Smurf topics are usually pointless

Complaints about smurfs are as old as time itself. They’re useless, though, unless written constructively. Nobody, not one person in the world (the game’s devs included) believes that smurfs are a good thing that positively impact the game. Framing a post in a way that makes it seem like you’re trying to convince people otherwise is pointless because you’re preaching to the choir.

“Smurfing is a problem and something needs to be done!” = pointless post

“Smurfing is a problem and here’s an idea for how it can be fixed that doesn’t disproportionately impact new players more than smurfs.” = good post

Blizzard knows smurfs are bad. The community knows smurfs are bad. What nobody knows is how to fix it in a way that doesn’t hurt legitimate players more than it deters smurfs. Blizzard isn’t just choosing to do nothing about it. There’s just nothing they CAN realistically do about it.

Got an idea to fix it? Let’s either have that discussion or let’s stop shouting things that everyone already agrees with. Also, know that raising the level requirement and/or requiring phone number verification for competitive are both bad ideas that hurt legitimate players more than smurfs.

4 Likes

Phone verification, there you go, no more infinite accounts.
Edit: The reason Blizzard gives a crap about smurfs is because is the only income. Who buys lootboxes when you can get them for free?

4 Likes

blizzard has always been vague with the subject so i guess its ok (smurfing and hacking). i mean there is no competitive integrity about it but it exists in every online competitive game since the beginning of online competitive games. i’ve seen it in countless games way back since xbox live so its a natural thing with online gaming.

whining about it is not gonna make it go away, its here to stay unless some EXTREME drastic measures are taken by some gaming company that i dont think will ever happen since it probably would involve privacy laws and all sorts of personal information of a player. i rather just play with smurfs and hackers then having to deal with some sort of authentication process, ID and IP sharing? and intrusive software (maybe?)

1 Like

There’s plenty that they can do, other games don’t have this problem on the level that they do; other games have real matchmakers and lobbies that provide players with a generally fair experience. Blizzard is simply choosing inaction because it’s the cheapest option, that’s it.

If y’all haven’t noticed, everything in Blizzard is penny pinched to the nines now. You’re not going to get a single cent spent on your game that isn’t absolutely necessary.

They can’t even pay someone to give a crap that it’s still Christmas season in Heroes of the Storm, you think they’re going to spend money figuring out how to solve the smurf problem in their game? Hah! They literally don’t give a crap anymore. They don’t care. They don’t WANT to fix it.

2 Likes

South Korea is the gaming country for excellence and they use their personal ID to play sooo…

yea i find that cool but their whole culture seems like a gaming culture. i wonder if even their government** gets involved with rules and laws for gaming?? i dont think that will EVER happen in america…

They do, to an extent. At least when it comes to esports.

usa’s government probably would laugh a bill or law like that right out of congress or whatever judicial branch it would have to go through. video games would most likely face censor laws (nudity, violence, and sex) then get laws involving hacking or cheating lol

I don’t think it’s fair to exclude people who don’t have their own phone number from competitive. Think teenagers, lower-income people, etc. Also, it’s not hard to get fake numbers for people who still want to smurf.

As far as the “blizzard makes money from smurfs” thing, that’s a myth. I made another topic about that once if you want the details (see below). Basically, real players make a lot more money for Blizz than smurfs do and it’s actually in Blizz’s best interest financially to figure out a way to stop them.

What games don’t have this problem and what did they do to help fix it? Genuinely asking because I don’t know of any. It seems to me that smurfing is just less noticeable in other games because most popular FPS games are wildly unbalanced and non-competitive anyway. Nobody’s going to think anything of somebody wrecking a low-ranked CoD lobby because that game’s always been a casual mess you just play with your friends for fun.

You can also get arrested for cheating there so I’m not sure we should be emulating them.

2 Likes

Spellbreak was a relatively young game, just launched, started having problems like this ~ and immediately took steps to ensure that their lower skilled lobby was a good experience for new players. They posted several posts about how they were implimenting systems to advanced high skilled players out of the lower lobby, and dividing the game to ensure that people who didn’t know how to play well would be playing against each other, and not putting a high ranked player in with them to slaughter them all. It was a very quick response, as in within 3 months of this problem being a noticeable problem, they were doing several things to combat it actively and talking about it. I’m not sure what systems they put into place because it was all inside the game, but they did manage to fix it. I went from fighting really high level players who super knew what they were doing, to having a really good experience on average and winning a lot of my own lobbies because I had a lot of experience in these kinds of games from Fortnight and Overwatch.

Speaking of, Fortnight is another good example; picked up that game a while ago and I never had the experience of ‘wow there’s a lot of ridiculously overskilled people here with me all the time, I never stand a chance’. There may be people better than me, but never better to the point where it seems absurd, as it often does in Overwatch.

Same with Paladins; lots of skilled players there, and I can tell there’s the occasional cheater or something a bit fishy, but it’s like… one out of 8-10 games, rather than literally every damn game like it is with Overwatch.

Lots of games are significantly better in this department. I feel like I get fair games with all my other FPS games; Apex, LoL, all of these games have lobbies that need to be managed by the company and they manage to do a decent job of it. Why is it weird to think Blizzard could too, if they just tried?

2 Likes

I don’t know anything about Spellbreak so I can’t speak to the steps they took but I believe OW does do a good job at moving skilled players out of low-ranks quickly when they’re playing too well.

From my own experience, I’ve leveled two alt accounts on PSN and I started my PC account after a couple of years playing in GM on console. On each of those accounts, I tried my hardest from the beginning, even while leveling up in QP, and was very, very quickly moved out of lower lobbies. On PC, I destroyed newbies with Tracer for exactly one match in QP and was put in a lobby with masters players on the next game. After placements in comp on every account, I was getting 50+ SR per win to move me up quickly through the ranks. It actually defeated the purpose of even having the alts because I was only able to play comp with my lower-ranked friends for a few days before I was ranked too high to queue with them again.

I think the problem in OW is not with people whose skills aren’t being recognized by the matchmaker, it’s people who are intentionally underperforming until they decide to start stomping people. We can help with that by actually taking the time to report throwers/de-rankers because I don’t think most people do. When I’ve asked people to in chat, I’ve heard a lot of “Why report? It doesn’t do anything anyway”, which is a self-fulfilling prophecy if nobody takes the time to report.

As far as my experience with other games, especially FPS games, I’ve never played one that didn’t feel wildly imbalanced as matchmaking goes.

It’s a matter of competitive design. In OW, SR is win or lose, all or nothing after placements. In Apex, for example, every new account starts competitive at the lowest rank and has to work their way up through the ranks. There’s pros and cons to that. The biggest con is that there’s no throwing needed. Any top-level player can start a new account and immediately start crushing lowbies in Bronze IV. A pro is that you can’t rank up without pulling your own weight because kills/damage/etc. are factored into your results and your own performance is the most important factor, not the outcome of the match. That makes for more consistent skill levels at mid-high ranks.

Blizzard works on the matchmaker all the time but it’s hard in this game because of how much skill isn’t quantifiable. It’s not like Apex where kills/damage are all that matters. I don’t think they can be so easily compared. I’ll say, though, that five placement matches isn’t enough to accurately place someone. On the other hand, I don’t want to have to play 10+ placements for every role every season. I’d be in favor of changes to placements for already active accounts, though, to accommodate that.

Tinman API can lock accounts to 1 computer where each computer can only have 1 account.

Are they?
What smurfs do to their profit making?
They sell accounts, but also make less people occupy servers by making them stop playing after few matches, so there is less heat keeping it up.
So… is it really bad from their perspective? Games are not made to be fun, they are source of income, you make salary, not happy faces.
Maybe like blizzard devs that work on game dont like it, but entity that is corporation would not see much problem with that i assume.

1 Like

Blizzard doesn’t make most of their money from software sales, especially when OW is only $20 most of the time. They make the vast majority of OW money from in-game purchases and OWL-related things. Only real players engage in those ways. Smurfs don’t buy loot boxes or yield another OWL viewer. More happy players = a game more people want to play = more legitimate players = more money. More people will want to play a game that they think is fair and not full of smurfs.

It is irrelevant, even if they got rid of smurfing, somehow, you could just derank on your main.

I am literally stuck hundreds upon hundreds of SR on dps below my standard… And I am not even trying to stay down there.

People will always find a way.

The in game purchases at this point can mostly be related to OWL i imagine, since people start to just grind out coins way faster over time.
I think that was one of the problems with 222 that hit them more than players, they gived people reason to not buy lootboxes if you can grind out everything during waiting time for event usually. Do you think this is enviroment to buy lootboxes when many people either give up on game because of wait time or lack of new stuff and most people who left playing are probably activaly trying to play still day after day?
And there is blizzcone stuff, you know the package for all games, that is not worth for only ow player, wonder how that is going this year when its not connected to event itself anymore giving you ticket for it.
In general, i would not be suprised if latest in game stuff were made mainly on realising OWL skins especialy in times people cant farm tokens.

I disagree that everyone thinks Smurfs are bad. Do you not understand how contradictory it is to say “I would be a higher rank if smurfs didn’t ruin my games.” If that were true, what makes you think you can handle six people in the next tier or two above you if you can’t handle one?

1 Like

I mean, smurfs are usually not “next tier” on a list of ranking up. Diamond player with account in plat is not really “smurfing” unless he is activialy throwing to get lower…

I meant that I think everyone agrees that smurfing isn’t a good thing to do. I don’t believe it’s nearly as big a problem as the forums thinks it is (and I play on console where alt accounts are free) but I do believe that it’s wrong to purposefully de-rank to stomp lowbies.

Putting that negative connotation on people making new accounts is the problem. I had GM friends that simply wanted to play with me and my other friends in Diamond when I was new to the game, so they made a new account. I can’t even play Competitive CTF with my friends on my main account because half of us are high Masters and GM and the other half are Diamond and Plat.

Smurfs aren’t JUST people who derank on purpose to flex a superiority complex on worse players. Some people want to challenge themselves to get a new account to GM on a character they don’t play, get an ALT on the top 500 leaderboard with their main, or do an educational stream to teach other players how to get to GM with their favorite character.