Sym 2.0 vs 3.0 Beam Damage - This is a Nerf!

Old beam had 1 second to one second, but I think a better alternative is to make the new beam 2 seconds up and down. A lot of the time you get all this beam charge and lose it trying to get to an enemy.

Also, the entire beam is as thick as level 3 is visually I believe.

increased range, increased ramp up time, not sure what else needs to be done. She has high damage potential as it is now.

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Oh ok thanks! and by 2 seconds up and down wut do u mean?

Yeah it’s a nerf. Everyone knows that it’s a nerf. It was obviously meant to be a nerf. You seem awfully surprised that it’s a nerf.

I’m perfectly happy with it. You want to make it better, I probably have no problem with that. But the current Sym 3.0 taken as a whole is outputting way more damage overall than Sym 2.0.


As in 2 seconds to reach the next stage of charge as well as 2 seconds to lose it.

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Sym’s primary fire is kind of niche, because of the charge up thing, and the short range, but that was always true…

Now running around with 180 dps is really satisfying.


Oh ok,that sound like a good idea!

Why? 60 more damage doesn’t mean much compared to her old beam. Sombra does 160 with bodyshots and I’ve definitely microwaved many Sombras without them out-DPSing me despite Sombra doing more damage.

So far the only time I’ve felt the 180 damage really comes in handy is vs Winston.


You obviously didn’t read the post because th op answers the question


Sombra has a gigantic spread, so obviously you can easily kill her with anything.


So sad, this post beautifully explains why the primary is bad, and doesn’t so with numbers that can’t be argued


With the reduction in her spread coupled with how close 2.0 had to be to her, the spread didn’t matter, and Sombra completely outranged Sym.

180 dps isn’t that much when you can’t headshot and don’t have range. Not to mention the 1 second it takes to lose charge means that once you hit level 3, by the time you actually reach someone, you’re back to level 2.


This was quite a long post haha

It is obvious that it feels weaker than her original one, I don’t think many people will deny that…

Many people, however, feel like her overall kit is better. I’ll happily take the weaker primary gun if I get to keep the amazing new secondary. I’ll help bury the old gun in the woods if you let me keep the throwable turrets. Heck, I’ll even drive the other witnesses off the cliff and make it look like an accident if you let me keep 3.0’s teleporter!

Yeah, her beam is weaker. If that is your only point then I agree :slight_smile: do I care? No way, the rest of her is gold! The beam should be rebound to right click or something and become a situational tool you whip out at certain times-- the amount of enemy Symmetras I kill that try to slap me in the face with their flimsy, throbbing beams, not realizing that it just takes two balls to put her in the ground.

Now, if I could pray for a buff to her beam - the biggest thing I want them to do is to allow her beam to penetrate multiple targets, the same way Mei’s weapon does. It would make it easier for her to ramp up damage and give her beam some actual threat as a charged Symmetra would be a very deadly close range, AOE Queen. (It shouldn’t penetrate barriers, of course)


I think the worse part is that if you use her Primary, you’re basically locked out of any of her other skills. As soon as you use anything else, your charge drops to zero.

The time it takes to deploy a teleporter, or drop 3 turrets, or use her Secondary fire, or use her ult, is all enough time for her to lose any charge she built up.


What kind of Winston doesn’t kill you 5 times before you even get to level 3 ?

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Mathematically less damage on left click is fine, because it means we don’t have the “Fischer Price presents My First FPS Character” that was old Symmetra.


If you put a decent TP you can use that and the fact that you have 2m more range than Winston now to kite him and charge on his bubble. What sucks is I have a bad habit of launching one orb at the bubble before anything, preventing me from getting level 3 and losing the 1v1 as a result.

You have to play it perfectly. Can’t take damage, have to avoid his jump and 8m range. Ideally, the TP and turrets distract him long enough to farm the bubble.

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In what world do you win?

Let’s assume a perfect scenario:

  • 10m starting range
  • Winston doesn’t use bubble ever
  • Winston doesn’t use leap ever
  • Winston doesn’t use melee ever

Forward movespeed: 5.5 m/s
Backward movespeed: 4.4 m/s (20% penalty)

Winston range: 8 m
Symmetra range: 10 m

Symmetra therefor gets a headstart of 1.82 seconds.

Symmetra’s damage comes in ticks of 6/12/18 dmg at a rate of 10 ticks / second.
After armor, this is reduced to 3/7/13 dmg at a rate of 10 ticks / second.

So by the time Winston starts hitting her, he already lost 3 x 10 x 1.82 = 54.54 armor. We will use this as the actual starting point. We no longer have to consider Sym’s headstart or movespeed, just her current charge level.

Winston starts the fight at 400 HP + 45.45 Armor.
Symmetra starts the fight at 200 HP and 0.18 sec left before level 2 beam.

Winston would then kill Symmetra in only 3.33 seconds so the question is: can Symmetra kill him in time?

0.18 seconds at beam level 1: 3 x 10 x 0.18 = 5.45 dmg
Winston = 400 HP + 40 Armor

0.57 seconds at beam level 2: 7 x 10 x 0.57 = 40 dmg
Winston = 400 HP

1.43 seconds at beam level 2: 12 x 10 x 1.43 = 171.60 dmg
Winston = 228.40 HP

1.27 seconds at beam level 3: 18 x 10 x 1.27 = 228.40 dmg
Winston dead

That took 3.45 seconds… in a perfect scenario where Winston literally doesn’t even try to use his abilities, he still beats Sym with 22 HP.

  • Add the fact Winston will usually start with 40-75 damage as he lands
  • Add the fact that if he uses bubble when he lands, he can actually shorten some of the 2 m gap undamaged increasing his advantage
  • Add the fact Winston quick melee effectively reduces Symmetra’s HP to 170-180 depending on how precisely he uses it as a finisher

In comparison, using Orbs instead of Beam leads to:

Orb 1: 115 dmg
Winston = 385 HP

Orb 2: 120 dmg
Winston = 265 HP

Orb 3: 120 dmg
Winston = 145 HP

Orb 4: 120 dmg
Winston = 25 HP

Quick melee: 30 dmg
Winston dead

This comes in at 3 seconds if you actually land an Orb as he lands 10 m away (still assuming a perfect scenario where he doesn’t land on you or block the Orb with Barrier - aka never). If Winston uses melee as a finisher, he only requires about 2.83-3.00 seconds to kill you once he makes it to 8 m range.

In almost every situation, Orbs come out on top simply because they deal a steady, reliable 120 dps with 60 splash. Beam is just nearly useless.

What if Winston decides to do a 180 and run away while you are in his heavenly 8-10 m dead zone?

  • He runs forwards at 5.5 m/s
  • You run backwards at 4.4m/s
  • Once he turns around, you are effectively distancing eachother by 9.9 m/s until you switch to running forwards
  • Best case scenario he turns around at exactly 8 m, leaving you with 202 ms to react and move forward, else he is out of range

How did Sym 2.0 fare?

Only beam

  • vs HP: 30-60-120 dps
  • vs AR: 15-30-86 dps
    • 120 / 7 = 17.14 dps / round
    • -5 dps / round from armor
    • 12.14 * 7 = 84.98 dps after armor
  • 3.28 sec to remove 100 AR: 30 + 60 + 1.28 x 86 = 200 HP or 100 AR
  • 3.33 sec to remove 400 HP: 120 x 3.33 = 400 HP
  • 6.61 sec total

Orb + Beam

  • Landing a full dmg Orb as Winston lands was super effective
  • vs HP: 125 dmg
  • vs AR: 120 dmg
  • Winston starts the fight at 380 HP
  • 4.42 sec to remove 380 HP: 30 + 60 + 2.42 x 120 = 380 HP
  • 4.42 sec total


  • 3.33 sec to remove 200 HP
  • 4.58 sec to remove 275 HP (SG)
  • 7.08 sec to remove 275 HP + 75 AR (SG + Torb)
    • 8.58 sec with reload
  • Can deal up to 45 dmg on landing
    • Removes 0.75 sec of Tesla gun from previous calculated times
  • Can deal 30 dmg on melee hits
    • Removes 0.50 sec of Tesla gun from previous calculated times

Sym 2.0 vs Winston

  • Much more dynamic fight
  • Without SG, the fight was clearly in favor of Winston where even landing an Orb doesn’t beat 3.33 sec (2.08 sec if Winston lands perfectly)
  • With SG, the fight was slightly in favor of Symmetra as long as she lands an Orb, but Winston could counter that by landing perfectly
  • With SG + Torb, Symmetra would almost surely win any duel
  • Overall, individual skills had much more impact, especially if Sym had SG up.

No because this is a nerf to an already bad hero


I’m just baffled by the fact that’s blizz didn’t even catch this

Seriously wtf