Sym 3.0 got a lot weaker the meta just shifted in her favor while this happened.
Sym has always been exceptionally strong against deathball comps. the problem with sym 2.0 was dive was the most common tactic. with the releases of brig dive went away and now we have a tank heavy meta.
brigs release happened at an odd time for sym. she was a very strong character that was countered by sym. yet at the time no one knew how to play either brig or sym. now brig is running rampant and having many nerfs which she wouldn’t have needed if there was an answer to her. sym got reworked later in the month. dive fell out of the meta. deathball has become very prevalent and now we have a sym that is meh against deathball.
Idk what you’re talking about. Sym has always been capable and still is capable of heavily punishing deathball comps if your team is also running a deathball.
I said she was meh at it not unusable. she works yes but dealing with deathball was her specialty before. she had a lot more ways to deal with deathball before than she does now.
sym should have been better than ever with all the tanks running around
I mean she kinda is, you just have to hope that your tanks are better and can create that certain amount of space Sym needs for her to create her own space for her tanks. She’s always needed that tbh, it’s nothing new imo.
This is my old account it’s dead now. I never found myself having to rely on tanks before. And most characters I enjoy don’t rely on tanks to survive.
Sym 2.0 had piece which was a way of outputting an insane amount of damage on tanks. Or anyone relying too hard on shields to protect them. Rien Zarya was the easiest comp for sym to deal with and it is played with so much more frequency now.
Basically you won with sym 2.0 once shield gen got up and in tank heavy lineups I was able to consistently charge at least 60% before they even made it to the choke.
I do believe sym 2.0 would have shined in this meta. I don’t want a revert that’s a bad idea. Guess I’m just frustrated
Then you’ve probably not played at a rank where it’s necessity. Sym needs space to create her own space. That’s always been the case. It was especially noticeable when playing 2.0 on attack.
Charge time + travel speed of the old orb didn’t do insane damage to tanks because it got healed up by Ana, Moira, or even Mercy before you even fired the next one. You also basically had no choice in charging Zarya, because the travel speed meant it was impossible to not bubble. Now there’s an 80 charge Zarya from one orb.
Then it got destroyed in 10s and you were back to being a mediocre melee range dps. Honestly, most of the games where it actually stayed up for a stretch of time ended in a loss right after shield gen went down.
And against literally anything other than that, ult charge was much more scarce for Sym.
I can agree with that, but it would be more because of Brig than Sym herself.
Symm’s range has nearly doubled since the rework. And honestly, I still find myself feeling like it’s too short. I couldn’t imagine playing a 7m range Symm against GOATs even if she had the lock on
The rank I was playing at was gm. Sym has multiple different playstyles. And it depended on what the enemy was running. If they had lots of tanks sym could be very aggressive and deal tons of damage. Which overwhelms the healers eventually. It takes forever for mercy to bring two tanks back to full and you can easily out dps their heals causing huge time losses for the enemy pushes
Dive was the hardest to stop but once shield gen was put up it was incredibley hard for dive to stop it. You would have to watch out for dragon blade though but sym had clever ways to deal with it like putting up two turrets where you expect the flank.
The photon barrier was insane blocking shatter without a rien on your team is a great feeling.
if sym is strong just because brig is strong well that’s a good thing sym is strong lol.
And if you couldn’t keep shield gen up that’s on you. Countless matches I was easily able to keep it up or at the very least win the teamfight because of shield gen. I had a 70% winrate in gm for a reason I was able to build my ult so fast I would have shield gen for every fight.
An 80 charge Zarya is a negative but 75 extra hp for your whole team was brokenly op
If you think the primary is better you are actually delusional. Nothing about it is good the time to kill is longer than the time to kill of her secoundary
Turrets got better I do think that I liked that change
The ult got worse shield gen was a brokenly overpowered ult that was bad for the game
The secondary lost pierce and gained speed and fire rate. It got better in a 1v1 but lost what made it unique
Same but I’d say she only really had three (unless you count how you had to play against Pharah) that were separated by the game mode. Defense and Attack were different and Koth felt different than both of those (IE terrible, I actually don’t mind KOTH with 3.0 anymore). And even then it was all mainly positioning and decision making as opposed to what you were actually doing in the moment.
While I can agree, I often found myself being the only one that didn’t get shattered. Even people right beside me got hit sometimes. But at the end of the day it isn’t actually Syms job to even block a shatter and it’s your shield tanks responsibility as to not get outplayed, so I’m fine with it being a little more difficult. Even though it was awesome, it felt a little mismatched to block so many ults so ridiculously easily.
I’m not saying that it was impossible, but if a Tracer wanted it, she was going to get it. The only time this wasn’t the case was after the pulsebomb nerf, but even with that, many of the best shield gen spots had been ruined by blizzard as a result of fixing Syms ults destroying themselves on walls.
Even so, having to babysit it because you can’t expect your team to was boring, especially if nobody actually goes for it. Your teammates would die to something and death spectate you and think you were AFK then start flaming.
Yeah I always new shield gen had to go just based on how powerful it was. Even when you said if tracer pulse bombed it at least that was an ult for an ult. And I charged syms ult as fast as tracer easily.
When you talked about playstyles. There were two that really stood out. And that was syms playstyle against dive and deathball. Both were very diverse and had completely different objectives.
You didn’t actually have to babysit shield gen what you had to do was moniter the enemies comp they switch to sombra or tracer you could easily babysit the shield gen because those people didn’t want to play those two hero’s at the start so they typically are very unskilled at those hero’s. Which makes it very easy to exploit them. If you look at the enemies team and none of them are very mobile you can play extremely aggressive and destroy anything the enemies want to through at you because there is no need to worry about them even getting to the shield gen.
But my point stands if sym at her 2.0 state was in this game she would be much more effective than sym 3.0 currently. And this is because sym 2.0 has much more in her kit that is able to effectively deal with deathball
I don’t know. I remember really tough enemies that could just wail on Symm were Winston and Mei, to the point that there was no point staying as Symm… Your turret set up could practically be destroyed by a Winston player sneezing and accidentally hitting the LMB because of 1hp.
I just feel like the current meta could bully Symm 2.0 way more, especially with the intro of Brig. Even with the incoming nerf to Brig’s shield bash… I think if a Brig just aimed to confront Symm 2.0, she’d win that fight because of swing, bash, whip, gaining health, and swinging to finish out the Symm. I don’t think the damage would ramp up in time (like the problem of a Winston doing the same thing).
Better in 1v1’s but her old orbs could go through shields so they were useful too.
I’d say that one is a tie.
The new ones just feel somewhat generic to me.
I agree.
Her old primary fire was better against flankers because of the lock on, it had more consistent damage and it didn’t suck against armor.
I’d say her old primary fire is better because of that.
I completely disagree, shield generator was a far more powerful ultimate but at the same time i’m kind of glad it’s gone, it was a pain to defend and find.
Of course these are just my own 2 cents on the matter.
All true, except for the comment about her primary fire. Sym’s primary fire got nerfed into nigh uselessness. It does have a small place against some tanks, but that’s it. Namely Orisa, Rein, and maybe D.Va, because D.Va can eat Sym’s orbs. Every other hero in the game counters Sym’s primary fire, by either being too hard to consistentally hit, kills her lightyears before she has a chance to actually kill them with it, or, the usual, both.
It was rough, but at least you were guaranteed damage. The whiplash in aim requirement it went through was not justified by the tiny range and damage increase.
Current orbs are great but the piercing was so, so useful against death balls. She was my go-to counter to Rein-Mercy-Bastion. Sure, Mercy could heal, but not six people at once. I wish we could use both orb iterations for more flexibility now.
The thing with Winston is he could only counter part of syms kit. He was great at dealing with turrets. But once shield gen was up Winston became a horrible pick against sym. It added a whole secound to Winston’s time to kill which ruined any dive he was trying to coordinate. And he couldn’t do anything to shield gen himself as he would have to reload before he could even finish off shield gens health. Giving you enough time to easily kill him yourself. Also sym actually beats Winston in a 1v1 once shield gen was up
Mei on the other hand wasn’t much of a problem. Part of the reason was because I only played in gm so I rarely saw mei at all. But even when I did see her I wouldn’t go into a range where she could punish me. I don’t think mei was a sym counter at all
I find it funny when people complain about goats comp not realizing that if symmetras weapon was better against armor she would quite litterally melt the tanks. Unfortunately with all levels of charge getting a 50% damage reduction on armor symm cant out dps all the healing going around and usually dies.