[OW2] A possible Future for Supports

General Discussion
41

And like I said, the idea that Supports should be designed like they come from an RPG game.
But DPS/Tanks are currently designed like they come from an FPS game.
Is inconsistent and wrong.

And will never lead to a scenario where there’s anywhere near 1x Supports players for every 1x DPS players.

And anybody whose ideas basically bottomline to “They should intentionally and deliberately not fix queue times”. You’re gonna need a pretty extreme and specific justification for that. Since the devs are going to lose many hundreds of thousands of current/potential players over that.

42

This is bad how? You don’t like it however you seem to already know a lot of support players like this and you still ignore it.

If this is about que times then yes, supports having less characters in the role disincentivizes players from wanting to choose the role.

1 Like
43

Well it’s a pretty binary choice, the way I look at.

  • A. Fix Queue Times = Lose minority of players who insist that a Class Based Shooter should be designed like an RPG/MOBA, a large fraction of which will quit entirely to move to PVE anyways.
  • B. Don’t Fix Queue Times = Keep that minority group, but lose anywhere between 200,000 to 2,000,000 current/potential players over bad queue times.
44

If that’s what this boils down to then your solution is just a gamble. I believe it’s a bad one.

1 Like
45

The new E might address Mercy’s near crippling inability to increase her healing in a midfight.

None of that addresses Valkyrie actively makes her less interesting to play than base.

Depends on the tank player. To be honest, I thought people wouldn’t be happy with OW2 tank direction. I’m not. But I forgot that Divers and Juggernauts are more popular than Vanguards and Wardens.

However the reason damagy tanks work is because there’s not a whole lot of difference between being a tanky boy who slaps enemies with CC and a tanky boy who slaps enemies with damage.

Damage focused supports however don’t quite work that way. Supportive abilities are frequently aimed at allies while damaging ones are not. The shift between mostly targeting allies and mostly targeting enemies is massive. Not everyone is willing to make that shift.

3 Likes
46

Heh, well if you can’t acknowledge that deliberately not fixing queue times involves risk, then how worthwhile is your judgement calls?

47

If you’re hedging your bets then yes, it’s a good idea to take the risk.
This just looks like a shot in the dark.

48

So you’re saying there’s more Support players in the game than DPS/Tank players?

As if that’s not a measurably false statement?

49

You’re trying to balance what people prefer to play.
I do not believe making the support role into pseudo DPS in order to balance player choice is good for the game as a whole. Maybe good for que times. But what good is that when nobody wants to play the game for what it is anyway?

4 Likes
50

I’m aiming for the biggest potential playerbase size.
Which involves the current players they have, and the new players they can get.

And you seem to be saying they should design the game around a ratio of players that don’t exist.

51

If you’re making a new game the entire game is for players that don’t exist.

2 Likes
52

Would you agree that there’s more DPS/Tank players than Support players?
Would you agree that the vast majority of new players OW2 is likely to get almost exclusively come from FPS games?

53

no
20 characterzzzzz.

2 Likes
54

Are you wanting to make a game with a spreadsheet?
Do you do anything creative?

55

Lol, you’re asking me if I make enough design ideas?

How about you answer these direction questions, and stop avoiding reality?

  • Would you agree that there’s more DPS/Tank players than Support players?
  • Would you agree that the vast majority of new players OW2 is likely to get almost exclusively come from FPS games?
1 Like
56

I’m not dodging questions. I just don’t feel like going in circles so i’m leaving it at that.

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57

Lol, “I’m not dodging questions, I’m just going to dodge your question”.

2 Likes
58

The problem with support and tank isn’t necessarily that they are unfun, it’s that most DPS players have limited mindsets when it comes to other playstyles. Being a team player is an alien concept to them.

3 Likes
59

I kinda view that as “Teamwork doesn’t exist in FPS games, because only teamwork that involves MOBA/RPG mechanics is valid”.

60

Mercy - unchanged (I assume?)

Moira:

  • primary fire = 49 HPS from 70 (not even 50 and Mercy was deemed a trollpick with 50 hps and Moira’s healing is limited lmao)
  • self-heal = 16.8 HPS from 24
  • orb = 45.5 HPS from 65
  • coal = 98 HPS from 140

Bap:

  • primary fire = 49 HP direct hit from 70 (35 HP explosion from 50)
  • regenerative burst (allies) = 10.5 HPS from 15 (52.5 total from 75)
  • regenerative burst (self) = 21 HPS from 30 (105 total from 150)

Ana:

  • primary fire = 49 HP per shot from 70
  • nade = 70 HP from 100
  • nanoboost = 175 HP from 250

Brig:

  • inspire = 10.5 HPS from 15
  • repair pack = 77 HP over 2 seconds from 110

Zen:

  • orb = 21 HPS from 30
  • trans = 210 HPS from 300

Lucio:

  • aura (ally) = 11.2 HPS from 16
  • aura (self) = 8.4 HPS from 12
  • amp it up (ally) = 36.4 for 3 seconds from 52
  • amp it up (self) = 28 HPS for 3 seconds from 40

I’m not really a fan of these. These healing numbers seem too low since OW 2 is already a damage fiesta and this would make it even more of a respawn simulator. Keep in mind devs initially nerfed healing in the first internal tests and later reverted them (and those nerfs weren’t as harsh as these!)

You would probably be even more focused on healing than before in order to offset the shortage of healing — or abandon healing altogether and basically be a 3rd or 4th DPS in the team.

I’d play a different game if I wanted to experience that tbh.

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