Disclaimer: I understand this tier list might make some people angry. If it does try taking a deep breath and make reasonable arguments as to why u disagree. Also, I’m basing it on the heroes in game, not the exaggerated forum versions
S: Lucio
A+: Juno, Bap
A: Ana, Zen, Kiriko
B: Illari, Lifeweaver
C: Brig, Mercy
D: Moira
With that, let the flaming begin, or not.
Juno down to B tbh. Zen B too
Bap is also way too high. When I still queued support I climbed to GM abusing Bap and Kiriko. If you’re good at S76, you’re good at Bap
I don’t really know enough about Juno to comment on her but I’d put Kiriko down one, especially with the damage distribution changes. Also put up brig up by one.
My complete guess (since I’m but a wee scrub who will never, ever bang his head on a skill ceiling) is that there’s no need for an A+ tier. Juno and Bap should be rubbing elbows with Ana and Kiriko at best, imo.
That’s still not his skill ceiling though. There’s hardly any players who can min max with his gun with high accuracy, landing directs
Point is there’s no need to minmax his kit when his value floor is so high to begin with. The massive aoe nature of his kit, through regen burst, lamp, and his heal grenades lower his skill ceiling immensely. Why? Because his cooldowns are all AOE and he can fully get value being an AOE guy (like Pharah)
He has big hitscan bullets, big heal grenades, easy cooldowns, he is overrated
The shoot twice heal once loop is Utter Woke Nonsense. Its wholly unnecessary and gives the illusion of minmaxing his output
Min maxing becomes significantly more important when you need to diff the red Baptiste
I aggree on most bits.
But i think ana should be higher than bap. Or at least the both should be at equal standing.
Because at least ana’s skill floor is higher than bap’s and personally i feel that ana’s kit allows for more play enabling than bap. But it requires more game knowledge than bap does.
Ana needs to be lower at this point, honestly. Nade and sleep are too easy to use, and give too much value to call her high skill
Nade and sleep being easier to use in 5v5 doesn’t change her skill ceiling much, only her value or skill floor
IMO I think people underestimate mercy skill ceiling. If you watch a clip of a T500 mercy vs the average plat player, its night and day.
Its just that alot of people see lock on beam and just assume she requires little skill. She is a hero with a low skill floor but a high skill ceiling.
Take Zen as a example, due to his simple kit, he is fairly “strait forward” Most of his skill expression comes from mechanical aim and target prioritization.
Due to his more simple kit, his skill ceiling just isnt as high.
However mercy kit allows for alot more complexity, especially her movement.
Now im not saying that Zen is easier and mercy is harder, they play far to different to accurately compare, just that mercy skill ceiling is often underestimated
It does though. Ana isn’t nearly as skilled as people say she is.
I dont know, personally id say lucio is at the bottom. Putting him at the highest skill is insane to me. Hes crazy easy.
She’s also not as easy as people say she is.
What? Is this one of those Lucio no aim aoe heal equals no skill posts. Have you seen how Lucio is played at the highest ranks
The same could be said for Zen as well. And aim is the hardest skill to master in the game. The insanely good zen players can play him into 2 dive heroes and get good value
how have u just replied back to back 3 times in your own thread did they change that
SHHHHH you’ll anger all them mercy haters for speaking facts
She’s literally impossible for flankers to 1v1 reliably.
However outside his aiming, a plat zen still plays very similar to a T500 zen. Zen is almost purely mechanical skill, and since his mechanics are very “simple” it limits how far he can go. (simple does not mean easy btw)
Where as mercy, mainly her movement is alot more complex, it allows for a wide variety of options and techs with it. Its complexity allows for a higher skill ceiling.
Also remember im not saying zen is easy or mercy is hard, im just saying people underestimate mercy skill ceiling. Because people put a heavy emphasis on aim, even though overwatch requires many more skills outside aiming.
Also this is just my personal opinion, but aiming is the easiest mechanic to train. There are aim labs and different programs that teach you to aim. Its relativity easy to train also because its easy to get feed back. You know if you kit or you miss so its easy to know if your aiming is good or bad based on how much you hit or miss. Aiming is a very quantifiable skill, so its easy to train
Where as other skills like ability tracking or position are much harder to train as they are more nebulous and harder to quantify. Due to that its alot harder to train. For example, where as aiming its obvious if you kit or miss, its not obvious if your positioning is bad. Its why to train those skills, quite often you need a personal coach, or someone to tell you what your doing wrong, because its not easily quantifiable. What qualifys as good positioning changes from situation to situation, where as aiming stays fairly constant in most situations
No, just no.
Lucio is the most mechanically demanding support, and it’s not even close.
Sure at low ranks you can just exist and aoe heal, but doing so is neglecting most of his kit. When played right Lucio is a straight up backline assassin flanker DPS in the same vein as genji and tracer.