I was just thinking about how sym would have been different if instead of the photon barrier being taken away from the ability had they done the turrets instead.
I liked the photon barrier myself as it was a nice was for sym to defend herself and it added a ton of matchup interactions sym had to keep track of. This made combat really fun for 2.0.
If I were to have done it though I would have given 3 charges on the shield but have it work the same as before.
I think the shield would have had more interesting synergy with her tp and fit her new kit better than the turrets do. Plus without the turrets she would be easier to balance
I don’t know what are your thoughts on this? Switching her ult to turrets and her ability to barrier
3 Likes
i had a suggestion awhile back that they should make it a choice between throwing a turret or a barrier, like moiras orbs
they can start you off with 6 charges, then once used to 3, 3 becomes the max, and the recharge is a bit faster
3 Likes
I love complicated kits, they should make it a thing D=
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Yeah that’s why sym 2.0 was my favorite character. And even 3.0 before the infinite tp nerf.
The more moving parts the better. Especially if they have huge advantages and disadvantages. It just makes for really interesting gameplay
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Her ability was not taken away it was made into an ult though…
Yeah that’s the point it’s no longer an ability. I was mainly trying to think about the character if instead of photon Barrier being moved to ult it was her turrets instead
Yea now her protection comes from her positioning with her teleporter. Smart teleporting for good positions where she can poke and get into cover and use her shields to regen health without a healer. Which I think is better.
I also like to think of the cool possibilities it could add. Imagine sending the shield through the tp and having it go to the other end of the tp.
You could make a cool loop that works as a makeshift shield. It could be interesting as the counterplay to this would be shooting the tp instead of just busting through the shield.
I just feel like there was a lot of wasted potential by turning it into an ult
The problem is the turrets are kind of what makes symm-symm…
every hero got something that makes it unique and better to pick over others.
we already got Sigma who has a shield with similar idea… Not saying Symmetra can’t use it because of that but it’s not what gonna make her special.
Old Symmetra also got special primary & shields utility (hp) but they were both taken away…
Because she’s a dps it makes sense she will not have a supportive utility, which is also very strange they kept the tp for the same reason.
But then you need to think why taking her over dps and the answer that’s left is the beams and turrets.
These are the ones that will make the most change in battle.
Considering other heroes have beams as well it makes them a bit less special but the turrets- no other hero in the game got the concept of mini turrets with mini range.
Personally I found them to be a very very important part of her kit, much more than the shield but that’s about me at least…
A dps needs a unique way to do damage, a tank needs a unique way to make space and protect, and support heroes need a unique way to heal and a uniqe utility.
That could still be a think if they allow it to interact with stuff like Sigma’s barrier or orisa or any new heroes.
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If there is one thing this game doesnt need those are stuns and more flying shields
what if, as an ult, she could attach turrets to her teammates?
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Yeah I was thinking more along the lines of her Typical engagement. Tp to a unique angle and orb/damage the enemies.
The turrets don’t really add to that and breaks up the flow of her kit currently. It’s a defensive tool on a hero who’s signature ability is to claim space and cross large distances.
With the old shield as an ability however sym would be more self reliant and be able to better claim that space tp gives her. She could protect herself from stuns and cc abilities. Allowing her to be more self reliant
The shield provides more to an active sym player. And better fits as an aggressive glass cannon.
That said the turrets on her ult could be pretty interesting imagine sym saying setting up the car wash as she plops 6 turrets down. It doesn’t have to leave her identity it just gets moved.
That said if sym isn’t doing well without the turrets then you could just adjust the primary and secondary guns values. It would be a lot easier to balance this without the feast or famine the turrets add to her current.
I just feel like the shield would be a nice fit to her current kit and playstyle.
Infinite tp has greatly reduced this, tp really isn’t what it once was
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^
The issue of TP as survivability is that Sym is a close range hero more similar in nature to Mei that to Tracer, as she has to stay for a continuous amount of time up close. None of her damage sources are bursty enough to play as a bootleg Tracer.
Also, Sentries are also universally more useful that TP, as TP is potentially useless if not actively detrimental to use as Sym explodes into confetti up close as she is right now.
So what I mean is that Photon Shield should have been shared with TP. Remove team/construct TP, buff Sym everywhere to compensate, make Photon Shield the default ability while personal TP is the secondary use… literally what 2.0 did with TP: give it an alternative because its potentially useless.
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Here is what I could do:
Symmetra
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General
- Shield Health increased from 100 to 150.
- Character hitbox reduced to be closer to character model.
Photon Proyector
-
Primary Fire:
- Damage changed from 60/120/180 to 90/160
- Instead of extra damage, level 3 primary makes the beam disable mobility actives and passives for 1s.
- Ammo usage: changed from 7 per second to 3 per second, +7 per second against barriers removed.
- Reload Time: changed from 1.35 seconds to 1 second.
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Secondary Fire:
- Damage changed from 140 at max charge (70+70) direct hit to 80 at max charge direct hit.
Now the proyectile pierces enemies and barriers, but deals splash damage only on the first hit.
Sentry Turrets:
- Damage lowered from 40 per second to 20 per second.
- Proyectile speed increased to 45 meters per second, decreasing up to 15 meters per second as it travels away from Sym.
- Arming time decreased to 0 seconds, increasing up to 1.5 seconds as it travels away from Sym.
- Amount of Sentry Turrets increased to 6.
- Sentry Turrets now show a small portrait of the hero that its damaging or destroys it to Symmetra and her team.
Teleporter:
- Removed the ability to teleport teammates or constructs.
- Duration decreased to 4s
- Cooldown decreased to 8s.
- Now shares an ability spot to Photon Barrier, as its secondary choice.
Photon Barrier:
- Generates a large energy barrier in front of Symmetra that blocks enemy fire.
- Can be kept on front of Symmetra but its size and durability decrease up to 50% the longer it stats on Symmetra.
- Can be launched instantly, and launches automatically after 4 seconds if it hasnt been launched.
- Shares cooldown with Teleporter.
Ultimate Ability: Photon Barrier: removed.
New: Ultimate Ability: Photon Constructs: Symmetra can choose between 3 photonic constructs.
- Gateway: 2.0 TP, but lasts 45s. When it expires, refunds Symmetra with 5% of Symmetra’s ultimate charge per unused teleport charge.
- Shield Generator: 2.0 TP, but lasts 45s. When it expires, refunds Symmetra with 15% of Symmetra’s ultimate charge.
- Sentry Cluster: Launches forward an slow moving and indestructible cluster of 6 sentries, that stops upon contact with walls or after a set amount of distance traveled. Each sentry deals 20 dps, and up to 2 sentries can lock into 1 target. Lasts 10 seconds.
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Symmetra is able to store up to 25% of ultimate charge while Gateway or Shield Generator are deployed.
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Symmetra can undeploy Gateway or Shield Generator by using her ultimate hotkey for 4 seconds while near the construct, refunding similar amounts of ult charge to that of expiration refund.
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If Gateway or Shield Generator are deployed and a map moves into its next phase, the construct automatically undeploys and Symmetra is refunded all her ultimate charge instantly.
2 Likes
This would be a ton of fun a few things need to be toned down though mainly pierce that thing would be stacked. I would like pierce to return someday but it definitely needs To be a much more supportive tool rather than a straight dps one. Having a high mobility tool also doesn’t synergies with piercing attacks. It should just focus on out positioning.
And I think she would need to have to only have two of the abilities just for button mapping and toning down the power.
But yeah a ton of the ideas seem really fun. It would definitely make the character a ton more independent and active 
Commentaries:
Removing ammo return on shields and replacing it with something more universally useful means that Sym is no longer bound to whatever or not barriers are meta.
Removing team/construct TP allows most of her power to be on her hands instead of on her team’s goodwill and performance, while Sentries dont get kneecapped because construct TP removes their weaknesses.
Photon Barrier Ult needed to go, as it only added more barrier bloat to the game and risks making Sym a Mei 2.0.
Yes, the numbers are mostly just tentative/placeholder.
TP and Photon Barrier share a single button much like Moira’s orb, and her ults choice mechanic is the same that 2.0, so I dont see any button mapping issue?
Also mind you I am working with her post-nerf numbers, she needs the power to make up for the removal of broken team TP.
The thing is you can look at things from 2 perspectives…
You’res is the 1st one- flank symmetra that uses tp to get behind enemy lines and attack from there with tp and secondary.
But you can also look at it from defense Symmetra’s point of view,
You put turrets on the gate and spam enemies with secondary, when they’re close you use primary, and if they put too much pressure you use your tp to get back and put tp on the next gate.
The thing with Symmetra is that she gives 2 ways to play her and none of them are complete…
Secondary is really bad with defense Symmetra, her 200hp are not enough and tp isn’t the impactful and too easy to destroy…
Bit then on flank Symmetra her primary doesn’t do anything and her turrets are not that effective…
So in both ways the hero isn’t working well.
I talked about turrets because Symm 2.0 was all about the defenses- noting else you could have done with her.
But Symmetra 3.0 enables 2 paths and so the one you choose it the one that will define what is the main part about her.
Personally I like defense Symmetra more since I find tp to be a very supportive ability and less dps. But it doesn’t mean they can’t change it for the better.
This exactly
with 3.0 personally I used the flank route More often than not and because tp had a short cooldown I was able to be very mobile. But while flanking the turrets were not being utilized to their fullest potential.
I also don’t think the tp is being used to the fullest potential when played defensively.
That’s what I mean when I say they don’t mesh.
Photon barrier was just a versatile tool that could assist both playstyles. It added survivability and could help out main tanks.
I actually enjoyed sym 2.0 the most and I think that is still hands down her best defensive kit. I like characters with tons of utility and 2.0 had just that
But I really did like 3.0 but the changes they make keep hindering her aggressive style longer windows of waiting and not having a self preservation tool other than tp. I think having a defensive tool would be a much more useful tool to fit her kit together than the turrets currently do.
I just wish the devs would make sym more defensive or aggressive and not have elements of each that don’t work nicely together.