It combines a very long stun (1 second knockdown and 0.5 getting up) with a status effect of causing your character to sleep for 5 seconds. Essentially removing them from the fight for the period if no one deals damage to them.
Quite frankly with 1 tank, an ability like this can’t exist in its current state. A large part of OW2 is removing stuns from all non-tank heroes. This is both neccessary for the health of the game and to allow tanks to actually function solo.
My suggestion: Petrifying Dart Upon landing, the target becomes petrified for 5 seconds. During this time they become immune to all damage and status effects. However, they take 150 damage from melee attack which also breaks the petrification. Allies can also melee the petrified target which will also break the petrification.
There are zero stun frames. Your character immediately regains control after the petrification ends and immediately becomes immune to damage upon getting petrified
This achieves a similar function to current sleep dart. Ana can use it defensively to get away from flankers and punish them if a opportunity presents itself. However there are now no windows of vulnerability, you can’t get free damage in. It also makes it less effective against tanks. More often than not it should be possible for a teammate to save the tank from petrification as most tanks play near the team.
Overall I think this would be more effective at killing flankers than current dart for Ana solo. 150 damage is obviously huge but I think it is fair punishment if Ana is able to melee your face. On the otherhand, sleeping far away targets or just shooting dart into a group is a lot less effective because they will be able to break the petrification easily.
Ana should still feel like she made a clutch play landing it, especially if she gets to delete the flanker that tried to kill her but also make it less frustrating in a fight. You can be saved more easily and are immune to damage so you are not a free kill. Especially relevant for the tank players. Your team can’t simply coordinate all your damage on a slept tank and delete them nearly instantly.
I do think it is weaker than current sleep though, so Ana would probably need other changes as well.
It’s definitely an interesting Idea, but could be used to troll your team. Like if you petrify an enemy at 1 hp at point in overtime and causes your team to loose.
I suppose the same argument could be used for mei wall, and ofc that would be much worse.
But imo, sleep is an iconic ability and should be modified slightly rather than replaced with a whole new kind of ability.
Any enemy can still break the effect and deal 150 damage by meleeing them. Yes there will be situations where the target does end up surviving damage which they shouldn’t but it is a trade-off.
The purpose of making the target immune to damage is to stop easy team coordination for blowing up a slept tank.
One tank means that if you sleep/petrify them, the vast majority of a teams defensive capability is gone. There is nothing stopping the enemy team from using there CD’s to near instantly kill a tank and it wouldn’t take much coordination. You see it happen in OWL.
This sounds awful, the 5 seconds is guaranteed unless you melee instantly kill them. Its like the worst of both worlds, the CC is stronger and lasts just as long, and the instant kill portion of it is guaranteed and you get 5 seconds to execute it.
Honestly its pretty impressive that you thought of a way to make sleep even more infuriating to play against.
How is it counterintuitive. I think it is extremely intuitive that a petrified target wouldn’t take damage. It is a very common trope.
You agree that in OW2 that losing the one tank you have would also mean losing the vast majority of your defensive capability but fail to understand why this would be a problem when your only tank is slept?
Yes, teamwork is extremely important but hitting a sleep dart on a tank isn’t hard and then coordinating an attack on that tank is also not hard seeming you are aiming at a stationary target.
I feel like you should read it again. CC is worse. Any ally around you can save you from the petrification and you are also immune to any follow up damage besides melee.
If any ally is near you whatsoever, the dart becomes much less valuable. However, it heavily punishes flankers that are hit by it. Rewarding Ana with a conistent kill on the.
How is that worse than sleep. Sleep, you get shot at and normally when the enemy starts shooting at a slept target they are confident that they can kill them.
Unless if you are at gold or below I guess but I feel like 6 years into the game most players have learnt not to shoot a sleeping target pointlessly.
I’m used to that trope being that they turn brittle and take additional damage from explosives and blunt force trauma. Not unlike freezing, but instead of shattering they crumble into dust.
As I see it, the problem is that the missing tank’s power has been reallocated almost entirely to the existing tank and not spread across the team as would be logical. This is entirely independent from sleep, and sleep is far from the only thing that causes problems under this paradigm. I’d trace nearly all balance/gameplay complaints back to this one decision.
There’s no need for it to be hard. It should be a threat that has to be respected, which requires reasonable consistency to be plausible. The fact that one of the best character designs in the entire game is being problematic speaks volumes about the problems underlying the entirety of OW2.
I really need to finish cleaning up that essay I wrote on this.
I feel like you are being pedantic. A hero turned to stone not taking damage is pretty intuitive.
We have to work with what we got. What you are talking about is a pretty extreme balance overhaul, which would be pretty appropriate for a game called overwatch 2 but that is not what we are getting. Your suggestion would require a rework of nearly every hero in the game.
Once again we need to work with the reality of what we got. 1-tank 2-dps 2- supports, with the DPS and supports functioning 99% the same as live. It is too late to expect anything drastically different so any hero/ability that effects the intregrity of the game built around this has to go. Sleep is one of them. You can’t have the current sleep effect against 1-tank unless you make tanks immune to it or something. Nade already is probably on the devs hit-list as well.
I am not. Can’t think of an instance where this made stuff more durable. Having stone skin while retaining full mobility sure, but for fully solid petrification I’ve only seen being an indefinite prison or crumbling to dust.
I believe the devs hands will be forced. Things aren’t working.
That said, it shouldn’t be that bad. Toning down mobility inequality a little and restoring pseudoofftanking capability to a few select DPS like Mei and Cass will go a long way toward splitting spatial control duties across the team. Brig, perhaps the only strong and nonproblematic slow squishy in the entirety of OW2, is proof of this working.
If we’re actually being realistic, I expect them to ship something similar to what we have now with minimal alterations to sleep. Replacing sleep is about as realistic as overhauling a good chunk of the game.
Interesting suggestion but not likely. It’s too complicated an effect and not obvious with the melee mechanic. I don’t think we should add more mechanics that require players to Google it to figure it out.
Honestly I think anas bio nade is more problematic than sleep myself but also I think doomfists’ power block should have some kind of effect negation so . Having sleep be a freebie against doom is kinda dum now that he can’t one shot and doom is the only dive tank with no way to prevent sleep.
Dude you ever play final fantasy, DnD, WoW. All have petrifcation where you become immune to physical attacks. You are being pedantic.
Here’s an example for you: https://classic.wowhead.com/item=13506/flask-of-petrification
Perhaps but not yet, OW2 would have to released first and then they will slowly learn what is working and what isn’t. Betas are not enough and they certainly won’t do massive overhauls with there current data and mindset.
Watching todays interview, I am not too sure. There is definitely a large chance you are correct however current sleep is a slap in the face to the direction OW2 is heading. All other non-tank stuns have been removed or reworked. I don’t see why Ana should be considered special. If it is kept, it opens the possibility for more CC in the rest of the support category which we are meant to be going away from.
. Having sleep be a freebie against doom is kinda dum now that he can’t one shot and doom is the only dive tank with no way to prevent sleep.