Real talk: Delete Widow = better game?

General Discussion
1

Not even joking. If they delete Widow tomorrow, wouldnt the game just be objectively better and more fun? IMO the hero concept of Widow doesnt even belong in a game like Overwatch to begin with. Think about how much other heros have to work to one-shot someone. Meanwhile she can repeatedly and reliably delete any squishy without using ult or even just a cooldown. I aint saying she dont take no skill. But once youre half-way decent with her it just becomes a stupidly oppressive experience to have her on the enemy team. And the only time I wish for my team to pick her is when the enemies have one. So if they just deleted her, who’d mind.

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2

she is like the most OG hero ?!?! lmao

They literally gave Widow the most legendary skin in game when OW 1 was released and they bought the prerelease pack.

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She was in the launch trailer!

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4

Y’know wot? I’d ball. Get rid of her.
No, this won’t create any precedencies, -1 French is +1 for the world!

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5

Objectivley probably not as it would set a really bad precedent.

However it would improve my subjective experience of playing the game

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6

Yes and the same with Sombra. They are anti-OW heroes and should not exist. The game is always the best when those two are not viable or played much.

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7

I’d rather just make her into a hero that doesn’t need to revolve around instsakilling most of the roster, while preserving as much of her kit/identity as we can.

Like, there has to be something other than “delete” and “keep one-shot because needed”.

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Nah, they just need their emotionally frustrating parts actually compensated for with downsides.

9

Delete role queue.

There, fixed the Widow problem.

Can’t one shot a team full of tanks

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10

that was such a Kungpao answer haha

11

Delete sombra first.

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12

Nope if we didnt have 1 shot potential players could hold angles to easily and never be properly anytime you have a problem with a widow its because your team isnt pinging her and adjusting their strategy to take care of her. Why delete her?

13

Oh yeah, plenty of ways to deal with that.

It’s just a matter of getting the devs to ignore winrate on Widow.

https://i.imgur.com/4ksBvjS.png

Because winrate, isn’t winrate.
It’s Time-Weighted-Winrate, and it mostly measures Time.

Which means Widow has been at about 48% winrate for the last 8 years.

:small_orange_diamond: OPTION A:

WIDOWMAKER

Grappling Hook

  • While using Grapple, if Widowmaker takes 1 point of damage, the Grapple breaks, and loses all momentum
  • Grapple no longer gains instant momentum horizontally.
  • Cooldown Reduced from 12 to 7 seconds

:small_orange_diamond: OPTION B:

WIDOWMAKER

Passive: Widow’s Curse

  • All healing reduced by 50%.
    • This includes healing from teammates, regeneration passive, and health packs

Grappling Hook

  • Cooldown reduced from 12 to 10 seconds.

:small_orange_diamond: OPTION C:

SOMBRA

Hack

  • A unique hero interaction where Hack puts Widowmaker’s Grappling Hook on a 12 second cooldown.

:small_orange_diamond: OPTION D:

WIDOWMAKER

Healthpool

  • Health reduced from 225hp to 150hp

Well, here’s my interpretation of Cadwell/Walker’s work defining formal Counterplay. (I.e. Riot and Valve)

“After you make your Choice, your Opponent should have the capability, to respond with their Choice, which includes the awareness that a Choice exists, and enough time to understand and react with their Choice”.

But you can take your pick:

Like are we violating Tom Cadwell’s principle that counterplay should not just have the capability to counter, but the time and obviousness that a counter should be used.

  • https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:JAlbor/GDC_2013:_Teamplay_and_Counterplay_in_League_of_Legends
  • https://www.gdcvault.com/play/1018273/Counterplay-and-Teamplay-in-Multiplayer

Or are we violating the Sid Meier and Soren Johnson, style “Optimizing Fun out of Games” design issue? Where “Technically possible to defeat” was absolutely not sufficient by itself.

Or Robin Walker’s “We literally designed the character Widow is based on, and we empirically measured that onesided counterplay lost significant amounts of players”

And, my post, where I detail how every other modern PVP FPS game in existence follows the above rules.
But not Overwatch.

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14

bro, you need to relax with your copy paste.

you have a solution for every general chat post. like did you do a PHD in general chat overwatch ?

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15

I mean, I kinda do need to keep posting this stuff.

It’s fundamental game design topics, and hardly anybody understands it.

Including some professional gameplay designers…

But I agree, it’s dumb that I gotta tell people that there’s an emotional component to player vs player interactions.

16

see, this is why I cannot take you seriously.

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I mean, if I had 100% faith that the devs would get everything correct without my input.

Then I wouldn’t be posting here.

And I got 77k posts.

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I got at least 2 specific people in mind.

19

you have been here since 2018.

You would need to make about 32 posts per day from February 2018 to now (October 2024) to reach 77,000 posts.

What is your point here?

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20

Yes. Except for Widow mains I guess.