Regarding the upcoming 6v6 competitive

General Discussion
1

Why are you still testing the waters for 6v6? Why are we again putting a unique spin on things for no apparent reason.
The competitive integrity will be ruined by the decision to go open queue w/ 2 tanks max per team.

Just give us 2-2-2 and stop being scared about DPS/Support queue times.

The main reason no one actually played tank is because of the lack of content and having 2 tanks dominate the meta for 2 (2.5) whole years along with Baptiste’s lamp without Blizzard balancing the game… 2-2-2 was doing fine the first year, even though release Sigma was insane.

Double shield happened because lamp was broken (250 HP…you couldn’t even kill it with the center of DF ult since it goes vertically just above the inner circle’s range), Sigma and Orisa had perfect sync of defensive CDs they could rotate and Blizzard didn’t address these issues for years…

Come 5v5, lamp has 100 less HP… even recently you gave Hanzo’s ultimate to actually deal with this (which btw would’ve HELPED immensely in OW1 since it would punish double barrier playstyle - stacking around the corner with barriers and lamp outside of LoS… HANZO’S ULT SHOULD’VE BEEN DOING THIS IN THE FIRST PLACE).
Orisa is reworked without the barrier… (the irony that they brought back this ability now, but it won’t matter since it won’t dominate the meta anyway)
Amazing… imagine if this was fixed earlier.

Why no one wanted to play tank?

Are you having fun playing Sigma or Orisa? If yes, great. No? Well I’m sorry, you auto-lose if you don’t play these heroes or well… just don’t queue tank. A lot of people went with the 2nd option.

Now we have 13 tanks instead of 8.
If Ramattra was released instead of Echo, double barrier wouldn’t happen.
If DF was reworked as a tank even then, double barrier might’ve not happen.
If Bastion was reworked as well as he is now, double barrier would’ve been less annoying…

The main issue was INACTION that led to STAGNATION, and that is the worse thing you can do (Doomfist is right).

Now we won’t have competitive integrity again and we are testing some random non-sensical mode which can go bad very fast. Can’t wait to play 0-6-0 or 0-0-6 or 2-0-4 and have people troll again. Do you know what the main issue with MR is at the moment? Having the whole team pick DPS, the only reason it still “works” is because the game is new, and even they were on the verge of triple-support meta, that may or may not lead to Rivals’ variation of 3-0-3 GOATS.

EDIT : It also feels like it’s being sabotaged on purpose.

  1. Testing 6v6 just when MR was released, like the worst possible timing since it took a lot of players, especially the ones calling for 6v6.
  2. Giving us bad balance changes (looking at that Rein QoL removal especially)
  3. Not implementing competitive mode straight away.
  4. Moving the mode to arcade which, according to Aaron, player count dropped by 40% when they did this…
  5. Experimenting with different queue variations like min 1 / max 3 (which resulted in 3 dominating tanks ofc) and now open queue w/ max 2 tanks…

I had no problems with queue times with any role during the whole testing period, and I mostly played around 21:00 - 06:00, it didn’t increase that much even after 02:00. Most of the queue time was between 10 seconds and 2-3 minutes tops (even though there was a bug showing +20 minutes as a tank lol)

11 Likes
2

They’re also bringing hero bans which would’ve helped back then a lot.

Just imagine playing double shield without Bap, sounds like fun.

3

Wouldn’t exactly say “fun” but much less frustrating to say the least.

And yes, hero bans would’ve helped but the main gripe I have is with the :

8 tanks but 2 are only viable (most of the games) —> No one wants to play these tanks because they’re not fun or just sated with playing them every single game —> Blizzard refuses to address this issue —> No one queues for tank any more —> DPS and Support queues get DESTROYED with massive queue times —> Blizzard still refuses to address the balance issue and implements a “band-aid” ticket system —> Still no one plays tank and if they do, they’re now a DPS/Support player wanting the ticket to actually play their role, resulting in potentially poorer match quality —> Queue times still aren’t fixed —> No one new wants to buy/play the game and player count keeps dropping (it’s already 2022 and we’re already 2 years in without new content) —> OW2 changed the game to 5v5 because “no one wants to play tanks” instead of addressing the actual issue… —> “The main reason we went 5v5 is because of the long queue times”

And still people don’t like to play tank because it was designed for 6v6.
Maps feel more empty without the 2 extra players, supports turned into some pseudo-DPS since they can’t get protection from the extra tank anymore, this results in less healing the only tank in the game now… Counter-picking has mega value and etc…

Also they got rid of 2CP which was also a bad format with the active double shield / lamp meta.

3 Likes
4

Min 1 - Max 3 kind of grew on me, though it wasn’t as good as 2-2-2. I’m interested to see how Max 2 will feel. I still think we should just have 2-2-2 though. I’m really not convinced queue times would be as bad as people think they would be. It’s very strange to assume that the graveyard period of OW1 would be standard for any form of RQ 6v6.

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5

This right here. It needs to be pinned somewhere, especially at Blizz HQ.

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6

I think the decision of OQ isn’t exactly about dps q times in 6v6. We already tested 222 and the dps q times wasn’t bad at all surprisingly.

But it seems the devs already decided 5v5 as the only main mode, and thus 6v6 should NOT worsen the 5v5 q times, and 222 potentially has the risk to do so.

Also, they might remove 5v5 OQ, because, yeah, it’s a joke mode after all. So they perhaps want to replace it with a more reasonable OQ.

1 Like
7

No, tank has always been the least popular role in the game by miles all the way back to launch. It’s the nature of the role, which is why it’s also the least popular in every other game with traditional tank/damage/support roles. It’s not a straightforward role, and it’s never going to appeal to as many people as the other two, so it makes no sense to require the same number of players on all three roles.

It was non-tank queue times that were the problem. Almost everyone’s non-tank queue times skyrocketed. 10+ minute DPS queues tanked the game’s streamer potential, because nobody wants to watch their favorite streamer sit in queue. And I already have to wait around 10 minutes for a high-rank support game. It’d be much, much worse with two tanks.

4 Likes
8

If the tank roster was as big as the DPS roster it would’ve been a different story. No one wanted to play 2 same tanks every single game (for 2 years). In the beginning of 2-2-2 queue times were not a problem at all.
Even something trivial like changing the “tank” name to “general” like “healer” into “support” could’ve maybe even removed the generic “RPG Tank” mindset from players to try and play it more.

This will never change until they fix the ranked matchmaking restrictions. The higher the elo the more restrictions and limits there are and with groups especially. As a result, you get less games but they should be more balanced because it searches for players 3 divisions above and/or below you. Without restrictions you get into more games but as a result games should be more imbalanced since it looks for players within 5 divisions above and/or below, not to mention having 4 stacks in a team now as well.

3 Likes
9

I really wish they implement 6v6 2-2-2 and just be done with it.

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10

they know people leave on mass with 5vs5 so they had to bring back 6vs6, they were forced to do it but they didnt want to, they know 5vs5 is a huge failure, they dont need to make any test, just have to launch it and then balance if is bad, why they didnt tested perks, passives, 5vs5, flashpoint? only 6vs6 needs a thousand tests, yeah right. but if you think about it the only time they tested anything it failed so much had to be removed from the game, clash mode

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11

Is it really not 2-2-2? I thought it was going to be that. I’m a 5v5 enjoyer but that’s kinda lame… are they worried about queue times?

12

ofc they worried about q times … for 5v5. I think they treat 6v6 as a bonus mode, so they don’t care about the 6v6 q times like many other arcade modes imo.

Afair, I read an interview that they don’t want many tank players playing 6v6 and thus 5v5 q times are increased, and thus 222 can be risky.

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13

They’re still hesitant about 6v6 due to the previous experiments being, at best, inconclusive.

There’s a vocal minority begging for it. That’s it.

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14

The 10% was for the 1min3max version, right? No one asked for that. And the devs didnt even bother to do any balance changes for the mode.

Why play a scuffed OW2 6v6 that sucks when you can go play the wacky new game instead?

15

2-2-2 has its own issues. It was not popular enough to sustain OW1 which is why we have OW2 as it is today (more or less).

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16

Technically, they/we are scared of DPS and Support – the vast majority of the playerbase – wait times; Tank queues will be fine.

The queue times from day one of 222 became untenable for many players. Granted, they became much longer as the time passed, but if you draw a red line at 5 minutes, it doesn’t much matter if the wait time is 8-10 minutes right after Role Queue was implemented, or 15-20 minutes shortly before Overwatch 2 was “launched”.

17

Eh; I don’t want 2-2-2. I want OQ, (2-2-2 is fine, I guess) but I also want it to be at least somewhat reasonably balanced. OW2 powercreep is still going to mostly be present if not slightly dialled back (evidence being the last 6v6 test that was OQ) which includes role wide blanket passives as well as perks currently being a mess.

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18

6v6 is only for the vocal minority. There is no place for 6v6 except in arcade where it belongs-a niche game mode.

I have no intention of returning to that **** show of a game mode, it was unbearable.

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19

From their numbers they provided, 5v5 qp was still played 2.5-3x more then 6v6 qp during its events. I get the feeling they are more worried about 6v6 queue times if it was role queue, just like they had big issues in ow1 with it. Also while not having stats, I’d bet that people are much less likely to queue all roles in comp, than queue all roles in qp. So even tho 6v6 qp test didn’t have terribly long queues, I think comp would be another story. Plus having to match people closer in rank increasing queues compared to qp.

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20

I’m glad 6v6 is getting a comp mode. Once it comes out, I have no intention of returning to the **** show that is 5v5.

3 Likes