I mean from this it seems you feel MMR is rigging games. Which is not its intent or purpose and there really is no solid evidence to counter that. Yes you have presented your experience as evidence and all I can say is my experience doesn’t back that up and that’s as far as your evidence can take you. I get the benefit of the doubt since MMR has been a part of the game since release and changing that because you feel something isn’t really an argument it’s entitlement.
The rest of the stuff you write, I can put down to you having a closed mind. If MMR doesn’t rig. Removal of MMR would increase SR variance and make games more about luck than skill and therefore less competitive from a basic logic perspective. The fact you think MMR doesn’t help when people rig SR, because it would be wrong for 2-3 matches before it started to corrected over in a pure SR system that wouldn’t react for 100s of matches, shows how one-sided and therefore flawed your opinion is. You are saying because someone ruins only 50 matches with MMR on because it’s wrong for 3 matches, we should turn it off and let them ruin 100 matches. It really shows you don’t consider the positives and take the negatives out of context. One more example of that is how you think MMR can correct 500 SR it’s only been shown to do that via decay or start of season GMs.
I think it doesnt matter if you think 50/50 Matching is handicapping/rigging or not. I still think its a trash system and should be removed. Its absolutely crippling for mobility and match quality. At this point in the games life im less worried about moving up and more about fun comp games. Since skill levels at ranks cannot stabilize with this system, match quality is miserable.
As a side note, Other thank COD no other games use a matching system like this and for good reason. 50% chance for both teams winning is only fair from the outside looking in. If MMR dials you in, any increased skill level you have gets washed out in the matching when they throw someone on the other team to balance you out, same goes for that other person. Unless your skill level far exceeds what mmr can calculate for you ±1000sr.
Wrong…. If you genuinely out perform your peers, teammates or enemies, the performance based system moves you higher.
How much higher is determined by how much more you outperform your peers AND how consistently.
Yeah cool, you had one game where you top fragged and two games after that where you did “okay.” To achieve high ladder mobility, even on aged accounts, you really need to be exceptional.
Valorant uses an SR and MMR based system. League of legends…. There’s a few others.
Is it possible that skill variance among the average ranks is inconsistent enough that it’s overly complex to determine one gold player to another?
Stop spreading misinformation. It’s inappropriate and offensive.
You are not outperforming your peers, you are outperforming a cherry-picked lobby, where the odds/outcomes are tampered with independently of the rank. They are rigged to be 50-50 in expectation.
It’s literally the opposite of outperforming your peers or your rank.
The only thing genuine is outperforming the rigging. Over and over without proper payout. It’s boring, rigged, and makes the entire experience a fake sham.
Thank you giving an example how misuse of the term algorithm handicapping does manipulate people to the point of name calling.
An algorithm is a set of rules that is followed.
Handicapping is anything that makes a game harder than usual.
Any system that makes a game harder or easier is algorithmic handicapping.
Which means even a chess tournament in real life uses algorithmic handicapping.
Simply not his problem. It’s how it’s done and if it’s anything it’s mmr.
Thanks for the reply receipts.
Funny I rewrote the post like a week go because it was full of unnecessary stuff but didn’t wanna repost or bump it cause not really a fan of spam.
It all boils down to the hope that you are “secretly” better than your SR suggests. Chances are good that you are not.
And that weak players, in your model, are suddenly much more consistently bad than they have been.
But it’s that inconsistency that makes them worse players. sometimes they play like someone two ranks above them and sometimes two ranks below them. This means that the external circumstances play too big a role for them.
It should be different. After placing a 4.2 account it becomes 3.9. If there was no mmr at all I would have to win over 15 games in a row to get back where i belong. Mmr makes this easier for me so I don’t have to ruin a lot of matches before I get back to 4.2 after my placements. I get like 30+ sr per win and I only lose like 18 sr untill im back at 4.2. This is why mmr is so usefull.
i agree 100 percent, its because its not real competition. Because competition is not based on fairness its based on skill only. Why don’t they make all the over watch teams in over-watch league fair and make it so players are spread to make it a 50 percent win chance for each match. No game would ever do such a thing for their tournaments as folks would see its not real competition and leave.
The match making system is put in place to make sure everyone in the ladder has a 50 percent win rate , and don’t get upset and quit or play less. In a fair match making you would have a solo que and a team que, where all it does is take people of similar rank and put them in matches.
i agree 100 percent, the reason for toxicity is because your matched with people in the same rank and clearly their is a massive skill difference, and when you search the history of said players, their on a massive losing streak where their the worst or second worst player in the lobby. This is one major reason gaming companies starting allowing players to hide their match history on their profiles and stats.
PLayers started to search for these feeders/trolls history, then use the infomation to curse or yell at players on their team, or flat out use it as excuse to afk in the game. You check the profile and see the guy is using hanzo with a 37 percent win rate on hanzo after 320 games.
PLayers get upset because they have to play out of their mind to carry lesser skilled players, the lesser skilled players get upset because people are yelling and screaming at them, and in some cases they go afk or throw the game. Sadly not all lesser skilled players are made the same, some KNOW their bad for their rank, and try to support others in game or not put themselves in situations to cause their team to have to carry them as much.
Lesser skilled players could win more in their rank, if they played as if they know their not as good vs certain enemy players on the team. For instance i play a moba game like league of legends, if i see a enemy team player is to good for me which is rarely the case as iam in the top 2-3 percent every season as a solo player, i wait for a team- fight or wait behind a defensive position and ping for help. I don’t go fight the guy 8 times in a row and go 1kill 8 deaths, then complain no one wants to help me.
Match making by gaming companies is basically a babysit service where they try to put 1-2 bad players for their rank on each team, and have the other 3-4 players carry them, or babysit them, so they don’t get upset and quit.
I got a 55% win rate with hanzo, get called a hacker in some games, trash in the next. At the end people hate relying on others, and hate being have to rely on them.
I can be a trash Hanzo if my tank doesnt push the objective. I can bet “smurf”/ hacker and hit all my shots if no1 is threatening me, cause their worried the tank is on the objective.
But yea I do agree rank integrity / team avg mmr vs role avg. time of day variance, stacking mmr avgeraging. All have factors that this system is not improving upon itself and thus subjected to flaws = which leads to rank integrity being poor, seeding new players in middle.