People don't understand the problems with 5v5

General Discussion
1

“you havent even tried it”
“you can’t base your opinions off of assumptions”
yeah, if your goal is just to shut up people having legit concerns then you can move over.

Why do people hate it? From a tank perspective 122 is the worst think that could happen for tank players.
No, being a raid boss isn’t automatically fun.

But the problem is that one eay or another ALL tanks will be reworked and off tanks especially WILL lose their identity. That’s not something that’s up to speculation, off tanking requires an mt to be such.
Zarya, even with her 132 changes plain doesnt work as a solo tank. Zarya is one of the best designed heroes in the game and one of the more rewarding to play well (i can already hear zarya haters getting their pants twisted). She will be deeply reworked for 122 or be doomed to be a throw pick.

No, numbers changes don’t change the core role of a hero. Rein will still be a main tank at its core with an 800 shield hps and two firestrikes. Bad main tank =/= off tank.

So, at least half of the tank playerbase will see their hero reworked. For what reason? So that dps stop complaining about barriers? so they can enjoy shorter queue times? Do people even realize double barrier is squarely on sigma? Double barrier never existed before him, rein orisa were an awful duo since they are both mts.

And it’s not just that, but 122 will bring less creativity to future tanks. Why? cause now every tank will have to be a generalist. We sure as heck not gonna have any hero like dva coming.

Then there’s the fact that the one tank will most likely put so much pressure on tank players, cause now the entire match revolves around them. Not only that, now all tank players will be expected to play EVERY tank, lest their sr drop when one of their mains isnt the meta tank. Going from mt to ot isn’t as easy as people claim it is, it"s almost a completely different role.
And even then, you are asking people to play at least 8 different heroes at a similar sr, cause the alternative is simply not play when your pool isnt meta. Right now i can play at diamond rein, orisa, ball and winston, all the main tanks (yes, hammond is main, sigma is off, barriers arent what makes a main tank main). That give me a big enough pool to adapt to any meta. Say we have a hog meta in 122. I’ll be screwed cause i plain don’t like playing hog.

And then i know most of you will say “who cares” but with this move they completely radiated an entire pro player job. Being an ot expert is going to be completely invalidated.

These things will be true regardless of what 122 will look like, so quit it with this “wait and try it officially”

EDIT: read this op at least three times before posting and try to understand the point instead of wasting time examining the finger

71 Likes
2

Wait, what? Explain this to me…

2 Likes
3

besides the fact blizzard balance philosophy ensuring dumpstering sooner or later, there’s the part where too much pressure will be applied to the tank player to play the “correct” meta tank and also perform ultra well since in the case of raid bosses the matches will revolve squarely around them.

basically it will boil down to eho has the best raid boss and who can kill the other first.
Imagine having your entire match decided by the tank player picking sigma over rein in a hypotetical rein meta

7 Likes
4

It seems that Tanks actual tanking stats will be similar to how it is now. Like we wont be seeing a Rein with a 2000HP shield and 500HP 500Armor.

nonono

They are nerfing how tanky some of the tanks are in exchange for CC resistance and a differently balanced game.

They won’t feel hard to kill, They’ll feel similar to how they feel now, about the same with a little more DPS thrown in there.

I do hear Hog is getting 2 breathers though and thats gotta be bonkers till he gets anti’d .

22 Likes
5

But how does that make it any less fun? The experience, I guess… But the hero is independent to that.

1 Like
6

i hope you realize that this is an objective based TEAM game, you can’t ignore the TEAM part when discussing how the role will play

2 Likes
7

But why not? You did. You are pretending the tanks are going to 1v1 for the win. There are 4 other members making plays, though.

1 Like
8

In your opinion, i am looking forward to tanking for the first time since brig.

5 Likes
9

That’s crazy. You play Dps mostly now?

10

i guess my reasoning completely flew over your head. Re-read my entire post, i didnt mention 1v1 a single time

i am now curious what tanks do you actually play and why do you like playing those

11

This is what I was alluding to, maybe you need to take your own advice and read what you post ahead of time. Lul.

1 Like
12

oh jesus

…that’s not 1v1, i mean that if tanks are as powerful as raid boss that’s how the game flow will roll, not that tanks will be alone, byt that all plays will revolve around enabling them and helping taking down the other.

Fun is in the experience and solo tanking is miserable, the game isnt designed around it

13

Of course, but again, the team is relevant in those scenarios. Yes? Therefore the burden ISN’T exclusively on the tank, not even by a long shot.

Let’s just say the meta is Hog. Because he is the tank I understand best. If we mirror pig on pig, and we have equal skill, it comes down to the rest of the team to play the meta. No? If they have an Ana to amp their vape and anti me, I lose every time. Even if I am a better Hog I will lose.

So say I decide Ana is annoying me and I go Winston to dive her. Hog counters Winston, but if my team gets rid of the Hog, let’s say by running Reaper just because lots of people think he is a counter… We win, no? And it really wasn’t based on my impact. Yes?

I am just saying that you being alone doesn’t make you the most important member of the team automatically.

In theory, sure. In mirrors, sure. But the game is super complex.

4 Likes
14

sry for the wait, since you are one of those kinda people, i figured i would get screenshots

Disclaimer - i know outside keeping myself alive I block ults with shields, it’s just 99% of the time it’s to keep me alive)

https://imgur.com/a/oxQMJMq

Pictures of my time spent btw.

Zarya - i like to save lives and get rewarded more than a saved life, with smart bubbles.

(1 of 3.5 tank abilities that can peel properly for back line)

Rien - big hammer goes swing swing and big shield lets me keep myself alive so can can swing swing more. okay for real though, i like making situations where i can create mind games and force an enemies attention on me, while using my shield (i consider the cart and walls my shield also) to pad my real hp, take dmg till armor gone, put shield up, get healed, repeat. I also like the first sentence.

Pre planning an ult block is cool too.

Hog - he is the best tank for holding off routes to help keep flankers options limited, while also being able to provide front line support with right click, that and hook can help back line depending on my teams position.

(0.5 of 3.5 abilities that can properly peel for back line since some off angles are optimal and flankers will wait for hook more than other abilities.)

Orisa - I liked orisa because i can leave over peek cover for my allies (not to be confused with Riens shield that is for him to protect himself and let allies go between cover), i also love denying CC with fortify, CC is my person most hated form of ability.

I derive sick pleasure from letting my team have that extra 3 steps out from cover and blocking CC.

Monkey - I love the brain workout, i have to go in, do some dmg to the target and get out to be effective. Positioning and timing are super important, just as important as good bubble usage (like my example from rien, but slightly different).

(2 of 3.5 good peel abilities, when available, his shield is to keep himself alive)

Would play more but monkey requires a level of teamwork and expectations.

D’va - I really like the mobility and pew pews, her ability to reposition quickly on a low CD + DM makes her by far the best back line support. i love bathing my healers in my special love field and actually being able to protect them properly, while also being able to pursue or rejoin the front quickly.

(3 of 3.5 peel abilities and by far the best)

I honestly though i had more time on Dva than rien. oops I guess dropped the ball on that one

Ball - meh the least tank like tank, i can see why others like him though.

I could type entire posts on why i like tanking but that the gist, you know actual tanking reasons.

Okay your turn.

No trendy nonsense, my fav youtuber said “I lIkE mAkInG sPace”, but don’t know what tanking actually is bull-heck either.

3 Likes
15

After I picked up Rein, I learned very quickly why so many seem to have Hog as a secondary. Ah lawd have mercy! No idea how main tank only players cope.

2 Likes
16

hahaha, it’s mostly just incase we end up getting another main tank and fight like Canadians over who gets to off-tank for once and even in comp get to just trust the other.

Rien hog is secret op if you can trust the other to not need babysitting.

“no no, you can offtank, i know what it’s like to be stuck meat shielding all match.”

“no no no, i insist you have the chance.”

both of us in spawn on 2cp defense with 5 secs till start

Trust, i trust myself to be able to protect myself, just like i trust that ana can protect herself or get help from the other healer/mcreee so i can keep the front line from collapsing the second i turn around.

I trust if that hog misses hook on tracer he will turn back to helping me since we both know trying to run down tracer with scrap gun is pointless 99% of the time.

I trust if all else fails we can talk and find solution’s instead of whining like spoiled 5 years.

It’s all trust and focusing on yourself and positioning.

3 Likes
17

I just liked to defend more than kill myself in overwatch.
Also i am objective kind of player no matter what i play, shield tanks like rein just fill right to stay on point and defend it or capture it to me.
That might be partialy because over years of playing tf2 as spy main, i captured way to many objectives and pushed card’s way to long than i should have and my brain was reworked around that type of gameplay. (Honestly, people in tf2 could just kill each other for hour if you let them with no timer, and not get objective even close to the end, they only go bananas over it when they hear other team is finishing)

2 Likes
18

squints angrily as a 600hr engie main

1 Like
19

Would you squint little less angry if i would say that engie was my top 3 picked class? XD
(tho i mostly played mini sentry style so not sure if thats acceptable)

1 Like
20

QUIT BREAKING MY STUFF! THIS ONLY MEANS YOU KNOW HOW MUCH WORK I HAD TO PUT IN TO MAKING THEM!

(but I am less anger knowing pyro is my second most played and i probably spent 400hrs just sitting with my engie frens)

Perfectly acceptable as long as you got tele up and a snack machine

1 Like