault rifle, underbarrel grenade launcher thats way better than most fps’s, strong sustain fire and even has the ability to run away very fast and heal himself.
mccree is as basic you can get for an fps point and click, dude has a stun and burst fire to kill anything in front of him. hes better than COD
So Sym has no strengths?
I’m trying with you but I struggle when people make statements like these.
The distinction is immaterial once she reaches the highest level of her beam. She does extremely high damage in a short period of time. Just like Ana’s healing isn’t instant but considered burst
If Symm doesn’t have as narrow a niche as Doom, why is she picked more in the highest levels of play? Does that mean she is stronger in the niche?
I am listening and understanding your arguments but I have a hard time when you start to take design choices and paint them as objective facts.
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I would recommend not engaging. I have had zero discussions with Zephirin where they’re reasonable. They speak in extremes, spam emojis and /s, and make zero effort to find common ground. They’re just here to argue with you.
wish you the best of luck Happy.
To make symmetra work in their OW2 pvp where they fashion all dps to be more independant, symmetra needs her old 3.0 teleport back so she can become an individual hero again and make her own plays and be flexible.
Infinite teleport which relies on your own team to make use of it doesn’t work for OW2 design choice. Even less so when you consider the lack of second tank to shieldbot for her.
I would gladly take 8 second uptime teleporter with 12 second cooldown so I can actually reposition properly and attack as I please, over this current thing where I have to stick it on spawn so my dead teammates can walk back faster for most value in uncoordinated environments.
I would personally rather have a compromise between the 2 styles. TP lasts forever, but its cooldown starts and ticks down until it freezes at 6 seconds.
There are a few static tp spots (as in you want to last forever) on Lijiang, nepal, gibraltar (defense 1st point, 3rd point), Eichenwalde, Hollywood, route 66 and Oasis off the top of my head. There’s a lot of static tp spots for 2cp, but they are all getting removed so who cares.
Yeah because that question came outta nowhere. you initially asked about her state compared to others and how her nerfs impacted her state overall considering all other changes to other heroes and very clearly sym has been nerfed way more than she had been given buffs, and I’ve already went through how much worse she is compared to others in all aspects. Like there simply is not much she is better at compared to others as there’s massive caveats gatekeeping everything as explained before.
Last I checked soldier’s primary dps is not burst damage. And sym’s lvl 3 dps is literally the same as soldier’s primary.
- i said sym has a narrower niche than doom. Df there’s nothing in his kit design or bakancing that hard limits him from working in general dive rather than specifically only against double shields.
- Because the highest levels of play can actually land cc on df and consistently follow up on it.
There’s a big difference between a design choice that’s reasonable/viable/fair compared to one that’s simply unrealistic or unreasonable.
E.g. to demonstrate the difference, they make another sniper dps like widow with same aim requirements except they can only deal damage with headshots, anything else deals 0. Now is that merely a “design choice” or is it a design that clearly going to crash and burn because it’s simply holding unrealistic expectations?
Very clearly the latter.
And when it comes to dependence for uptime, it’s the same principle. Esp when the very large majority of the cast are very independent in getting uptime for their respective jobs regardless of their niche (i.e. there inherently is a standard they are already using for those heroes).
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Nice to see someone reasonable 'round here.
If only everyone was willing to admit that Infinite TP has its advantages.
I’m interested to see what Sym will look like in OW2.
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I don’t understand what makes Sym unfun since she counters no one and her turrets are easily destroyed. Is it her beam or orbs, what is it that make people call her unfun?
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It really does, but Zephrin has a point on how the flexibility and offensive utility of TP got nerfed with the change. They are also correct about Sym’s slow ramp-up times to be effective. A lot of Sym’s gameplay is recognizing the few situations where you should go on the offense with your left click (it’s usually always on the point). Our discussion on that is in vain though until we wait and see what the devs do for OW2.
But you and Zephrin both have valid points. I miss my flanking uptime with old tp, but I would also miss my double orb combo, and defensive utility of infinite TP also.
Sym/Mei comp just simply highlights how much of a joke this game has become.
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How so? I don’t understand why people dislike facing Sym. Now I like Mei, but I do understand why people dislike her.
I’ve never disagreed with Zeph that old TP had its advantages, but unfortunately Zeph refuses to acknowledge the benefits of Infinite TP and insists it’s nothing but a nerf regardless of what other people say. Zeph has no interest in finding common ground or coming to an amicable agreement, they just want to argue for the sake of arguing it seems.
I agree that Zeph has some valid points and even said so, if only they could express themselves in a civil manner and not dismiss others, they might be worth speaking to. Thanks for your civility 
It’s incredible how you and I can have a perfectly friendly conversation even if we potentially disagree on some things. It’s really not hard as long as both parties put in the effort
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same thing with torb they can’t hit those dumb little turrets plus just like torb she’s normally paired up with bastion and helps bastion with tps so that probabaly amplifies it
Visual busy cluster for once. And using Sym+Mei’s strat means you just want to brawl and stack shield/wall on top of shields. There is almost nothing involving shooting in a shooter game.
Most audience would expect the best players in the game to pull mechanical demanding high risk high reward moves, not the formularic all out brawl.
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