Tanks are affecting every role in the game

General Discussion
1

The tanks. A vital cornerstone of Overwatch really doesn’t feel like the word that they are described by. I explain more in this post.

While the armor part has been explained to me, and I still think that armor can be way more than just a flat damage reduction that noone really notices, that is besides the point.

The tanks being what I said they are has more implications than just the tank role. The supports, the DPS, everyone is affected by this.

The support

The supports currently have to baby the tanks due to the reasons stated above. This is why utility supports are kind of a paradox, since a lot of the tanks that we have in the game currently would be utility supports with a lot of hp if the tanks were to be reworked to be actual tanks and not utility supports with a lot of hp. We see these support fights and ever increasing complexity with playing supports and outhealing the dps from the enemy team because the damage that the tanks are taking a disproportional amount of damage for the amount of hp they have. It's like an arms race.

The DPS

While the ways that the tanks being absolutely terrible in this game doesn't affect the DPS category as clearly as it does the support category, I still think that it is important. The DPS are currently kind of useless. If it weren't for 2-2-2, the DPS would probably be the least played category in the meta. This is due to the simple fact that a lot of tanks have around the same damage as the DPS have, plus utility and the health that comes with the tank.

The tanks

But by far, the worst effects of tanks being garbage is felt in the tank category. It just doesn't feel fun to play tank in most matches because you don't feel like a tank. The reason why the GOATS meta even became a thing is because you have these tanks, with their relatively high dps and missing tankiness, with their own pocket support filling the tankiness gap. The GOATS meta was basically what would happen if you gave a tank the tankiness that tanks in many games have. The difference being, the tanks in Overwatch do way more damage.

How do we fix this?

This is just my personal opinion, and I am by no means a game designer or a balance professional. I am just giving my 2 cents about this problem and the way the devs can fix it.

I think that the tank category should be completely reworked, giving flat out traits and passives to them to make them more tankier.

Secondly, the amount of health they have should be increased substantially. i'm gonna take Orisa as an example here. Orisa has around 100 more health than Bastion in his turret mode. Once you account for the giant head hitbox that Orisa has and the overall bigger hitbox that the tanks have around the board, it almost evens out. She is basically reliant on her fortify to be a tank. Tanks should be just that. Tanks.

Thirdly, the thought of a tank should be revised a little. What I mean with this, is that nto all tanks have to have shields. I think tanks like Hammond are a great example of what tanks can be. Not all of them have to have a shield that is an integral part of their kit. Tanks should create space, and there are a lot of ways of making space other than just putting a shield.

What do you think about this issue? Do you agree with me or do you have a completely different view about this problem? Discuss!

4 Likes
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I’m down for this, as long as healing gets dropped.

Not by too much, just enough so that you don’t create juggernauts, I’m looking at you Ana and Moira

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Healing, when compared to other games, is substantially high in this game. I’m not saying to nerf the supports in this situation, but if it changes like I mentioned were to happen, it would create a lot of issues if the supports were left as is.

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Agreed.

If we let the tanks tank more in themselves, healing would need to be adjusted. Maybe not the little guys like Zen or Lucio, but maybe the heavy hitters like the two mentioned above

1 Like
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You’re not asking to play tank, you’re asking to play raid boss. Tanks only appear flimsy under concentrated fire from the entire enemy team.

4 Likes
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I’m not asking for a tank to be a raid boss. I’m not saying that they should be impossible to kill without the help of the team. What I am saying, is that the tanks should have increased health across the board so as to not have to be babied by the supports to not die as soon as they try to make space.

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I dunno, most of the problems with tanking I see are operator error.

2 Likes
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I agree with this part of your post, mostly

I think this idea was already present in Overwatch but as the game grew, the playerbase/devs grew to support one playstyle over any other.

(Pharah for example - hero enters the game with flight and vertical mobility but we haven’t gotten any new strategies to support her playstyle)

I want to see more unique approaches to creating space rather than just continue with this “bullet sponge” idea.

Personally, I would rather see Tanks survive more through utility rather than pure health. Pumping their health higher just lowers the TTK and not much else. Having skill and ability based methods to negate damage makes it so every match doesn’t come down to a DPS-check to see if you can burn a target before they burn yours.

Tanks should also bring something to the table that feels exciting and helps create space. People love WB because his mechanics feel so fluid and fun and when you learn how to play him, he can be a nightmare. Overall, he feels rewarding. (Same could be said for Hog)

Make tanks better at “closing the gap” and “creating space”

  • Give them more agency in a fight. Overwatch maps lack proper cover and are a straight shot to the “point”. Tanks should reliably control the field/fight with their skills rather than just be bullet sponges.
  • Redefine what each tank is supposed to do. For example: WB should have a smooth time knocking enemies out of their positions. Hog should have good single target DPS and CC. Orisa should be able to lock down lanes with her ranged pressure. Zarya’s damage should scatter teams. Rein’s barrier should give allies ample breathing room. etc etc – after that, make sure each approach has a weakness so that countering makes sense.

Push support Utility up way more and make them more about that rather than healing.

  • As it is now, it feels like Healing is a barrier and every support needs to have the same “amount” to feel relevant
  • Speed, armor, discord, revive/d.boost – these tools should change how your team approaches a fight. Supports should help your team either avoid damage or secure kills.
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I mean what else is armor for when its incredibly powerful against low instance damage heroes?

Armor is fine. Why would it need more adjustments?

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I feel it is oppressive to sustain and worthless against burst. So… a quick switcheroo might balance the game better.

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If the whole purpose is to make Tanks tanky, that wouldnt be a good idea. Reducing a Widow head shot by 50% will just cause a huge controversy having an “Armor Meta”.

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It does not need to be 50%. I just think the elephant in the room is that burst reigns supreme and armor invalidates sustain. Pretty obvious problems with an even more obvious solution.

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I wouldnt say its 100% due to tank’s armor.

It’s Brigitte + High healing.
Brigitte is too good at healing and providing armor/packs when she extremely sucks at surviving when her intended purpose is to be a support tank hybrid, Sure she is a Armor specialist, but remember when Sym was a shields specialist, it was tied only to her Ult.

So really Brig needs nerfs to her armor mitigation numbers (not how much she provides but how much Temporary Armor subtracts) and healing(a little), but buffs to survivability. Its all on a concept im working on for her.

Then theres the lack of a bridge in running two main healers and one main one off. Why run Zen or Lucio when Ana Moira will provide all the healing that makes their ultimates and utility not required. Sure maybe youll have a better chance with a defense ult, but burst damage so high nullifies it in 2 seconds

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I do not disagree, always felt like Brig needs buffs with the caveat that armor is nerfed. It Carrie’s her way too hard.

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So… everytime I see a DPS complain about 2-2-2, i always say something along the lines of “DPS can fix their queue times if they picked tank every so often.

The response I get back is ALWAYS the same: “why should I be forced to play something that’s not fun??”

So, it seems that the community has a consensus and actually agrees on what the problem is with tanks. The question is, how do we fix it? Because, the “fun” issue certainly hasn’t been addressed through the past 4 years of nerfs.

I mean. People would rather sit in queue for 20 minutes than get into the game instantly. Tank players who actuallg love to tank quit. I mean, it’s painfully obvious that the entire tank role needs help. But I guess the devs are too busy making OW2. It should be out by the time everyone has left.

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I am a tank main now, it did not fix my freaking dps queue times, bro!

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That’s becsuse more DPS players need to diverisify as well. It goes without saying that the issue would be solved through a community effort… not just a handful of individuals.

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In other words, there is no solution outside of the removal of role queue or changes in player behavior that only the devs influence? K.

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i’d like to play as a raid boss :grin:

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I’ve no issue with tanks being reliant on their kits rather than on passive Ironclad equivalents. In fact, I vastly prefer that, as it allows for their mitigation value to be narrowed into where it can get the most value and cycled out where it’d get the least.

I think certain tanks could use slight buffs. That’s about it. I don’t think there’s any broad, sweeping, fundamental issue with the role.