Lets be real with it : Nothing will die with this game’s healing creep state. Unless you play 1 hit KO like Hanzo or Widow, the team will never die, the burst heal is insane that make OG sp like zen and lucio healing feel so damn weak.
Take a look at Sombra emp, that thing deal 30% max health now, and if u notice, the enemy always healed back to full the moment u turn around to gun them down.
There are certain comps that you have no way to reach the sp in the very far back of the team. And you have no way to deal with their tank as long as their sp still alive
Nade is just necessary evil against bapt, overbuffed lw, ana herself healing creep power
Every single support except Liveweaver has had their healing nerfed since OW1/ OW2’s launch
Also everyone is currently complaining about how easy the new tank dies and that you have to hard pocket him to keep him up. 650hp isn’t enough for a tank that can generate overhealth to survive; and HEALING is the problem?
Mauga is dying because of ana and zen, without anti nade, hes insane with dmg reduction, healing on too and insane ttk, like i said, necessary evil for op 60% lifesteal
can you give me replay code, Im pretty sure with 650 hp and dmg reduction from E alone, unless u hit every headshot on him, he wont die that easily.
You know Ana is picked as necessary evil against hog ? Insane healthpool and heal, a walking death sentence if he close the gap, without anti nade or sleep, nothing can kill him
Let Mauga players learn how to use his low charge, high steering power- better Rein charge, and play offensively with him. As long as i can see, people are playing him like orisa
Its mostly people doing as they have usually done and not playing heroes with high damage output. The DPS roster is flooded with high DPS output heroes from Torbjorn, Echo, S76, Bastion, Reaper.
In some situations, Sombra, Sym, Cass, Sojourn, Hanzo, and Junkrat might be added to that. Sombra = 160dps. Sym can get up to 180 dps on beam. Cass has 150 on fan the hammer. Sojourn is 130 and lots of spam dmg. Hanzo is bursty with storm arrow.
The bulk of your DPS players don’t play in a spam DPS fashion. They play in a flanky or sniper fashion most often. These two comps of flanking/sniper have atrocious DPS output. Either from long periods of down time or missing shots with low innate DPS output.
Mei wall is a phenominal anti-nade of sorts by cutting off heals to a tank from LoS blocking. Same with Winston bubble. Mauga cage fight or sigma barrier or ramattra shield…
His dmg reduction is kind of sad. He gets 30% dmg red… which is literally the same as any tank with it naturally built into their armor like rein, winston, dva, and orisa. His healing aspect is only viable on the shots he can hit which when you go full auto you are missing a large portion of damage unless going against another tank.
Its very easy to kill him given his completely lack of any self defense for most of the match. The dudes literally a cross between a roadhog and reinhardt, but at least Reinhardt can shield himself to get healed up between damage or roadhog can 50% dmg red, 300hp heal, and 50% hp for 2sec afterwards.
When I get DPS players that actually stop trying to force BS like genji, tracer, ashe, or widow and actually pick something with heft like S76, I see all sorts of Mauga swap off the hero.
30% dmg reduction with 60% lifesteal, Mauga need to pick fight that can work for him, and bail away asap with his fast charging, low cd, high steering power shift. There is reason why its on so low cd, as if blizz want u to exploit it to repositioning
Both of his abilities are much lower cd than tank game changing abilities like Queen’s shout, sigma grasp, so Blizz want you to rotate charging in - E and go ham - charge out
Like , the shift does not even have charging up animation and cancel even faster than rein, there is no downfall of spamming that ability unless you charging in the middle of enemy team and 5 men ulti then exploded
I understand the flanker that either don’t do much damage or have to get in close (where he can unload everything into you), but Ashe and Widow are just as strong as Soldier against him. His head hit box is huge.
The thing is I have greater confidence in a S76 at most any level to consistently get good DPS output than a Widowmaker/Ashe that miss every other shot, run away after having taken 50hp of dmg, or run away because the enemy team is getting to close to them visually.
You might want to check those patch records again. Since launch OW the original supports have been net buffed, including in team sustain. The post-launch supports getting nerfed over the years means very little considering that they all launched in grossly overtuned states except for maybe lifeweaver. Ana and her powerlevels have been disastrous for OW. Healing is absolutely a problem for this game and is significantly higher than it was at OW1 launch by a mile. Along with other issues like overloaded kits, barriers that do too much, too much burst damage, too much CC without diminishing returns, etc.
enough with the “necessary evil” stuff. It’s still an evil. And you’ll never guess who started heal creep and still gets away with their high HPS (unlike, say, Lifeweaver, who wasn’t even allowed to have 57hps)
Healing was 1000% higher in OW1 because of 2 tanks and 2 supports being able to rotate defensive abilities. Try doing any meaningful damage when you have to deal with shield, bubbles, grasp, and defense matrix all game with healing in between.
OW2 is better because with one less tank there is less spammable damage negating effects out of tanks. All heals and all Dps is now building towards ultimates since its all being less blocked by shields or damage reduction abilities.
Killing a tank is harder, but killing 200hp heroes is easier than ever without having to first get through 2 tanks, 2 tank defensive abilities, 2 heals, then 2 support abilities. Everything dies so fast now.
Though I should be understanding. Most player’s only know how to shoot the tank anyway and miss landing shots on anything else. Of course players feel like nothing dies when they can’t aim and shooting tank is less immediately rewarding now.
Again, I’m talking about LAUNCH OW1. A somewhat brief time before the devs ruined everything with terrible hero designs and powercreep. Outside of overpowered dive, 2-2-2 didn’t even become sustain cancer until Ana entered the scene which made having a barrier, a mainhealer, and off tank to soak threats the defacto ez mode. Ana who also caused the devs to buff Mercy from 50hps to 60hps, and then create heroes like Moira, LaunchBrig, ValkMercy, and Bap.
Comparing OW2 to late OW1 is disingenuous, but also the only argument 5v5 players really have to use.
In no universe is 5v5 OW2 better than the first year or two of OW1. The player count reflects this. It’s so painfully doesn’t work for many many reasons. The devs were hacks who created new heroes with way too much in their kits including team healing distribution, CC, other non-healing combat sustain, burst damage, unbalanced shields, etc. The current game is depending on your mandatory support players to spam heals on teammates while preserving your mandatory single tank’s life. It’s an embarrassing joke of a “hero shooter”.
ONLY IF YOU USE BURSTY HEROES who can deliver 200+ damage in like half a second. Or, with a cheesy play using sleep or antinade. Or the classic: press Q’s at the same time to win fight if the other team doesn’t have the right ult saved up to stop it. Heroes that output sustain damage struggle to kill anything by themselves thanks to pocketing and high ranged healing.
But players should be able to get value shooting any player on the other team. Completely ignoring the tank until supports are dealt with or until they are cut off from their team is dumb and restricting. Prioritizing squishy kills, and especially supports when they are finally vulnerable is terrible game design. It’s boring, and not at all how OW was meant to be played. This game used to be able to be played in so many different and creative ways. Now there is only like two possible ways to play the game, every match is basically the same, also, one team stomps on the other because of teammate diff and because the matchmaker literally can’t match players of the same skill into the same games. Now how on earth is that better than launch OW1 when the game had freedom and variety?
Listen to yourself. Double barrier tank was never required for high end play, even after hero limits were put it. You didn’t even need more than one tank to win matches without effort. Healing never needed to be crept up. Period. What makes you even suggest that it was necessary?
Ana and other terrible balance ruined everything. Other team has Ana heals? Suddenly solo support mercy, or zen+lucio/zen+sym/lucio+sym stops being viable altogether. Other team has Ana sleep and nade? Suddenly require a barrier tank, and/or a second (off) tank to mitigate her ez value projectile abilities.
It actually was fine. It did not need buffing into an ult were nothing could die in it without anti or one-shotting. Again, that was one of the flaws with OW balancing, buffing things unnecessarily which is how the game got so out of control like it did.
Overwatch was never a balanced game but it was 50x more balanced, fun, and competitive than whatever the hell current OW2 is. So many playstyles were viable and individual skill could carry even at a time when ult charge was practically free
The meta was literally 2 Winston, 2 Tracer, 2 Lucio back in Season 1 of Overwatch 1
Literally what broke the entire hero lock thing was a tournament ending in a 10 minute overtime stall by both teams swapping to 6 D.va
Also things DID die during Zen’s 200hps ult, that’s why they buffed it. It was literally worthless because you could just burst through it
No, Overwatch 1 launch was far, far, far worse than the game is now. 150 bodyshot Widowmaker? 70 damage FtH McCree? 150 hp Zen? There were so many flaws. The nostalgia is super thick here my friend. There was far less playstyles back then.
You can literally check yourself and see the same 1-3 heroes being at the top for entire months, yet now we have a MUCH larger selection of viable heroes and comps.
You have Sigma, Orisa, Zarya, Reinhardt, Soldier, Genji, Tracer, Ashe, Sojourn, Mei, Torbjourn, Ana, Bapsite, Illari, Lucio, Kiriko as top picks
It’s not like how it used to be where it was the same 2 tanks, the same 3 or 4 dps, and the same 2 supports for months and any variance was limited
I know I was there playing back then too. But geeee, if only the devs actually improved launch hero balance. Or, implemented some sort of format that prevented players from stacking the same heroes (lol). Going the hero limit route was perfectly fine and expected for the game, but it had nothing to do with also needing heroes contributing 2x more sustain to the game for it to work. I stg, OW player’s minds got warped by 2-2-2 comps thinking that organized high-sustain rotation (because of Ana) is how OW should be played, when actually a wild assortment of tank-damage-support compositions should be viable. Even team comps without a tank or a support should be doable if the team tries enough.
This is exactly what I’m trying to break through to you. Yes, it was a good thing that certain things could be killed through 200hps. 200hps AoE + user immortality for like 6 seconds in a game where the most non-ult healing is single target 50 hps is HUGE. It wasn’t “worthless” just because teammates could still die occasionally. That’s some entitled support player logic.
All those things needed changes, if you read back to what I already said I point out that launch OW was not balanced. Still significantly more so than late OW1 and OW2. Launch OW being flawed doesn’t change that it was better and had less flaws than OW2. Nobody is touching this game even when it is f2p.
Perhaps if you were a metal rank player or less. It was chaotic back in the day, but I know plenty of bad players who thought chaotic = unplayble. Ever since Brig and then Role queue the game got significantly more stale. Tanks that could thrive as mono tanks or used in triple tank comps suffered greatly under 2-2-2 or 5v5RQ.
Yes, I do remember that back in LATE OW1 thanks to crappy dev balance and stale comps thanks to role queue. And also for top 500 in the very very beginning, but there were only like 21 heroes at the start. So of course top500 players playing dive comp requiring the use of only like 8 heroes would have tracers (there were 2 million tracer players), genjis, winstons, and dvas (2 million of these too) filling the charts up there. But everything below mid-masters had a variety of heroes being used in the beginning.
Again you crack me up. Tank role became swap to counter or lose. Don’t have healing from supports? Lose. Can’t make plays as tank anymore unless you have teammates enabling you to the point were your job as tank is to stay alive instead of taking space or brutalizing out of position squishies. Sigma, Orisa, and Ram have the most idiotic overloaded kits imaginable. Oh wow, Ana, Bap, Illari, and Kiriko are playable and are good picks? No way!!! Wonder why… Don’t forget to mention Mercy and Liveweaver. All those supports soooooooo balanced and fun. Yeah, bringing them all up to Ana’s level was definitely the right call. /s
That happened in OW2 for multiple seasons. You’d have to have a severe case of brainwashing to think that a format that only lets you have 1 tank and only two slots for dps and supports could provide balanced hero variance. How many tanks are there? And you are telling me seasons were only two or three of them are meta with 10+ tanks to pick from is good variety? Tank playstyles are as boring as ever. I can already tell you never played tanks who could play away from their team or grief backlines, or matches with only one support or no supports whose job wasn’t to literally prevent the entire team from dying.
5v5 and bad hero balance is the problem making the devs homogenize new heroes so that they all have ranged burst ability, a dash, an invuln, multiple types of healing, but hardly anything original to contribute to the game anymore because they are being designed to compete with existing overtuned heroes. And when the devs do actually try to create a tame original one they end up adjusting them to be more bursty, beefy, or heal-spammy to fit in with the rest of them.
If anyone here is misremembering classic OW it is you. As high rank flex player back then you could do so much to the point of messing around as long as you played not-stupidly. There was much less pressure on individual responsibilities. You didn’t need to prioritize shooting the “right” target unless it was some dumb mercy trying to hide+rez.
It really seems like only the players who favor the very limited OW2 game playstyles, or only played OW1 towards the end who insist that the sequel is somehow better because “things can actually die”. Not saying that you specifically said this, but I’ve seen it said so much here and it’s simply bull crap. Plenty of death was happening in early OW, much more so than now with the game’s unkillable gigasupports and health-buffed monotanks soaking support spam. But there was less ranged burst present in matches back then too, even when widow and cree had more lethal range. OW2 5v5 was a completely unnecessary flop trying to force the game’s years of powercreep and bad balance work. As if it was made by people who didn’t play the good, original OW that made the name great. Only having one tank each match sucks. Requiring two overtuned supports every match that have to spend most their time healing sucks. Having only five players per team sucks. So many bad calls instead of just nerfing and reworking the problem heroes. Simply cutting out the new barriers and high healing would have done wonders for this game instead this clown show. End rant
Perhaps if you were a metal rank player or less. It was chaotic back in the day, but I know plenty of bad players who thought chaotic = unplayble. Ever since Brig and then Role queue the game got significantly more stale. Tanks that could thrive as mono tanks or used in triple tank comps suffered greatly under 2-2-2 or 5v5RQ.